Ren'Py Abandoned Power Vacuum [Ch. 12 Official] [What? Why? Games]

[beegemgeege]

Anyway I'd say both sides have a good point. Though I very much disagree with how long hes taking to get the MC all the way with Ophelia, its been shown that most games that reach that focal point too soon drop off. Hence, the longer he postpones that pivotal sex moment between the two, the longer some are to stay invested. Its smart if not annoying and MY OPINION it was drawn out a little too far. Theres a sweet spot and he definitely overshot it for this one (evident by the what ifs and her power in them once she finally became available) but hopefully itll be a learning experience for his next one.

On the other hand, while you can argue semantics (just look where that got me in this thread when it came to time management) whether its an opinion on who had the better scenes obviously, for most anyway (as stated earlier), the sex with the best girls has come sooner for Hunter then Sterling. Yes, its because Sterling is the love route and Hunter is the lust one. So it makes sense from a story stand point. But that does in fact mean that as of this point he has the better scenes. Hopefully as Sterling catches up though, that will definitely change. This update will either prove or disapprove much of that so argue all you like but its probably best just to wait and see.

 

[SuddenReal]

But that does in fact mean that as of this point he has the better scenes.

Ah, you mean "better" as in he progresses faster. Gotcha. Well, yes, since Hunter cheats, but you could see it as a teaser for Sterling's scenes which will always surpass the preview.

As for Ophelia taking a long time, story wise, Hunter is the BBEG, but in terms of porn games, Ophelia is the end boss. Those are supposed to be tackled last since that's the point of the game.

 

[Fayn Arawn]

Anyway I'd say both sides have a good point. Though I very much disagree with how long hes taking to get the MC all the way with Ophelia, its been shown that most games that reach that focal point too soon drop off. Hence, the longer he postpones that pivotal sex moment between the two, the longer some are to stay invested. Its smart if not annoying and MY OPINION it was drawn out a little too far. Theres a sweet spot and he definitely overshot it for this one (evident by the what ifs and her power in them once she finally became available) but hopefully itll be a learning experience for his next one.

On the other hand, while you can argue semantics (just look where that got me in this thread when it came to time management) whether its an opinion on who had the better scenes obviously, for most anyway (as stated earlier), the sex with the best girls has come sooner for Hunter then Sterling. Yes, its because Sterling is the love route and Hunter is the lust one. So it makes sense from a story stand point. But that does in fact mean that as of this point he has the better scenes. Hopefully as Sterling catches up though, that will definitely change.

You're making well thought-out and articulated statements, which is a lot more than one "side" typically writes here.

Two issues which are often argued: Hunter's scenes are "better"; Sterling's progress takes too long. Let's take them one at a time.

Tell you what, I will stipulate that Hunter's scenes actually are better. What does "better" mean in this context? It means he has more intense and graphic sex with each girl, usually before Sterling does. But they are supposed to be better because that's what makes them entertaining (to those who aren't bothered). If Hunter and Sterling progressed at the same rate (or if Hunter lagged behind) then Hunter's scenes would have a lot less impact. Some might be fine with Hunter getting sloppy seconds, others would probably still want him to not get anything, but in both cases it defeats the purpose of Hunter's presence in the game.

Whether Sterling's progress takes too long is less clear. Obviously some people want instant gratification and they'll complain no matter what. Others know that the buildup leads to a better payoff, and can appreciate a slow burn, but how slow is too slow? As you alluded to, the moms are the main prize in these games, hence why they should take longer to go all the way with. Personally I think Sterling has made continual progress with Ophelia every chapter, so it doesn't feel to me like it's deliberately "dragged out". Compare to other games like Midnight Paradise, My Pleasure, or No More Money; progress with those moms is always "one step forward, two steps back".

This update will either prove or disapprove much of that so argue all you like but its probably best just to wait and see.

Exactly. This is why I've been mostly facepalming, the next release is (hopefully) days away, and then we can move on to new arguments!

 

[LovesReD]

Hello, I was going to ask something, but I really don't know, but I'm curious. What is "ntr"? most people are talking about it. some say bad some say good. I would appreciate if someone could explain

 

[dartred]

Hello, I was going to ask something, but I really don't know, but I'm curious. What is "ntr"? most people are talking about it. some say bad some say good. I would appreciate if someone could explain

NTR most often means Netorare.

