Machete

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I think that as of now from the main girls only Hana and Mina can be called actual love interests. Maybe Felicia can also be considered one given the dinner date and her proposal to the MC but I dont think we are quite there yet. The MC is just another club staff member for the carnations (except for Felicia).
As i first started to hang in this game's forum i expressed energic concernes about the age of the LIs. I myself, despite i try to respect everyone's kink, i can't help but to feel contempt for the concept of a mommy boy MC who want to bang her mother apparently because women after their 30's develope severe cases of macromastia as if it was some kind of tumor. Really i'm not comfortable with this in the slightest.

Now, this game, at least, has very good reason to have women more on their mature side as carnation, and even if Rosalind is clearly there to pander to mommy issues, it's just one of the elements of the game, not the core of it. So i'm now totally on board of the masterly written story.

But i agree with you. I can't see the MC in a lasting relationship with any of the LIs, apart from Hana or Mina. What MC is supposed to be otherwise? Felicia's boy toy? Katherine's personal carpet? Rosalind's daugher's adoptive father?
Not very appealling at least to me.

Unless devs are cooking something really different of those endings where you pick your waifu. It might be more about what kind of man MC will be after getting through the club's debaucery.
 
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Turret

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I think that as of now from the main girls only Hana and Mina can be called actual love interests. Maybe Felicia can also be considered one given the dinner date and her proposal to the MC but I dont think we are quite there yet. The MC is just another club staff member for the carnations (except for Felicia).
At the current stand in the game I agree mostly with you on this. Hana and Mina (even if I am less inclined to hit on a buddies girlfriend) are the main possible girlfriends/wives for the end of the game. Felicia is practically there as well, not quite as much but nearly so, considering that there is not only the sugar momma proposal, but you can decide to go with her to the art exhibition freely. And you had other dates (in the widest sense) before.
Next is Rosalind with some distance behind the three. Their relationship is currently more about helping Rosi and Momma issues of Edwin, but there is sympathy which can develop durther. Veronica and Kath are behind those 4 by a margin IMO. At the moment Veronica´s relationship with Edwin is friendship the most. She is focused too much on saving her Gym and is mainly playing "for the other team";), so a real romance has a way to go to happen at all. Kath is a true sadist and while for some that is really great, it is definitely NOT my cup of tea.
As i first started to hang in this game's forum i expressed energic concernes about the age of the LIs. I myself, despite i try to respect everyone's kink, i can't help but to feel contempt for the concept of a mommy boy MC who want to bang her mother apparently because women after their 30's develope severe cases of macromastia as if it was some kind of tumor. Really i'm not comfortable with this in the slightest.
Now, this game, at least, has very good reason to have women more on their mature side as carnation, and even if Rosalind is clearly there to pander to mommy issues, it's just one of the elements of the game, not the core of it. So i'm now totally on board of the masterly written story.
But i agree with you. I can't see the MC in a lasting relationship with any of the LIs, apart from Hana or Mina. What MC is supposed to be otherwise? Felicia's boy toy? Katherine's personal carpet? Rosalind's daugher's adoptive father?
Not very appealling at least to me.
Unless devs are cooking something really different of those endings where you pick your waifu. It might be more about what kind of man MC will be after getting through the club's debaucery.
As I wrote above, with Felicia there is more possible than just being a boy toy. But I think you are onto somthing with your comment about what kind of man Edwin will be after the events at the club. That will have a big influence on who he/we as players chose as wife and what trajetory their relationship will take.
 
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shaq9

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Similar to others, this game made me question how I felt about a lot of things that I thought were cut and dry. For example, how do you guys feel about prostituting while pregnant? If you asked me before playing this game, I'd easily say it's disgusting, but now I'm interested in both sides of the situation. What do you guys think? And please, keep it civil for the love of Bob.
 
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Idk if I'd say it's disgusting, but if I was Yoori I'd probably give the club an ultimatum, if you keep Warren around you lose me. Or maybe just nope the fuck out. No amount of money is worth losing the baby if Warren of Samson get too rough. Warren beat the shit out of Emma's stomach specifically too. Just not worth it at all imo.

That actually makes me wonder, what mechanism does the club have to defend against disgruntled employees who threaten to blow the whole operation open? Like I bet if they tried to kick Warren out he would try to sabotage everything. I wonder if that's what Darius did and they had to make him disappear?
 

