VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.5 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[lustforsex]

Hello,
can anyone please help me?

I am stuck in Veronica Scene in Hellweek.
I´ve tried to hide the camera file with a fix mentioned in this post but the camera frame is still visible?

is there any other way to fix this issue?

Thanks!

Try changing the renderer to OpenGL (Shift+G)

 

[DangerTHC]

Try changing the renderer to OpenGL (Shift+G)

I love you! It worked.

Thank you so much!!

 

[ymy42]

I know the main theme of the game is about the club...
But for some reason I like the parts that are about events outside the club more...

I know the world is a scary place in reality, but in the game I can't make bad choices...
Maybe that's one of the reasons why I like the events outside the club more...
Because it seems much more fun and friendly... There may be people who like club events, and some may even mistreat the same women just because of the horrible image of Felicia in their mind...
Yeah, we know who he is... We don't care what you think about Felicia, man...

Thank you so much for all the nice events outside the club

 

[moonpartially]

at least 8 to 12 hours if you don't press skip button.

Damn boy, you must be a fast reader.
I'm at least 20hrs in, and i'm nowhere near the end of the game (dyslexia + english is not my mother tongue, but still)

how long is this game now

Knowing the first part of my post, I can say ~30hrs is you're not a fast reader and you quick save / quick load time to time to see other output.

 

[Turret]

I don’t really see how it’s logical for Dark Edwin to hook em up for any reason. To keep Veronica under his thumb?

Money? Abel and the blonde pocket ass calculator, Chuck, and August. All have money and with cash flow from any of those 3 would support Veronica’s gym if he wants to stay in her sphere and influence her.

Muscle? Warren and Jacob are trained fighters. So far Samson uses his muscles for looks and sex rough play.

if it’s just sex, humiliation, and dominating Veronica. Side with Kathleen and help with the business. Play it so V loses the competition and everything. It wouldn’t take much to make her a permanent fixture of the club. He can be bffs with Samson and let her rail her at the club if that’s what you mean by coupling them up?

There’s just no way I can see Edwin go, hey V… do me a favor and ride off into the sunset with Damson because of power of friendship.

Power, money, or respect that Dark Edwin is going for. Samson is the weakest choice by far for a logical dark Edwin to side with by pairing Veronica up with him.

You seriously do not get the intention here, neither for grey moral nor a dark Edwin, sorry! Three misses when it comes to reasons in your post alone.

I tell you the reasoning behind it. In my main "grey hat" Edwin playthrough he is nice guy, wanting to help others, but he does not intent to save the whole world in one go, he can make hard choices if he must. In that playthrough Veronika is really an annoyance, but no one should suffer under the sadist old hag that Kath is.

So to get her out of his hair and give the metaphorical middle finger to Kath, Edwin will try to couple Samson and Veronika up. Samson is often a prick, but he is still majorly crushing on Veronika, despite her decking him. As said, Veronica should have had simply shot him down, not hitting him, at that time Samson was on best behaviour. While what he then did is a total dick move, it is partly understandable, since he tried to be nice and got hit. This old event is another evidence for Veronika´s two biggest flaws: being too stubborn and prone to rash, unthinking decisions.
While Samson would certainly have tried again to flirt and get her, giving him a simple turn down would have been far better for Veronica, since then Samson would not have began to plan revenge.

Anyway, I try to keep good relations with both Samson and Veronika in the hope one day we get the option to couple them up.
1) You get Veronika out of your life and Samson will certainly be and stay friendly. No one knows when that might come in handy. (e.g. helping Mina getting into cinema movies or talk about Hana and band to some music guys he certainly will know)
2) If the two are together they will find a solution for the gym to survive. Coincidentially it might also deny "Camp Lesbo Gym" coming into existence.
3) longbowman salute to Kath, because with the gym or at least Veronika´s life in other waters, Kath cannot keep her in PC. But then again, I fully intend to help Abel and Sophia bringing down Kath, so she will not have a say in PC anymore. But the thought counts.
4) Samson will learn about the wise punchline "Beware your wishes, you might get it". While I think the two could become longterm under the right circumstances, Veronika is still herself. So stubborness and rash hipshot decisions will be pop up with some regularity. That is one reason why I do not push for continued communication with Veronika even on my "white knight" playthrough. Complete no go, I had the dubious pleasure to know a person with traits like Veronika.

 

[ename144]

You seriously do not get the intention here, neither for grey moral nor a dark Edwin, sorry! Three misses when it comes to reasons in your post alone.

