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Turret

Forum Fanatic
Jun 23, 2017
4,217
7,208
Never had the option to sleep with Felicia after the photoshoot
Then you are either not on the Feli path or you chose a "wrong" decision during the photoshot. Because if you are on good terms with Felicia, you can have a roll in the hay with her after the shot in the office.
 
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underoath27

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2020
1,554
1,270
I started to play it, and I have some questions: Was MC's mom a porn actress ehen he was a kid? And if yes, will be there flashbacks from that time? And is there any sexual content between MC and his friend's girlfriend (Mina, I guess)? So far, she is my favorite one...
 

Idontplay

Well-Known Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,275
1,772
I started to play it, and I have some questions: Was MC's mom a porn actress ehen he was a kid? And if yes, will be there flashbacks from that time? And is there any sexual content between MC and his friend's girlfriend (Mina, I guess)? So far, she is my favorite one...
More or less the answers are yes, yes and yes.
 
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Ranting Old Man

Member
Donor
Oct 24, 2019
409
916
I started to play it, and I have some questions: Was MC's mom a porn actress ehen he was a kid? And if yes, will be there flashbacks from that time?
Theory ahead, possibly a spoiler? Proceed at your own risk.


So I'm going to give my Theory about some of this. You see, even back in the 80s porn actresses ever never really payed that well and even today most don't make a ton of money especially if they are working with a studio. It's one of the main reasons there is a war against only fans. The people with money aren't actually interested in sharing the weath. So how this relates to the Story is, as far as we know currently, MC'S mother was only ever in 1 porno video ever. Now we know that killian has only ever missed one of the carnation events. I theorize that MC'S mother didn't make a porno. Especially with the way Chuck was talking to Kathleen. My thoughts are she found out about. The carnation events at some point through her connections to Chucks family through her son's friendship with Killian. What I believe happened is that after her husband's death she competed for the money to take care of her son and won. Killian respects her alot so either he refused to witness the events with Victoria or he was barred from Watching by Chuck. This would explain why Cathleen is so obsessed with the MCs relationship with his mother and why she is so hell bent on pushing him to recreate those events with Rose, it also explains why Chuck decided to finally warn her not to go to far. I believe that her one porn video was a challenge simular to Rose's challenge, a way to embaress her in the future. I'm willing to bet that Cathleen is also partly responsible for the MC finding out about the video to begin with. Simply put. She's a monster of a woman.
 

underoath27

Well-Known Member
Nov 22, 2020
1,554
1,270
Theory ahead, possibly a spoiler? Proceed at your own risk.


So I'm going to give my Theory about some of this. You see, even back in the 80s porn actresses ever never really payed that well and even today most don't make a ton of money especially if they are working with a studio. It's one of the main reasons there is a war against only fans. The people with money aren't actually interested in sharing the weath. So how this relates to the Story is, as far as we know currently, MC'S mother was only ever in 1 porno video ever. Now we know that killian has only ever missed one of the carnation events. I theorize that MC'S mother didn't make a porno. Especially with the way Chuck was talking to Kathleen. My thoughts are she found out about. The carnation events at some point through her connections to Chucks family through her son's friendship with Killian. What I believe happened is that after her husband's death she competed for the money to take care of her son and won. Killian respects her alot so either he refused to witness the events with Victoria or he was barred from Watching by Chuck. This would explain why Cathleen is so obsessed with the MCs relationship with his mother and why she is so hell bent on pushing him to recreate those events with Rose, it also explains why Chuck decided to finally warn her not to go to far. I believe that her one porn video was a challenge simular to Rose's challenge, a way to embaress her in the future. I'm willing to bet that Cathleen is also partly responsible for the MC finding out about the video to begin with. Simply put. She's a monster of a woman.
Hmmm, got it. Well, I'm not a fan about that kind of content, but I guess I'll give this one try. Thank you!
 

Cricco

Member
May 5, 2021
184
586
Theory ahead, possibly a spoiler? Proceed at your own risk.


So I'm going to give my Theory about some of this. You see, even back in the 80s porn actresses ever never really payed that well and even today most don't make a ton of money especially if they are working with a studio. It's one of the main reasons there is a war against only fans. The people with money aren't actually interested in sharing the weath. So how this relates to the Story is, as far as we know currently, MC'S mother was only ever in 1 porno video ever. Now we know that killian has only ever missed one of the carnation events. I theorize that MC'S mother didn't make a porno. Especially with the way Chuck was talking to Kathleen. My thoughts are she found out about. The carnation events at some point through her connections to Chucks family through her son's friendship with Killian. What I believe happened is that after her husband's death she competed for the money to take care of her son and won. Killian respects her alot so either he refused to witness the events with Victoria or he was barred from Watching by Chuck. This would explain why Cathleen is so obsessed with the MCs relationship with his mother and why she is so hell bent on pushing him to recreate those events with Rose, it also explains why Chuck decided to finally warn her not to go to far. I believe that her one porn video was a challenge simular to Rose's challenge, a way to embaress her in the future. I'm willing to bet that Cathleen is also partly responsible for the MC finding out about the video to begin with. Simply put. She's a monster of a woman.
Edwyn flashbacks to a different video of Victoria's during Rose's latest exhibition so she definetely was in more than one porn. I do believe she has something to do with the club though, or at the very least that she knows more than she lets on. Her 'what did you get yourself into' to Edwyn at the end of last update certainly seems to point there.
 