Machete

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That actually makes me wonder, what mechanism does the club have to defend against disgruntled employees who threaten to blow the whole operation open?
They kill em? August is a big king pin after all. Sure he has hands in and connection with other significant crime cartels.
 

selberdreher

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That actually makes me wonder, what mechanism does the club have to defend against disgruntled employees who threaten to blow the whole operation open?
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But i agree, loosing a disgruntled Warren would pose a major security problem. So they need to make sure, that Warrens benefits outweighs his potential gains from leaving the club. I think that's part of the reason, why Warren enjoys so much freedom inside the club, and gets usually away with his behaviour. Also i am pretty sure they have a decent amount of dirt on him, and he knows that; the owners and Warren have each other at their throats and this 'mutual assured destruction' ensures his loyalty.

For the other employees there is also the question to whom they will turn for help, because
However the most valuable client would be the chief of the LOCAL POLICE. Since Chuck, Auggie and Kat can keep the Federals out of their business, if they aren't dumb, and -spoiler- they are not, it all comes down to state laws they are breaking.
State Police in the USA, commonly known as 'Highway Patrol', are concerned mainly with traffic supervision on the interstates and highways and to a lesser degree involved in protecting the governor, the states parliament, training and qualification of police officers and supporting local polices should the need arise.
This means battling actual crime is left in the hands of the local police departments. Perhaps you can see now, how invaluable it is to pocket the chief of the local police. If they avoid to bribe him directly to -lets say- unlawfully incarcerate an US citizen, again the FBI should be out of the picture.
They can perhaps turn towards the media, but with what? They need to gather extensive evidence, which isn't easy when you're wearing next to nothing as a work uniform. And the media can not assure their security from the rougher instruments in the owners tool kit.
 
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Turret

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The FBI - Could say that the upscale highly illegal sex club is also engaged in human trafficking and with the introduction of August's associates they very well might be

The ATF (Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms) - They would just say there is a very likely illegal (and modified? IIRC) firearm on the premises and I really doubt they are fully licensed up for Hana to be serving drinks

The DEA - All the person reporting would have to do is say they see cocaine/pill use/distribution, we as readers see 1 confirmed time that someone uses technically illegal drugs when Hana and Jacob are smoking weed after Veronica makes Kathleen cum on stage (IIRC) So we know the club does not have any hard rules against drugs. There is also the very illegal drug kathleen/the doctor/Sophie are making which does not fall under the purview of the DEA but they would still be interested to hear in a drug production facility.

Just off the top of my head and there is already 3 federal (above what the local chief of police) law enforcement agencies that would be at least partially interested in the club. As far as evidence goes you are wrong that they (the person working there) needs extensive evidence all they would need is enough to get a single member of any of those agencies into the building the club is in. It looks normal (but strangely unused) until you get the floor where there is randomly a well dressed (or tank top wearing) guard is standing guarding a random staircase in an abandoned building on a weekend night.... from that point if they dont let them up its obviously suspicious and if they do well then the law enforcement is in the club haha. Even if you want to assume they would not send a single agent to check out a potential lead all they would have to do is monitor the club over a weekend to see that congressmen, foreign diplomats, paramilitary leaders, world renown doctors, the chief of police, and large criminal cartel leaders are all hanging out in the same place....


Edit: If you meant they need evidence to turn towards the media you must not be familiar with the 24 hour news cycle :KEK:
You make some good points, but I think you could scratch the ATF. Pale Carnations plays over the pond, where legal gun possession is mega-easy and the Club has connections to mercenaries and even official armament firms. No chance that they have lacking licences or excempts for the guns. Likewise the alcohol. It would be an amateur mistake to not have a good alcoholica licence. August is mainly there to keep the day-to-day stuff running and he does not make the impression of being unaware of this.
 
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Turret

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IIRC we still dont know 100% if he was disappeared or if he successfully blackmailed just Kathleen and was able to get away because she did not share what happened with the other owners. I personally think that Kathleen was blackmailed and Darius got away (at least for some time). Her being blackmailed explains why Chuck does not (or seemingly) does not know that it happened, or at least explains why Chuck would let the revelation that Kathleen killed/kidnapped/whatever the last person to hold his job to blindside Edwin. Kathleen has shown several reasons why she would keep something serious like this from the other owners the main one being the owners are currently involved in a power struggle and her admitting to being blackmailed would severely hurt her chances against the others. Another large possible reason is that Kathleen has already expressed anger/resentment about the fact that she cant fully indulge in the club due to her being a woman, with her feeling that if she really enjoys herself everyone would view her as just another whore. While in game this is directly related to the customers it makes sense that she would think any club related things (in this case being blackmailed) are due to her being a woman.