I tell you the reasoning behind it. In my main "grey hat" Edwin playthrough he is nice guy, wanting to help others, but he does not intent to save the whole world in one go, he can make hard choices if he must. In that playthrough Veronika is really an annoyance, but no one should suffer under the sadist old hag that Kath is.

So to get her out of his hair and give the metaphorical middle finger to Kath, Edwin will try to couple Samson and Veronika up. Samson is often a prick, but he is still majorly crushing on Veronika, despite her decking him. As said, Veronica should have had simply shot him down, not hitting him, at that time Samson was on best behaviour. While what he then did is a total dick move, it is partly understandable, since he tried to be nice and got hit. This old event is another evidence for Veronika´s two biggest flaws: being too stubborn and prone to rash, unthinking decisions.
While Samson would certainly have tried again to flirt and get her, giving him a simple turn down would have been far better for Veronica, since then Samson would not have began to plan revenge.

Anyway, I try to keep good relations with both Samson and Veronika in the hope one day we get the option to couple them up.
1) You get Veronika out of your life and Samson will certainly be and stay friendly. No one knows when that might come in handy. (e.g. helping Mina getting into cinema movies or talk about Hana and band to some music guys he certainly will know)
2) If the two are together they will find a solution for the gym to survive. Coincidentially it might also deny "Camp Lesbo Gym" coming into existence.
3) longbowman salute to Kath, because with the gym or at least Veronika´s life in other waters, Kath cannot keep her in PC. But then again, I fully intend to help Abel and Sophia bringing down Kath, so she will not have a say in PC anymore. But the thought counts.
4) Samson will learn about the wise punchline "Beware your wishes, you might get it". While I think the two could become longterm under the right circumstances, Veronika is still herself. So stubborness and rash hipshot decisions will be pop up with some regularity. That is one reason why I do not push for continued communication with Veronika even on my "white knight" playthrough. Complete no go, I had the dubious pleasure to know a person with traits like Veronika.

I thoroughly disagree with just about everything you've said here.

First of all, I think you're completely misreading Samson. He has no affection for Veronica as a person, he's interested in her only as a hot lay and a satisfying challenge to best. He's like a fun-sized Chuck, eager to get off on hurting anyone he sees as belittling him. If and when Samson manages to have his way with Veronica, you can be sure he won't lift a finger to help her save the gym. If anything, he'll openly gloat about how he ruined it in the first place just to bring the woman even lower.

Second, why on earth would the MC need to "get Veronica out of his life?" If you and/or the MC dislike hanging out with Veronica, just leave her to her own devices and the problem ceases to exist. The whole point of starting her friendship route is empathizing with her over having her dream cynically undermined. The idea that anyone would address that injustice by setting Veronica up with her tormentor boggles the mind. That's not a "grey" MC, that's a lunatic.

Third, I would dispute that Veronica makes unthinking decisions. She's unquestionably stubborn and she can certainly make mistakes, but she's always struck me as being very thoughtful about her actions. Her nettling of Kathleen, for example, is not empty bravado, it's a deliberate gambit that "makes me a bigger target, but it makes [Kathleen's] little circus more dramatic - and that's all she cares about." Likewise, breaking Samson's nose wasn't her overreacting to Samson's "best behavior;" she elbowed him because he groped her for no reason! Sure, Kathleen was only too happy to twist the action against Veronica, but that's because Kathleen is a piece of shit and Veronica underestimated her sadism. Her evaluation of Samson was spot on.

Lastly, at the risk of showing my bias, I take umbrage at the notion Veronica is more annoying than the doctor who likes to dose people with an unlicensed aphrodisiac purely for the lulz.

 

[SteamedHamsInc.]

Very late to the party because of the holidays and because of work consuming my soul, but obviously wouldn't miss out on another goon writing sesh where I hash out my musings for my favourite game on this site. As always, excellent, excellent work by TD and GIL, and even though it's not as strong as some of the previous updates, I still consider this one a great success.

Spoiler: Miscellaneous thoughts

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Spoiler: Andrea

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Spoiler: The Band’s Performance

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Spoiler: Victoria

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Spoiler: Rose

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Well, I had thought this one would be a slightly shorter write-up because of some of the uneven impressions that I got from this update, but looks like there was plenty of juice to squeeze. Thank you to TD and GIL for starting 2025 so strongly, and as always, looking forward to more.

