VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[Mark17]

I'm once again asking for the Android version of the Game.

 

[Bill Temple]

I'm once again asking for the Android version of the Game.

View attachment 3497867

scroll up three posts, about an hour and a half ago.

 

[Ungawa]

Seem like you misunderstood me there. I wrote that I tend to believe that fel did not prostitute herself, but took advantage of naive men in her small town when she realized her female charms, and that the same happened with her "online" friend who paid her college rent. "Milk the simps and friendzone them" would be my guess, but maybe she also slept with them - who knows. Did not mean that elias is one of those naive men.

I cannot stress this enough... The story is that Felicia used her sexy looks and intellect to get somewhere. Look, let's just break this down for some of the other girls for comparison's sake:

Rosalind stayed in a bad marriage, even got into fights with her husband as he saddled her with debt.

Veronica made a choice to put everything into her gym and sacrificed her marriage for it.

I'm literally taking Felicia at her word here but I don't know where it's a bunch of naive men here. We don't know the people of her podunk town, we just know her feelings on that place. It's okay for her mom but not for her. That doesn't make the people there naive. How SHE views it, they wanted her sexually and she was smart enough to realize what they were doing and move away from that as she got older. THAT'S what she's saying.

Same thing with the college friend. I don't know if it's the older college friend, a fraternity brother, August, her mom playing tricks, the dog down the street or anything else. I can't make the connection that that's a sugardaddy or anything else. Maybe it's a college BF she jerked around. I simply don't have enough information because Felicia didn't offer that part. I simply can't put in something that the story does not offer. That's all I'm saying here. With no information about what's going on with that, I can't use that to suggest what's her history. That's entirely speculation and doesn't serve to understand her character at all.

Like a wrote in another post: The problem is not so much felicias cheating in a loveless marriage or her want for own money. Its this:

Elias provides felicia the wealthy life, but he denied her one important wish.

Felicia absolutely obliterates elias reputation where it matters most for him - his peers.

I'm using this as kind of the basis for that entire quote. I'm kind of narrowing this down and the part above is about naïve men. This one's more or less about their marriage. It is of convenience. The point here is that in high society, you have status and reputation through the success of the business. What I dealt with before is that Felicia is much more capable than a title really allows.

The marriage takes two. And Elias as a character is found lacking in a lot of ways. Through the interview, you have to pay attention to his actions. Not his words, his actions. For all intents, he cares more about how he's perceived by getting out of the rail business, starting a travel agency, pretending he cares about growing the talent (He basically looks the other way until he HAS to take notice and lets them suffer or succeed with little on how to really grow or expand), and focused on projects for rep instead of projects of substance.

They're not a team. They're not on the same page. That's well and truly clear. There could probably be something for both of them if Elias listened and learned and took Felicia's advice. He doesn't. He has his own agenda and interests. It just shows that they both have something going on that's going to have different conclusions. It's like in a K-drama, the king and queen, have different ways to influence events and they married out of convenience. The fallout will be felt far removed from their choices. So we're going to see how this is handled for both Elias and Felicia as their choices catch up to them.

I just don't see that as evil, just choices made on both their parts which will see a conclusion.

 

[Randomguy3478]

Maybe it's a college BF she jerked around.

That's what I mean with "taking advantage of naive men." Edwin called him a "sucker" and she replied that she thinks of him more fond of that, because he is the reason she's now a rich man's wife. That sounds to me like she used the college guy, not like she was in love or anything.

How SHE views it, they wanted her sexually and she was smart enough to realize what they were doing and move away from that as she got older. THAT'S what she's saying.

Disagree here. I think what she says means that she realized that she can use her female charms to get from men what she wants. The beginning of her becoming a gold-digger.

I'm using this as kind of the basis for that entire quote. I'm kind of narrowing this down and the part above is about naïve men. This one's more or less about their marriage. It is of convenience. The point here is that in high society, you have status and reputation through the success of the business. What I dealt with before is that Felicia is much more capable than a title really allows.