With all that said if someone like warren was kicked out he would 100% be killed or otherwise silenced. Chuck has connections to people like Kristoff (PMC Leader) so if Chuck wanted he would likely be able to call in a favor/pay for some mercs that work for Kristoff. August has already been heavily heavily implied to have killed/ had someone killed/silenced during the course of the game (if he allow him to solve Rose's debt collection issue). IIRC after you bring the issue up to him and he helps you the next time you see Rose she mentions that she has not heard from from the collector or the group he works for at all. Even if you want to ignore that he is associates with organized crime leaders(?) that are willing to burn a subordinates tongue in a "public" place. All in all if all the owners knew someone was getting out or they all agreed someone needed to be forced out that person would have no chance of getting away (especially if they are as smart as Warren).

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Yes, we don't know for sure what happened.
Concerning Darius: I agree with Simpgor , that Darius successfully blackmailed Kath and got away with it. Because I think it was the first time someone did so and blindsided the leadership/or just Kath. I think this blackmail is one of the reasons Kath is so eager to start a power struggle and did so many backroom deals. She wants full control of the club.
That Chuck is so sure that Darius will not come back and get the rest of his belongings, even if he does not know the full details, is no surprise. If Darius and his girl have any kind of survival instinct, they will keep the hell away from the Club.

I am not sure if the implication that August let Rosi´s blackmailers getting killed is correct. August definitely has contacts into the higher echolons of the criminal underbelly (Otto is one example). If one of those guys tells "just Oliver" and Co. to keep their hands of Rosi, that will be followed, if Oliver knews what is good for him. When this talk about Rosi between Edwin and August happened, I imagined a certain Nino Rota song playing in the background. August does not need to get the blackmailers killed. "Making them an offer they cannot refuse" should be enough. Unless Oliver and Co. are idiots, then they really would walk the plank.
 

Turret

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Looking further into it you dont need a license to have a shotgun in Maryland so the firearm stuff can be dropped. However how does August go about getting a license to serve alcohol? you need to include financials in order to get a liquor license so that means some business would have to be on record at that location (August would not put illegal sex club on the application). Even if they paid off whoever to get the license itself they would not have paid off ATF if they look into it. If you want to assume they did it legit and have some sort of "mens lounge" business as cover on the books then we get into August having to report how much money is being made or more accurately him having to lie to the IRS about his/the businesses taxes
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I think there are valid arguments for him either getting one or not but either way its a way for law enforcement to potentially get involved (even without Edwin)
I think the Club has a legit cover. It takes up much space in the building it is located in, is quite lavishly equipped, that is something you cannot hide too well. Not to speak of the consumption of electricity or water. Neither one of the leadership makes the impression of being dumb and covering the bases legally as far as you can, is simply good business practice.

That the books are cooked and likely being used for money laundering too, is on another piece of paper.
 

selberdreher

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The FBI - Could say that the upscale highly illegal sex club is also engaged in human trafficking and with the introduction of August's associates they very well might be
The human trafficking part is outsourced to Augusts' business partners. And if they stay within the states borders, there is no human trafficking at all.
The ATF (Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms) - They would just say there is a very likely illegal (and modified? IIRC) firearm on the premises and I really doubt they are fully licensed up for Hana to be serving drinks
I am not that familiar with the various gun laws in the US, but quoted from Wikipedia
"ATFs responsibilities include the investigation and prevention of federal offenses involving the unlawful use, manufacture, and possession of firearms and explosives (...) The ATF also regulates via licensing the sale, possession, and transportation of firearms, ammunition, and explosives in interstate commerce." Sounds to me as they need to violate federal laws to get the ATF involved.

As for Hana, again Wikipedia:
" Alcohol laws of Maryland vary considerably by county, due to the wide latitude of home rule granted to Maryland counties.
It is illegal under state law for a person under the age of 21 to possess or consume an alcoholic beverage, but the law contains several exceptions:
  • Underage individuals who are employees of businesses that hold a valid state-issued liquor license may possess (but not consume) alcohol in the course of their job during regular business hours. Common examples are serving alcoholic drinks to customers of a restaurant, making deliveries for a catering company, and stocking shelves at a store that sells alcohol.
A person must be at least 21 years old to be employed to serve alcoholic beverages or sell alcoholic beverages, although some counties have different laws. A person must be at least 18 years old to work in another capacity at an establishment that serves alcohol."

Hana is 22 years old, and why the club should not hold a valid state-issued liquor license is beyond me, that would be dumb, afterall it's just a Gentleman's Lounge?
The DEA - All the person reporting would have to do is say they see cocaine/pill use/distribution
"The Drug Enforcement Administration tasked with combating drug trafficking and distribution within the U.S.
It is the lead agency for domestic enforcement of the Controlled Substances Act under which the manufacture, importation, possession, use, and distribution is regulated.
The DEA has sole responsibility for coordinating and pursuing U.S. drug investigations both domestically and abroad, sharing concurrent jurisdiction with the FBI, the U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement, and U.S. Customs and Border Protection.
(...)
The DEA is also criticized for focusing on the operations from which it can seize the most money. etc."
Also
"Trafficking Charges
Both federal and state laws come into play on drug trafficking cases. If a person is caught trafficking a controlled substance across state lines, federal law will apply, but if the drug trafficking is entirely within one state, that state's laws will apply."