 

[Ungawa]

While Samson is/can be a prick, there was also Veronika´s stubborness and overly haste decision making at work, when she decked him. Even after it, Samson is cruching on her, but he is also angry (samll wonder, getting shot down is one thing, getting a fist into the face another. We should remember that was at a time Samson seriously played nice with Veronika, only after that he began to scheme) which is the reason he came up the idea to sabotage the gym.

Folks... We have to keep the story straight...

It's the initial force for Veronica to come into a hellish game and he came behind her and she hit him in the nose.

It was an accident. She had to guzzle cum for wrong answers and puke out her guts later on.

You talk to Samson in the sauna and he explains how he came up with the idea before the nose decking.

Samson didn't play nice with V at all. He'd already saddled her up with debt, had her coach give her bad loans, and made out like a bandit on other things while she was naive. V is looking for a temporary reprieve but she's working hard in quicksand. And Samson wanting to get in her Dommy Mommy pants isn't helping at all.

 

[Maccabbee]

.... and if some of y'all think that what Samson is feeling towards Veronica is "crushing," then you maybe need to see a psychologist. He admires her, is obsessed, lusts after her, but ultimately wants to conquer her. What he's doing is destroying her in an attempt to dominate her. It's slow motion rape, not seduction. If you think that's "crushing" then I'm glad I'm only interacting through a forum, and not IRL.

 

[Darreau91]

You seriously do not get the intention here, neither for grey moral nor a dark Edwin, sorry! Three misses when it comes to reasons in your post alone.

I tell you the reasoning behind it. In my main "grey hat" Edwin playthrough he is nice guy, wanting to help others, but he does not intent to save the whole world in one go, he can make hard choices if he must. In that playthrough Veronika is really an annoyance, but no one should suffer under the sadist old hag that Kath is.

So to get her out of his hair and give the metaphorical middle finger to Kath, Edwin will try to couple Samson and Veronika up. Samson is often a prick, but he is still majorly crushing on Veronika, despite her decking him. As said, Veronica should have had simply shot him down, not hitting him, at that time Samson was on best behaviour. While what he then did is a total dick move, it is partly understandable, since he tried to be nice and got hit. This old event is another evidence for Veronika´s two biggest flaws: being too stubborn and prone to rash, unthinking decisions.
While Samson would certainly have tried again to flirt and get her, giving him a simple turn down would have been far better for Veronica, since then Samson would not have began to plan revenge.

Anyway, I try to keep good relations with both Samson and Veronika in the hope one day we get the option to couple them up.
1) You get Veronika out of your life and Samson will certainly be and stay friendly. No one knows when that might come in handy. (e.g. helping Mina getting into cinema movies or talk about Hana and band to some music guys he certainly will know)
2) If the two are together they will find a solution for the gym to survive. Coincidentially it might also deny "Camp Lesbo Gym" coming into existence.
3) longbowman salute to Kath, because with the gym or at least Veronika´s life in other waters, Kath cannot keep her in PC. But then again, I fully intend to help Abel and Sophia bringing down Kath, so she will not have a say in PC anymore. But the thought counts.
4) Samson will learn about the wise punchline "Beware your wishes, you might get it". While I think the two could become longterm under the right circumstances, Veronika is still herself. So stubborness and rash hipshot decisions will be pop up with some regularity. That is one reason why I do not push for continued communication with Veronika even on my "white knight" playthrough. Complete no go, I had the dubious pleasure to know a person with traits like Veronika.

Youre going to give Dominatrix Queen Kathleen the middle finger by giving one of her high rolling patron what he wants by coupling up Samson and Veronica up so he gets his pet? Therefore ensuring she will always be tied to the club with the Samson connection? Wouldn't the bigger middle finger to Kathleen be having Veronica have a successful all girls women's gym/dance school so she can wash her hands of the club?

We all have had bouts of being stubborn and impulsive. We all also have had a dislike for someone. Being stubborn and impulsive wont wash away the hate Veronica has for Samson. Might lead to a consequence of being forced closer to Samson due to an impulsive action...sure. She will always dislike Samson. Veronica be stubborn like that.

Having good relations with both Samson and Veronica is an oxy moron. The more Samson likes Edwin the more Veronica will hate Edwin because the stubborn amazonian goddess has a strong dislike for Samson. Coupling 2 people up requires both parties to trust you. Once Veronica finds out Edwin has been helping her enemy, that trust will be gone.