Daken9

Active Member
Apr 28, 2017
658
4,795
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I'd say MC is Dexter, while Kathleen is the villain of the week who ends up in the bodybag :KEK:

They both read like sociopaths, with their distinct lack of empathy and social charmeleon ways, and i'd argue that read was all but confirmed in their most recent face-to-face, but i'd also say whereas Edwyn does have something of a moral compass and tries to actively fit in with people, Kat simply doesn't and really only keeps up the facade because she benefits from it. Again, Dexter v some random psycho.

Having said that he obviously does have the potential to turn out as bad as her, but it's up to the player really and i suspect shit gonna just way be evil for me to ever go down that road :KEK:
 

labmouseblues

Member
Dec 22, 2020
242
1,016
They both read like sociopaths, with their distinct lack of empathy and social charmeleon ways
Eh, they both seem to posses high levels of cognitive empathy.

Which is actually a sociopathic trait, as sociopath are generally very good at reading emotions, they just don't respond to them like normal people.

The MC does seem to have at least some level of affective empathy, depending on player choices, so I wouldn't call him a sociopath.
 

camube

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2022
1,352
1,228
I believe there are a few issues with your theory (I could be wrong however)

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Unless i forgot or misunderstood something these points really weaken the theory overall. I will put forward my own general idea of where some parts of the story may go so that I can get the same feedback

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No hate meant to you or your ideas I just enjoy this games story too much to not involve myself in discussions even if i know I shouldnt

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When did that hugging Mina
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scene happened? I either missed reading it during my playthrough, or not choose that option so it never happened in mine.

It's the same with taking Hana to the bed. Since I always chose that on my blind playthrough, I did not know staying in the sofa resulted in that dream.
 

Hargan2

Well-Known Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,197
1,392
I did notice this as well. I played through the game for the first time a few weeks before this update came out and it did feel like my MC was trending more towards embracing the club. I took all the dominant/"tough" options and while he still expressed reservations, it did really feel like he was starting to sink into the lifestyle. Then in the latest update the tone did seem to shift back a bit towards purity and selflessness. Not my best wording. More "empathy and kindness". This would make more sense if there was a scene where Edwin really reflected on his thoughts and actions and recoiled back from the darkness, not accepting what he was becoming and temporarily trying to be better until he inevitably falls back into that selfish desire to indulge his every whim. But without such a scene or event, the tonal shift does feel a bit out of place.
 
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RC-1138 Boss

Message Maven
Apr 26, 2017
13,496
20,291
Theory ahead, possibly a spoiler? Proceed at your own risk.


So I'm going to give my Theory about some of this. You see, even back in the 80s porn actresses ever never really payed that well and even today most don't make a ton of money especially if they are working with a studio.

It's one of the main reasons there is a war against only fans. The people with money aren't actually interested in sharing the weath. So how this relates to the Story is, as far as we know currently, MC'S mother was only ever in 1 porno video ever. Now we know that killian has only ever missed one of the carnation events.

I theorize that MC'S mother didn't make a porno. Especially with the way Chuck was talking to Kathleen. My thoughts are she found out about. The carnation events at some point through her connections to Chucks family through her son's friendship with Killian. What I believe happened is that after her husband's death she competed for the money to take care of her son and won. Killian respects her alot so either he refused to witness the events with Victoria or he was barred from Watching by Chuck.


This would explain why Cathleen is so obsessed with the MCs relationship with his mother and why she is so hell bent on pushing him to recreate those events with Rose, it also explains why Chuck decided to finally warn her not to go to far. I believe that her one porn video was a challenge simular to Rose's challenge, a way to embaress her in the future.

I'm willing to bet that Cathleen is also partly responsible for the MC finding out about the video to begin with. Simply put. She's a monster of a woman.
First, isn't there more than one flashback scene of Victoria? Maybe my memory is playing tricks (need to replay) but i think she did more than one hardcore sex video during her time as "pornstar" ( quotation marks because she was very likely being explored, like you mentioned about the sex work industry). :unsure: :unsure:

Second, Ian is the same age as Edwin (21 years old) and he only started working at the Carnation Club when he turned 18 and received a invitation from Chuck. This is only three years prior to the events of the game and we know from Edwin himself that his mother worked with porn when he was a child. So there is not enough time for Ian to have met Victoria when she was working with sex.