The stealing of your loved one by another person. I won't say man, because a women can take your women too and still be Netorare.

There's also Netori where the MC takes the lover instead. Finally, there is Netorase, where the MC shares his loved one with others intentionally.

There are a few other NTR's, but those 3 are the main ones with the first example being the prime used one for NTR.

I wish this site could at least split NTR into the netorare and netori, because a game can have either and be tagged with NTR. while netori is the one most people like, there are games here tagged with NTR that people are avoid because they don't want the MC's women taken but don't realize the MC is doing the cucking. maybe a new tag like "NTR(i)" for when it's netori and just "NTR" when it's the regular NTR situation. Heck, a game can have both tags now if both situations are in a game.

NTR is something that is not being used properly in the west. Here's a great introduction to NTR on YT

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[Fuxxzz]

NTR most often means Netorare.

The stealing of your loved one by another person. I won't say man, because a women can take your women too and still be Netorare.

There's also Netori where the MC takes the lover instead. Finally, there is Netorase, where the MC shares his loved one with others intentionally.

There are a few other NTR's, but those 3 are the main ones with the first example being the prime used one for NTR.

I wish this site could at least split NTR into the netorare and netori, because a game can have either and be tagged with NTR. while netori is in the majority, there are games here with it that people are avoid because they don't want the MC's women taken but don't realize the MC is doing the cucking. maybe a new tag like "NTR(i)" for when it's netori and just "NTR" when it's the regular NTR situation. Heck, a game can have both tags now if both situations are in a game.

NTR is something that is not being used properly in the west. Here's a great introduction to NTR on YT

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It's pretty funny when you read some people shitting on NTR but defending netori at the same time. But yeah, I agree that it should be a split tag

 

[dartred]

Two issues which are often argued: Hunter's scenes are "better"; Sterling's progress takes too long. Let's take them one at a time.

Tell you what, I will stipulate that Hunter's scenes actually are better. What does "better" mean in this context? It means he has more intense and graphic sex with each girl, usually before Sterling does. But they are supposed to be better because that's what makes them entertaining (to those who aren't bothered). If Hunter and Sterling progressed at the same rate (or if Hunter lagged behind) then Hunter's scenes would have a lot less impact.

There's also another underlying reason why Hunters scenes might be "better". Hunter's scenes take up maybe about 10% of a chapters sex scenes.

In chapter 10, there were 23 erotic scenes (I say erotic and not just Sterling because girl on girl exist) in the gallery and only 2 of them were bad ends scenes. That makes it 8.7%. That's just counting scenes while holding CTRL, there might be more where i didn't notice a new scene started, but i played it safe and didn't add scenes i didn't know for sure existed. So long story short, that's why Hunter scenes are "better", because they are so rare in a chapter.

When you think about Hunter only getting 1 or 2 scenes in a chapter, they kind of have to be made good.

Sorry i quoted you, but that looked like a perfect time to shoe in why Hunter's scenes are seen as better. Wasn't talking directly to you when i wrote this.

 

[milfkiller]

cant wait for the update...mc finally canget laid with mommy

 

[Miliryan]

I think, it is about personal taste again. Because from an objective viewpoint i don't think the ntr scenes are better.

What is exactly "better" in the Hunter and Ophelia ntr scene? The lenght? The amount of poses? The writing?

Because i checked the MC's scene with Ophelia and Aliza ... And it is equally big or even bigger. I mean, he gets a double blowjob from the girls, fucks Ophelia in the ass, then fucks Aliza.
The one thing what is better in the ntr scene for me is the conversation during sex.

But you can say, who cares about Aliza?
Well, i care! It may be hard to believe but i like Aliza more than Ophelia. I wanted to see the sex between her and the MC so much and it was amazing.

So, the overall quality is about the same in vanilla and ntr scenes. At least for me.


All that matters, that if we are lucky we get more in a few days. So excited for Ch 11!

 

[snakeplisskin]

NTR most often means Netorare.

The stealing of your loved one by another person. I won't say man, because a women can take your women too and still be Netorare.

There's also Netori where the MC takes the lover instead. Finally, there is Netorase, where the MC shares his loved one with others intentionally.

There are a few other NTR's, but those 3 are the main ones with the first example being the prime used one for NTR.