The marriage takes two. And Elias as a character is found lacking in a lot of ways. Through the interview, you have to pay attention to his actions. Not his words, his actions. For all intents, he cares more about how he's perceived by getting out of the rail business, starting a travel agency, pretending he cares about growing the talent (He basically looks the other way until he HAS to take notice and lets them suffer or succeed with little on how to really grow or expand), and focused on projects for rep instead of projects of substance.

They're not a team. They're not on the same page. That's well and truly clear. There could probably be something for both of them if Elias listened and learned and took Felicia's advice. He doesn't. He has his own agenda and interests. It just shows that they both have something going on that's going to have different conclusions. It's like in a K-drama, the king and queen, have different ways to influence events and they married out of convenience. The fallout will be felt far removed from their choices. So we're going to see how this is handled for both Elias and Felicia as their choices catch up to them.

I just don't see that as evil, just choices made on both their parts which will see a conclusion.

The difference is imo that felicia enjoys that her deeds hurt elias strongly (she says "any incidental damage to elias is a big, big, BIG bonus" in regards to her involvement with the club) and elias just didn't want to buy the school (felicia does not say that he did it to hurt her).

Also the scope of damage: Deny a wish <---> Destroy actively whats important to the person

Plus, everything she says is HER version of the story. HER truth. Who knows how elias sees everything, whats his version of these happenings.

(If it was not fiction.)


Anyway, thanks for the pleasant discussion.

 

[Hakkai]

Updated my android port.

Finaallyy, thank you

 

[Ungawa]

This'll be my final reply on this topic as I move on.

That's what I mean with "taking advantage of naive men." Edwin called him a "sucker" and she replied that she thinks of him more fond of that, because he is the reason she's now a rich man's wife. That sounds to me like she used the college guy, not like she was in love or anything.

Spoiler: Response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

I think what she says means that she realized that she can use her female charms to get from men what she wants. The beginning of her becoming a gold-digger.

Spoiler: response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

The difference is imo that felicia enjoys that her deeds hurt elias strongly (she says "any incidental damage to elias is a big, big, BIG bonus" in regards to her involvement with the club) and elias just didn't want to buy the school (felicia does not say that he did it to hurt her).

Spoiler: Response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[10203099]

我喜欢这个更新

 

[Turret]

Don't worry, you express yourself quite well. I just don't agree with your analysis.

Spoiler: Quick Thoughts

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Realistically, we'll have to wait until we have some solid info on Dr. Van Doren's motives to really sort this out.

That´s OK, as I said, our different viewpoints lead to a nice, lively discussion, unlike the Felicia bashing currently running in the thread. And I agree we need some more info on van Doren and Sophia Lundgren to truly find out their motives, but we have enough to do some reasonable guesses.

Spoiler: Some more answers

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Always nice to discuss with you.

Greetings again TD1900 !

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

 

[INno6280]

You can just download and extract the update (follow the instruction in the spoiler).
Or you can download the entire game, there is a compressed version.
Your saves should be compatible, anyway.

I see thanks for your reply, i was worried that downloading the game again would delete the saves I have

 

[Ottoeight]

Well, guys, I've updated and uploaded (check the OP) my Pale Carnations Story Timeline guide scene by scene.

So, as many of you already know, this last update covers Wednesday 17th June and it contains (according to my personal criteria - mind you, variants aren't counted):

15 mandatory scenes
21 optional scenes (happening only if/when making certain choices)

That's 36 scenes, which is a very very huge update.

Played the game the first time a few years ago and after catching up to the current release here are my thoughts:

Without a doubt the best game on this site. There is not much that's not written by others already. The characters, the graphics, the audio, the story. Platinum tier. The smut is unmatched. Surely the fathers of eroge would be proud. (My PP thanks!) The only real thing that feels a bit overlooked is how the content is structured. For players that are mostly interested in the more depraved club side of the game and not so much in the romance routes, the content seems to get less and less and sadly additionally largely centered around the saturday evening. In my main run where I play as a sadistic Edwin (and sadly missed Rosalind's route) there are almost no H-scenes in the more recent updates. It's not like I'm not interested in the main girls, but other than Rosalind's route, they are all centered around being a good Edwin and being opposed to the club and Kathleen. I would have really enjoyed routes with the main cast if they would reflect my Edwin more. I get of course that this would mean writing basically almost 2 routes for each carnation, but maybe there could be ways to splash in shorter events with the carnations/housegirls for evil Edwins like there was in the first week of the game, where he leveraged his position at the club a bit for personal advantage. Especially unfortunate is, that scenes like the Lucy scene of this update, or the toilet stall scene with the blue haired girl, which would fit perfectly for an asshole Edwin, are burried in the good-path romance content of the game where the applicable players won't see them. And those who do will likely prefer Veronica's scene in that instance, for example. I feel small changes to this structure would make the game more satisfying for both audiences. That said, the good-Edwin scenes are really lovely as well.