Third, while i do believe Victoria encountered Chuck when doing sex work i don't think her distaste for him would be so mild if she had participated in one of the carnation events. I bet he likely transited through the more darker and exploiter sides of the sex industry world before becoming one of the owners of the Carnation Club and that is how they both met.

Fourth, Katheleen is a sadist (maybe even a sociopath). The idea that the son of a lone mom who used to do porn videos to raise her kid is having to make a sex video with another woman who is also a lone mother in a similar situation is likely her idea of a Christmas present to herself. :devilish::LOL::LOL:
Knowing her Chuck was likely making sure she keep her more devilish side in check.

Also didn't Kathleen pretty much implied the video wouldn't see daylight? Considering the secrecy around the club it would be pretty risky to let a video made inside of it to hit the internet.
 

TD1900

#701
Game Developer
Dec 8, 2017
791
7,435
It seems to me that Pale Carnations is maybe heading towards a problem (would be interested to hear from TD1900 about this):

Depending on how you play, the MC was at least sometimes dominant/enjoyed-to-humiliate/sadist, while if you choose differently he was more of a friend/worshipper/simp/whiteknight.

Especially in the free-roam event of this update it felt like a contradiction to hear MC's inner monologue, where he seems to be clearly on the side of the prostitutes/girls, when the way you played, his inner monologue was very different/darker in some scenes (TD lets Dalia even mention this in the sauna scene).

Now TD1900 not being able to write 2 completely different game paths regarding MC's personality/inner monologue, and some cringing at the whiteknighting and others being disgusted by treating the girls badly, but both clearly being a possible personality in scenes/paths and seemingly will be in future updates - will you try to merge these two mindsets in the MC (or solve them since it's part of the story), or will he go in one of these directions over time? And if so would you be willing to say which one that would be?
I don't think Edwin being sympathetic toward the club's prostitutes is inconsistent with his characterization so far, but I wrote it, so I suppose I wouldn't. :p He has always been portrayed as having qualms with the exploitative nature of the club from a logical/mental standpoint, but on a sensual level he becomes a hypocrite. The social mores ingrained in him are at odds with what he innately finds gratifying. Walking around, he'll think what most people would think, but he'll find having a flogger in his hand stimulating. There's supposed to be some push and pull in that regard, with some overcompensating, but it might not come across like that. If it doesn't, then it's either a failure of my writing or a mismatch of the perspectives we're bringing to the table.

To answer your question though, Edwin can't straddle the line forever. Eventually he'll have his critical moment and he'll need to start progressing toward the game's two main end states: getting his mentality in order and staying at the club or wanting to leave and dealing with any complications related to that.
 

camube

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2022
1,352
1,228
I don't think Edwin being sympathetic toward the club's prostitutes is inconsistent with his characterization so far, but I wrote it, so I suppose I wouldn't. :p He has always been portrayed as having qualms with the exploitative nature of the club from a logical/mental standpoint, but on a sensual level he becomes a hypocrite. The social mores ingrained in him are at odds with what he innately finds gratifying. Walking around, he'll think what most people would think, but he'll find having a flogger in his hand stimulating. There's supposed to be some push and pull in that regard, with some overcompensating, but it might not come across like that. If it doesn't, then it's either a failure of my writing or a mismatch of the perspectives we're bringing to the table.

To answer your question though, Edwin can't straddle the line forever. Eventually he'll have his critical moment and he'll need to start progressing toward the game's two main end states: getting his mentality in order and staying at the club or wanting to leave and dealing with any complications related to that.
This game is taxing to read. Really big kudos to the devs for making the writing really engaging to read.

Really looking forward to the continuation.

How far are we from the ending by the way? Are we already at halfway point? Or is the game would still roughly take another 3 years to complete?

I need to mentally perepare myself to be patient if we aren't even 25% point yet.
 

camube

Well-Known Member
Jun 4, 2022
1,352
1,228
I did notice this as well. I played through the game for the first time a few weeks before this update came out and it did feel like my MC was trending more towards embracing the club. I took all the dominant/"tough" options and while he still expressed reservations, it did really feel like he was starting to sink into the lifestyle. Then in the latest update the tone did seem to shift back a bit towards purity and selflessness. Not my best wording. More "empathy and kindness". This would make more sense if there was a scene where Edwin really reflected on his thoughts and actions and recoiled back from the darkness, not accepting what he was becoming and temporarily trying to be better until he inevitably falls back into that selfish desire to indulge his every whim. But without such a scene or event, the tonal shift does feel a bit out of place.
What's the difference between High Toughness and Low Toughness MC? Is it different mostly internal monologues or does the dialogues MC is having with other characters changes too?
 
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