I wish this site could at least split NTR into the netorare and netori, because a game can have either and be tagged with NTR. while netori is the one most people like, there are games here tagged with NTR that people are avoid because they don't want the MC's women taken but don't realize the MC is doing the cucking. maybe a new tag like "NTR(i)" for when it's netori and just "NTR" when it's the regular NTR situation. Heck, a game can have both tags now if both situations are in a game.

NTR is something that is not being used properly in the west. Here's a great introduction to NTR on YT

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You are not wrong, i put off playing this game for a very long time because of the ntr tag. This is one of 3 games i play with the ntr tag, i usually skip them as i am not a fan of the genre tropes.

 

[Alexbt]

I think, it is about personal taste again. Because from an objective viewpoint i don't think the ntr scenes are better.

What is exactly "better" in the Hunter and Ophelia ntr scene? The lenght? The amount of poses? The writing?

Because i checked the MC's scene with Ophelia and Aliza ... And it is equally big or even bigger. I mean, he gets a double blowjob from the girls, fucks Ophelia in the ass, then fucks Aliza.
The one thing what is better in the ntr scene for me is the conversation during sex.

But you can say, who cares about Aliza?
Well, i care! It may be hard to believe but i like Aliza more than Ophelia. I wanted to see the sex between her and the MC so much and it was amazing.

So, the overall quality is about the same in vanilla and ntr scenes. At least for me.


All that matters, that if we are lucky we get more in a few days. So excited for Ch 11!

Like you, I don't know if it's my preference for mature women or what, but Aliza and Ophelia are two of my favorite characters, and we've already got the double sex scene in Chapter 10, so I'm looking forward to the next chapter.

 

[yourmomma]

The difference between Hunter and Sterling is night and day. Sterling is building a relationship and that takes time and good story writing. Hunter is a rapist and doesn't take the girls feelings into consideration. That's why Hunter has earlier sex scenes then Sterling. Hunter does underhanded things that skip steps to get a women into bed.

Sterling has said multiple times that he will do things when the women are ready. Story wise, it makes sense that the 2 pace differently and it's not favoritism towards one of the characters. Hell, if WWG played favorites, Cath would have the most scenes in the game. That's his personal favorite character.

Well put, clearly people aren't reading the story and know that Hunter is drugging and manipulating the girls or they secretly want to be Hunter and do the drugging and manipulating.
Plenty of non NTR games yet here they are ......skirting the edge........

 

[andy maxxx]

There's also another underlying reason why Hunters scenes might be "better". Hunter's scenes take up maybe about 10% of a chapters sex scenes.

In chapter 10, there were 23 erotic scenes (I say erotic and not just Sterling because girl on girl exist) in the gallery and only 2 of them were bad ends scenes. That makes it 8.7%. That's just counting scenes while holding CTRL, there might be more where i didn't notice a new scene started, but i played it safe and didn't add scenes i didn't know for sure existed. So long story short, that's why Hunter scenes are "better", because they are so rare in a chapter.

When you think about Hunter only getting 1 or 2 scenes in a chapter, they kind of have to be made good.

Sorry i quoted you, but that looked like a perfect time to shoe in why Hunter's scenes are seen as better. Wasn't talking directly to you when i wrote this.

All in all it’s subjective. But in my opinion Hunter's scenes might seem "better" because most of his scenes are with the fan favourite main girls (e.g. Ophelia & Brenna) not because ntr is "rare".
For example, There’s a lot of Hunter x Brenna vaginal sex scenes (counting the what ifs). Would you call them rare? I don’t think so. I don’t think people would call them "boring" (like they call the vanilla scenes "boring") even if the dev added more Hunter x Brenna scenes just because the scenes are with Brenna. How many people cared about Eva or Mallory ntr scenes as much as the Brenna or Ophelia ones?
Another reason people might think vanilla sex scenes are "boring" because most of them are with side girls than main girls. While Sterling takes his sweet time with the appetizers, Hunter hogs the main dish.