Did you go for the full deal with Rosalind? I think the full deal fits in with the sadistic Edwin.

 

[Randomguy3478]

This'll be my final reply on this topic as I move on.

Spoiler: Response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Spoiler: response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Spoiler: Response

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

Seems like we cannot even understand eachothers thought processes.

No problem though, its been friendly. <3

That´s OK, as I said, our different viewpoints lead to a nice, lively discussion, unlike the Felicia bashing currently running in the thread.

As they are fictional characters its ok to be very harsh on them as long as the discussion is friendly. Thats the benefit of discussing fictional characters - no one gets hurt by it.

People have difficulties staying friendly when other's views are too radical or too far away from their own - me included.

 

[dolfe67]

Did you go for the full deal with Rosalind? I think the full deal fits in with the sadistic Edwin.

I think you have to apologize to Rosalind after you fucked her the first time to enter that path, and generally evil players don't want to

 

[bluewolfzer]

Funny as shit

 

[Ass prefer]

Holy fucking shit I just finished update 4 and that revelation at the end had me gasping for air. Has to be one of the best plot-twists (if you can call it that) I've experienced in a few good years, in any media, and I mean it - I tried to get a comparison/analogy and couldn't think of a single one to say it reminded of a similar experience with a show, game or movie - it was AWESOME.

The way the

Spoiler: .

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

and then the shoe dropped. God damn,

You must be registered to see the links

, that hag is a fucking monster.

I didn't think I'd see anyone who played alpha omega, it's not a bad game, but it didn't take off.

 

[camube]

The marriage had 2 reasons:

- Respect and reputation for elias

- Wealthy life for felicia


Elias provides felicia the wealthy life, but he denied her one important wish.

Felicia absolutely obliterates elias reputation where it matters most for him - his peers.


So felicia not only destroys the one thing she provided in this marriage, but her actions bring elias' reputation lower than before he married her. It's the equivalent of elias first denying her wish, then divorcing her without giving her anything - and then robbing her of whatever money she had before meeting him.

Thats evil even in a marriage like theirs.



If she just had private sex I wouldn't care and consider it part of their marriage deal (if its true).

i like felicia the most out of all PC female characters and really, if you say Felicia obliterates Elias's wish, I could say the same with Elias dismissing Felicia's most important thing.

To her, the school is not just a school, it was her everything. It's still her everything, she became a patron of arts when she got rich. Whether or not it's Felicia's singular request to Elias, you can't deny your marriage partner's most sincere wish like that when Felicia herself said granting it wouldn't affect Elias's net worth.

Think of how small Felicia felt when that request was denied. Felicia know they were never equal but for him to just dismiss her that way, that's just wrong even if she's a trophy wife.

 

[rukoblud]

Is there a gallery unlocker?

 

[Randomguy3478]

i like felicia the most out of all PC female characters and really, if you say Felicia obliterates Elias's wish, I could say the same with Elias dismissing Felicia's most important thing.

To her, the school is not just a school, it was her everything. It's still her everything, she became a patron of arts when she got rich. Whether or not it's Felicia's singular request to Elias, you can't deny your marriage partner's most sincere wish like that when Felicia herself said granting it wouldn't affect Elias's net worth.

Think of how small Felicia felt when that request was denied. Felicia know they were never equal but for him to just dismiss her that way, that's just wrong even if she's a trophy wife.