Dont let your hated of Veronica and human nature of being stubborn and impulsive blind you too much now. SoFia would be disappointed in you.

 

[ffive]

.... and if some of y'all think that what Samson is feeling towards Veronica is "crushing," then you maybe need to see a psychologist. He admires her, is obsessed, lusts after her, but ultimately wants to conquer her. What he's doing is destroying her in an attempt to dominate her. It's slow motion rape, not seduction. If you think that's "crushing" then I'm glad I'm only interacting through a forum, and not IRL.

I think when people say "crushing" they mean it in the sense there's no deeper feelings involved, just (intense) desire to fuck her.

 

[Maccabbee]

I think when people say "crushing" they mean it in the sense there's no deeper feelings involved, just (intense) desire to fuck her.

That's lust, crush implies catching feels.

 

[Turret]

I thoroughly disagree with just about everything you've said here.

First of all, I think you're completely misreading Samson. He has no affection for Veronica as a person, he's interested in her only as a hot lay and a satisfying challenge to best. He's like a fun-sized Chuck, eager to get off on hurting anyone he sees as belittling him. If and when Samson manages to have his way with Veronica, you can be sure he won't lift a finger to help her save the gym. If anything, he'll openly gloat about how he ruined it in the first place just to bring the woman even lower.

Second, why on earth would the MC need to "get Veronica out of his life?" If you and/or the MC dislike hanging out with Veronica, just leave her to her own devices and the problem ceases to exist. The whole point of starting her friendship route is empathizing with her over having her dream cynically undermined. The idea that anyone would address that injustice by setting Veronica up with her tormentor boggles the mind. That's not a "grey" MC, that's a lunatic.

Third, I would dispute that Veronica makes unthinking decisions. She's unquestionably stubborn and she can certainly make mistakes, but she's always struck me as being very thoughtful about her actions. Her nettling of Kathleen, for example, is not empty bravado, it's a deliberate gambit that "makes me a bigger target, but it makes [Kathleen's] little circus more dramatic - and that's all she cares about." Likewise, breaking Samson's nose wasn't her overreacting to Samson's "best behavior;" she elbowed him because he groped her for no reason! Sure, Kathleen was only too happy to twist the action against Veronica, but that's because Kathleen is a piece of shit and Veronica underestimated her sadism. Her evaluation of Samson was spot on.

Lastly, at the risk of showing my bias, I take umbrage at the notion Veronica is more annoying than the doctor who likes to dose people with an unlicensed aphrodisiac purely for the lulz.

Folks... We have to keep the story straight...

It's the initial force for Veronica to come into a hellish game and he came behind her and she hit him in the nose.

It was an accident. She had to guzzle cum for wrong answers and puke out her guts later on.

You talk to Samson in the sauna and he explains how he came up with the idea before the nose decking.

Samson didn't play nice with V at all. He'd already saddled her up with debt, had her coach give her bad loans, and made out like a bandit on other things while she was naive. V is looking for a temporary reprieve but she's working hard in quicksand. And Samson wanting to get in her Dommy Mommy pants isn't helping at all.

.... and if some of y'all think that what Samson is feeling towards Veronica is "crushing," then you maybe need to see a psychologist. He admires her, is obsessed, lusts after her, but ultimately wants to conquer her. What he's doing is destroying her in an attempt to dominate her. It's slow motion rape, not seduction. If you think that's "crushing" then I'm glad I'm only interacting through a forum, and not IRL.

Post successful, discussion running!
I have only more time in the evening or tomorrow to answer all stuff, but it got the discussion about Samson, Veronika and his friendship score (only one among the Club members) going. I am fully aware what a dick move it would be hooking up Samson and Veronika and it´s why I said a solution for a grey and dark Edwin. This solution of the Veronika story is completely about Edwin´s(!) gains while solving some other problems, but as an afterthought.
Samson going this far, getting Veronika into the Club due to his long meddling, shows that at least some crush feelings are involved. You do not go this far for simply a fuck, that Samson can get anytime in the Club. Even for revenge, this is a long time.
Also when you look at the scene in the Sauna, there is a moment where his face looks very much like John Wayne´s. I doubt that it is the intention to show " the Duke" as a complete prick throughout the whole game.

 

[Ozymandias037]

Spoiler: Spoilered for length

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I fucking love this post. Enough that I'm going to say it twice: I fucking love this post.

