VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[Ciaran8023]

claiming to understand devs game better than they do (as well as the vast majority of readers) despite admitting to not reading past the first update

Who the fuck said anything about "understanding the game"?
Despite you being obviously passive aggressive, it would take someone with terminal brain damage to not recognize poorly veiled blackmail and a shitty attempt at femdom. I also now realize why you are under the impression that it doesn't exist.

You're not going to win any favours with anyone by acting like a child, but you do you buddy, gonna drop you on the ignore list since you're obviously not the type of person who will ever get within a fraction of understanding that opposing opinions isn't a personal attack and the devs (and mods) deserve better than having to deal with your bullshit. They don't get paid enough to do that.

 

[ffive]

Cool. Again, doesn't really mean much when you start out with the worst example of femdom and the type I generally despise as I'm someone who's actually into that shit.

Wait, your idea of "worst example of femdom" is a woman jacking a guy off?

Or is that "worst" as in, "the sort i like the least"? I admit i'm confused, is your actual complaint not that there's femdom per se, but that it's the kind you dislike and you want different sort of it, instead?

edit:

Kathleen is just a power-tripping thundercunt who stops at nothing to have her little puppets to play with, THAT is what I am vehemently against.

OK, so i'm afraid the bad news is that Kathleen isn't really a dominatrix in the classic sense you appear to be fan of, big on consent and all. She is a sadist who gets off on breaking people who never signed up for it. Or, as you put it, the power-tripping thundercunt.

She does get some comeuppance as the story goes on, but if you can't stand this sort of character --and i perfectly get why you'd feel this way-- then i'm afraid she isn't really avoidable.

 

[Simpgor]

Wait, your idea of "worst example of femdom" is a woman jacking a guy off?

Or is that "worst" as in, "the sort i like the least"? I admit i'm confused, is your actual complaint not that there's femdom per se, but that it's the kind you dislike and you want different sort of it, instead?

I think they kept saying "sub par" they meant that it was poorly done? Like Kathleen drugging and blackmailing(?) Edwin was a bad/weak example of the act of female domination? Since they seemed ok with the stuff kathleen was doing to girls up to that point, and how "colorful" their language is in relation to things they rather do it kind of comes off as "bad because it happened to me!" IMO

Either way its a weird take to drop a game they admit is good, have been told by multiple people that the scene in question is an outlier because of assumptions that are objectivity wrong like kathleens prevalence past the literal first update, or her standing in the club

 

[TD1900]

Cool. Again, doesn't really mean much when you start out with the worst example of femdom and the type I generally despise as I'm someone who's actually into that shit.

For the record, the femdom tag is there cause of all the lezdom. If you tried it on that basis, then there's an even better reason to be put off because in no way you'll be satisfied content-wise, questionable example or no.

 

[Birdnman993]

That's entirely fair. As I said, it's a shame as the rest of the game looks to be extremely solid in terms of basically everything that tends to matter in an AVN, but to each their own and I just couldn't vibe with it. If there's another game in the pipeline sometime then I'll be sure to check that out aswell, I might be put off entirely by this game but I can recognize skill as a dev when I see it.

That's very sad to hear but I understand, the game can be uncomfortable for some people.

Brother, I don't care about your projection, all I want is to not have to deal with such dogshit examples of femdom that's literally the opposite of femdom.
An integral part of femdom or any kinkplay is consent, Kathleen is just a power-tripping thundercunt who stops at nothing to have her little puppets to play with, THAT is what I am vehemently against. This is something you also would've understood if you actually read my post instead of knee-jerk reacting when someone dissed your favourite little thing.

That's precisely what I'm telling you: she's a total villain and she must be put down. Her pleasure is the suffering of others and not a give-and-take relationship, the most perverse version of a sadist, and the MC can become someone as sadistic as her or can try to look after the well-being of the participants, get to know them better and form a genuine friendship in the process.

 

[Fapparition]

Well, this didn't last long for me.
Been seeing this all over the place, hearing it being hyped up for literal years so I decided to give it a shot and.. let's just say that I'm so fucking allergic against Kathleen that I can't get past the initial part of the game, nor am I a fan of MC's getting played like a puppet on a string. Kind of wish that there was a notice for unavoidable sub-par blackmail femdom bullshit.

Ah, genuinely a shame. The models, renders and scene framing all look top notch and the writing (from what I saw) looked on par with the rest so I can see why this game is hyped, that's for sure. Just absolutely, unequivocally wasn't for me and I suppose I am glad that I got notified of that early on rather than halfway through the game, so there's that I suppose.

Oh boy, the moment I read the comment I knew what's going to unfold below. Don't bother guys, he's proficient at drawing questionable conclusions, fixating on them and successfully dragging people in different threads to 'debate' over them

 

[Ottoeight]

Yeah, you nailed it on that one. I will say that it's probably a good idea to put that at the start so people who aren't into getting blackmailed or non-consensual femdom can get out without sinking hours into a playthrough.

Bro, if she upset you, you should have chosen to cum on her face like I did. This is what that choice was for: "you damn bitch, is this is what you asked for? here you have it!"

Anyway, I wouldn't call it "femdom". Kathleen likes humiliating people. And this is what the Carnation Club is: it is NOT a fancy brothel where you fuck high class chicks while roleplaying, it is a brothel where you do degrade women as often as you wish.

And this is exactly Edwin's and the game's challenge: go down the rabbit hole and face the music and react. How will you react? try helping the girls? support Kath and Chuck and become a sadistic madman? will you help the house girls and the Carnations or just ignore what happens? support Ian and be his best buddy or tell him to get lost?

I feel that some players haven't realised how either collecting Ian bromance points or just ignoring Ian's friendship really makes your gameplay experience completely different, for instance. Same as with either pleasing Kathleen's sadistic drive or fight it makes the difference.

 

[Nulldev]

she's a total villain and she must be put down.

Wrong. She is the shining light that guides clueless MC to real awakening.
She is the Master and MC is the apprentice.

Peace is a lie. There is only Passion.
Through Passion, I gain Strength.
Through Strength, I gain Power.
Through Power, I gain Victory.
Through Victory my chains are Broken.
The Force shall free me.

 

[Ass prefer]

Wrong. She is the shining light that guides clueless MC to real awakening.
She is the Master and MC is the apprentice.

Peace is a lie. There is only Passion.
Through Passion, I gain Strength.
Through Strength, I gain Power.
Through Power, I gain Victory.
Through Victory my chains are Broken.
The Force shall free me.

"And when I'm lost
You search for me
And when I doubt
You're my belief "

 

[Biscardone]

Here's a lesson for life; when people dislike what you like, it isn't a personal attack on you, in fact no one actually cares at all so there's no need for you to defend or try to otherwise jump to personal attacks to begin with, shit's childish as fuck.

You'd be completely right... If not for the fact that you defined TD Kathleen's scenes as "sub-par blackmail femdom bullshit". Sub-par is by definition a merit judgment on TD's narrative ability, and bullshit is halfway there. As such, don't be surprised people can react negatively to it - even if you say that you think the game has good writing.
It's not a matter of "I don't like what the author likes", that's perfectly fine. Personal tastes differ, and that's all there is to it. Just as an example, this thread periodically gets someone commenting that they couldn't stand this game as it contains a healthy dose of NTR, because they stretch the definition of NTR to absurd limits. But again, there has also been someone in this thread saying "I don't like muscle freaks, it's such a bad idea for the author to put them in the game". That's the difference between having an opinion on the game and having an opinion on TD. They're all opinions, but one usually irritates someone invested in the game more than the other.