I think I explained the diiference of those two actions already in the post you quoted:

So felicia not only destroys the one thing she provided in this marriage, but her actions bring elias' reputation lower than before he married her. It's the equivalent of elias first denying her wish, then divorcing her without giving her anything - and then robbing her of whatever money she had before meeting him.

Felicia seems like the vengeful wife who wants to get back at her husband for not getting what she wanted, even though the price of being a gold digger and consciously entering a marriage as a such is that your husband most likely does not love you, does not really care about you much as a person, but only cares about other things. Felicia never loved him, but married him for his money, and that surely showed in her behaviour as well - even though she does of course not tell us that. So its a bit strange to expect from elias to behave towards felicia like she would be the devoted and loving virgin wife of an honest marriage. She fucks around and that makes men cold hearted - no matter if there is an agreement or not. I think she should take accountability of her life choices and stop playing the innocent victim that got treated unjustly. She could have married a poor man that really loved her. But she chose to be a gold digger. And thats how elias treats her.

I feel like many here are rather biased. (Maybe I am as well.)

Don't forget that the game shows felicia in a sympathetic light while painting elias as a pathetic jerk. Plus us men usually having the tendency to side with the girl and villanize the guy in any given situation anyway.

Think of how small Felicia felt when that request was denied.

Apparently some men like that...

But again, I think there is a difference between "not caring" and "actively hurting." And I think from what is shown in the game that elias does the former and felicia the latter. Thats why I see felicia as the more evil of the two...

 

[dolfe67]

Plus us men usually having the tendency to side with the girl and villanize the guy in any given situation anyway.

It depends, did you side with Amber Heard and not Johnny Depp?

 

[Randomguy3478]

It depends, did you side with Amber Heard and not Johnny Depp?

Just think of how much "shit it took" for that to happen...

lel

 

[Federok88]

Felicia seems like the vengeful wife who wants to get back at her husband for not getting what she wanted, even though the price of being a gold digger and consciously entering a marriage as a such is that your husband most likely does not love you, does not really care about you much as a person, but only cares about other things. Felicia never loved him, but married him for his money, and that surely showed in her behaviour as well - even though she does of course not tell us that. So its a bit strange to expect from elias to behave towards felicia like she would be the devoted and loving virgin wife of an honest marriage. She fucks around and that makes men cold hearted - no matter if there is an agreement or not. I think she should take accountability of her life choices and stop playing the innocent victim that got treated unjustly. She could have married a poor man that really loved her. But she chose to be a gold digger. And thats how elias treats her.

But Felicia didnt want him to cuddle with her and ease her worries like a loving would do, she wanted what she always expected from him....money and he refused for (until we learn his side of the events) aperently no good reason. I've seen people describe their marriages as a deal where both get something from each other, but paint Felicia as the one that broke the deal. I would argue that Elias broke it first when he showed that he could deny her whatever he wanted for whatever reason he wanted.

All the times Elias upheld his end of the deal were insignificant to the one time he didnt, that was the one time it mattered the most to her.
He made Felicia realise that the conditions of their agreement were no longer on her best interest nor the best she could do, so she did what any ambitious goldigger would do in that situation and searched for a better oportunity.

Be it for love, looks or money, every relationship needs a minimum of respect or resentment will build up until it becomes hatred. If Felicia was loyal but would disrepect him and tried to made him misserable at every turn that would not be something he would like that much, despite still having exclusive acces to beautiful inteligent woman, and might re-consider their agreement.

Felicia is no saint and Elias probably is no the devil but based what we know and have seen about their relationship, i have no reason to feel any kind of sympathy for him. You want a loyal whore? pay the freaking whore, otherwise you might find youself being the joke of the town.

Plus us men usually having the tendency to side with the girl and villanize the guy in any given situation anyway

I think this bias goes both ways, because there is also a tendecy to overcompensate by dismissing any support towards a girl as simping or , in the case of game and anime, waifu loving fanboyism. The best example in my mind is when Fire Emble: Three Houses was released and any fan of Edelgard would be labeled a waifuloving nazi no matter how many essays they write explaining their reasoning. The funny thing about that example was that there are characters like Lelouch that are both male and more beloved than Edelgard despite being more radical, another example would be Askeladd from Vinland saga.