While the DEA may be technically in charge, and therefore poses a real threat, those excerpts look like that they are usually interested in bigger operations, have bigger fish to fry, than to investigate rather small scale use, possession and distribution of drugs, especially -again- if no state border crossing is involved. Those are rather left to the local police.
How often busts the DEA a random dance club for party drugs, if they have no evidence of a larger scale operation there?

There is also the very illegal drug kathleen/the doctor/Sophie are making
But none of the employees knows of this, except Warren. As for the known use of the precursor: it's more likely an issue for the FDA than the DEA, since it has not found its way into the schedules of the CSA yet. A drug becomes illegal, if it's mentioned in the CSA, not before, and the base substance from which it derivated was legally researched by van Dorens company.
As far as evidence goes you are wrong that they (the person working there) needs extensive evidence all they would need is enough to get a single member of any of those agencies into the building the club is in.
So you assume the club has not a cam at the front door which opens only after the visitors are confirmed? Sorry, i live in inexpensive appartment house, and we have that security. Same for the elevator, which is likely locked until access is granted. There is no way just anybody can walk around freely in that building, else the clubs security isn't worth a penny.
Even if you want to assume they would not send a single agent to check out a potential lead all they would have to do is monitor the club over a weekend to see that congressmen, foreign diplomats, paramilitary leaders, world renown doctors, the chief of police, and large criminal cartel leaders are all hanging out in the same place....
If i were in charge of a federal operation including several agents and had to answer to my superior for the accumulated cost of a weekend long observation of a premise, including the underground garage, which is used by every guest who is not a pedestrian, based on what?
The accusation that this gentlemans club is in reality a brothel, where occasionally drugs are used? That there may be or not a modified gun? That there may work or not a prostitute from Virginia? By an alleged prostitute who is working there? So i can charge, if no drugs or other relevant evidence is found, a handfull of celebrities and politicians with prostitution, which is no federal crime?

That sounds like alot of headache and overtime for a very dubious outcome. If i was with the ATF this outlaw motorcycle club who is dealing in arms with the IRA in Charming, CA would be much more interesting. Same with every other federal agency.

I don't say it's not possible, but i would expect a former employee needs a bit more than that to get the federals interested.
 
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selberdreher

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I am not sure if the implication that August let Rosi´s blackmailers getting killed is correct. August definitely has contacts into the higher echolons of the criminal underbelly (Otto is one example). If one of those guys tells "just Oliver" and Co. to keep their hands of Rosi, that will be followed, if Oliver knews what is good for him. When this talk about Rosi between Edwin and August happened, I imagined a certain Nino Rota song playing in the background. August does not need to get the blackmailers killed. "Making them an offer they cannot refuse" should be enough. Unless Oliver and Co. are idiots, then they really would walk the plank.
Yes, killing her loan shark sounds a bit too much, threatening them should suffice.

Not so sure about the first paragraph of your post, though.
 
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But i agree, loosing a disgruntled Warren would pose a major security problem. So they need to make sure, that Warrens benefits outweighs his potential gains from leaving the club. I think that's part of the reason, why Warren enjoys so much freedom inside the club, and gets usually away with his behaviour. Also i am pretty sure they have a decent amount of dirt on him, and he knows that; the owners and Warren have each other at their throats and this 'mutual assured destruction' ensures his loyalty.
You are giving him way too much credit. I doubt warren can do anything to people like august or chuck. The reason he gets away with what he does is simply because they do not care if he abuses a house girl. Its not because he has any power over them. August would care only if it impacted the club's profits and I think Chuck is just indifferent.

Warren immediately backs off when Dalia threatened him by telling him she would inform August about his behavior affecting the club's profits. When we ask Chuck to give Emma the day off, his first question is why do we care about some whore meaning that he is indifferent to what happens to them.
 
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Turret

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Another possible complication for the business being "legit" is who all would be an employee? Just Hana? Hana and Jacob/Warren? Unless I missed that detail Edwin is not a member of this legit front facing business because he is not getting a paycheck?
Where I live prostitution is legal, so that would not be a problem naming the job, but even in the US that is not so difficult. A "Club" this large needs service personal, cleaners, handymans, security, dancers, massage specialists, cooks, whatever, even exotic jobs can be partly used as cover occupations. That would hardly be a big complication.
 
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