Eloquent, insightful, and (in my opinion) spot on analysis, and clearly a kindred spirit who can also recognize the Literary Value (caps, as always, used as shorthand for "all that Serious Academic English Department stuff") of this game. I won't even attempt to respond to everything you've said, but I agree with almost all of it and I appreciate you taking the time to put it all into words more eloquently than I have thus far been able to (or perhaps taken the time to) do.

I applaud you.

 

[UmbralKnight]

Damn boy, you must be a fast reader.
I'm at least 20hrs in, and i'm nowhere near the end of the game (dyslexia + english is not my mother tongue, but still)


Knowing the first part of my post, I can say ~30hrs is you're not a fast reader and you quick save / quick load time to time to see other output.

i maybe a fast leader by ESL standards.
but i have no idea how fast or slow native speakers read , i recently played the game again from the beginning and it took me around 18 hours to complete so i estimated it would take ATLEAST 8 to 12 hours to complete the game.
but hey no need to rush through the game , after all then you would have nothing to do but engage in endless waifu wars for months until the next update drops.

You seriously do not get the intention here, neither for grey moral nor a dark Edwin, sorry! Three misses when it comes to reasons in your post alone.

I tell you the reasoning behind it. In my main "grey hat" Edwin playthrough he is nice guy, wanting to help others, but he does not intent to save the whole world in one go, he can make hard choices if he must. In that playthrough Veronika is really an annoyance, but no one should suffer under the sadist old hag that Kath is.

So to get her out of his hair and give the metaphorical middle finger to Kath, Edwin will try to couple Samson and Veronika up. Samson is often a prick, but he is still majorly crushing on Veronika, despite her decking him. As said, Veronica should have had simply shot him down, not hitting him, at that time Samson was on best behaviour. While what he then did is a total dick move, it is partly understandable, since he tried to be nice and got hit. This old event is another evidence for Veronika´s two biggest flaws: being too stubborn and prone to rash, unthinking decisions.
While Samson would certainly have tried again to flirt and get her, giving him a simple turn down would have been far better for Veronica, since then Samson would not have began to plan revenge.

Anyway, I try to keep good relations with both Samson and Veronika in the hope one day we get the option to couple them up.
1) You get Veronika out of your life and Samson will certainly be and stay friendly. No one knows when that might come in handy. (e.g. helping Mina getting into cinema movies or talk about Hana and band to some music guys he certainly will know)
2) If the two are together they will find a solution for the gym to survive. Coincidentially it might also deny "Camp Lesbo Gym" coming into existence.
3) longbowman salute to Kath, because with the gym or at least Veronika´s life in other waters, Kath cannot keep her in PC. But then again, I fully intend to help Abel and Sophia bringing down Kath, so she will not have a say in PC anymore. But the thought counts.
4) Samson will learn about the wise punchline "Beware your wishes, you might get it". While I think the two could become longterm under the right circumstances, Veronika is still herself. So stubborness and rash hipshot decisions will be pop up with some regularity. That is one reason why I do not push for continued communication with Veronika even on my "white knight" playthrough. Complete no go, I had the dubious pleasure to know a person with traits like Veronika.

the grey zone solution would be pairing up veronica with mina than samson.

 

[Hungover00]

That's lust, crush implies catching feels.

'Hard on for' would cover the lust without feels.

 

[ename144]

Samson going this far, getting Veronika into the Club due to his long meddling, shows that at least some crush feelings are involved. You do not go this far for simply a fuck, that Samson can get anytime in the Club. Even for revenge, this is a long time.

It's not about sex OR revenge, it's all about power. Veronica is the type of girl who wouldn't deign to sleep with Samson in a million years under normal circumstances. Getting not only to fuck her but to abuse her to his every whim is - in his eyes - a worthy challenge. That's why he's so invested in it, and also why he'll leave her high and dry once he's done: the casual dismissal will make his conquest all the more one-sided.

 

[thela2]

being able make choices that actually matters is great and its very rare to see in this kind of games butttt waiting 6 month to only get a 1 scene is kinda annoying ngl

 

[lustforsex]

being able make choices that actually matters is great and its very rare to see in this kind of games butttt waiting 6 month to only get a 1 scene is kinda annoying ngl

It seems we are playing different games.

 

[DirtyMario]

It seems we are playing different games.

Or different paths.

On another note, is there a fancy japanese acronym for me not liking to see my ingame mother get fucked by sleazy guys? Does that fit into the NTR term or is that just for romantic partners?
Man I REALLY dislike that.