 

[dartred]

All in all it’s subjective. But in my opinion Hunter's scenes might seem "better" because most of his scenes are with the fan favourite main girls (e.g. Ophelia & Brenna) not because ntr is "rare".
For example, There’s a lot of Hunter x Brenna vaginal sex scenes (counting the what ifs). Would you call them rare? I don’t think so. I don’t think people would call them "boring" (like they call the vanilla scenes "boring") even if the dev added more Hunter x Brenna scenes just because the scenes are with Brenna. How many people cared about Eva or Mallory ntr scenes as much as the Brenna or Ophelia ones?
Another reason people might think vanilla sex scenes are "boring" because most of them are with side girls than main girls. While Sterling takes his sweet time with the appetizers, Hunter hogs the main dish.

This is wrong in so many ways.

Hunter has been in Brenna's, Cath's and Ophelia's Vagina's once each in the main game. That's a total of 3 sex scenes with them.

Sterling has been in Brenna's vagina and ass 5 times so far. He has been in Cath's Vagina and ass 4 times. He has been in Ophelia's ass 4 times. These are not just different positions I'm counting. These are new scenes each time. That's a total of 13 penetration sex scenes to Hunters grand total of 3 with the "main girls". So no, Hunter doesn't hog the main dishes.

You can't count what ifs because they aren't canon and the dev doesn't get to choose who gets to be in them. Those were a community vote and majority wins.

If we stick to what's actually canon, Sterling has the most action.

 

[andy maxxx]

This is wrong in so many ways.

Hunter has been in Brenna's, Cath's and Ophelia's Vagina's once each in the main game. That's a total of 3 sex scenes with them.

Sterling has been in Brenna's vagina and ass 5 times so far. He has been in Cath's Vagina and ass 4 times. He has been in Ophelia's ass 4 times. These are not just different positions i'm counting. This are new scenes each time. That's a total of 13 penetration sex scenes to Hunters grand total of 3 with the "main girls". So no, Hunter doesn't hog the main dishes.

You can't count what ifs because they aren't canon and the dev doesn't get to choose who gets to be in them. Those were a community vote and majority wins.

If we stick to what's actually canon, Sterling has the most action.

Well then I'll just have to respectfully agree to disagree. I considered only the vaginal sex scenes cause I myself not much of a anal fan.
About hunter getting grand total of 3 sex scenes with the main girls, did you not count the blind & deaf bad end in chapter 9? Cause there were Cath & Brenna ntr scenes as far as I remember.
But anyway the ntr scenes are definitely bigger with the main girls nonetheless with the latest chapters. It’s unlikely that there'll be ntr scenes with Kumiko/Tiffany as big as said main girls ntr scenes.

You can't count what ifs because they aren't canon and the dev doesn't get to choose who gets to be in them. Those were a community vote and majority wins.

So that means we can't even consider the what ifs in content quantity? I mean that's power vacuum content regardless. Anyway I'm not against the what ifs . My worry is that if Sterling will get as much as vag sex scenes with Brenna as her ntr ones with what if contents combined in the remaining chapters. Cause the what ifs make me feel like there’s some discrimination in the Brennna vag sex scenes department.

If we stick to what's actually canon, Sterling has the most action

If we stick to what's actually canon, then ntr doesn’t exist :3

 

[robrize2169]

so in my early game i chose to cock block Hunter so he gets nothing. it was hilarious. but i am stuck on the Brenna stuff at both of the last scenes. can't play prank and can't finish the photo storyline. what did i miss?

 

[dartred]

I considered only the vaginal sex scenes cause I myself not much of a anal fan.

That's not fair to only say what you have taste in counts as content.

My worry is that if Sterling will get as much as vag sex scenes with Brenna as her ntr ones with what if contents combined in the remaining chapters. Cause the what ifs make me feel like there’s some discrimination in the Brennna vag sex scenes department.

Then you have anything to worry about. There will not be any more What If's coming out for PV at least until the game is done. So by the time the game is over, Sterling will have more vaginal then Hunter in the main game, compared to Hunter in the main game and What Ifs.

I forgot to count what ifs for Brenna so add +1 to times Sterling has fucked Brenna. So right now we're looking at Hunter being in Brenna's vagina 4 times and Sterling in Brenna's vagina 3 times. Counting main game and what if for both.

So with no more what if's coming in. Sterling only needs 1 more vaginal penetration to be equal and 2 more to surpass. I mean, even as is, a 1 vag scene gap isn't as large as you make it seem. Hunter clearly isn't being favored.

If we look at Cath, Hunter has been in her vag 2 times and Sterling 3 times, main and what if combined. Ophelia has only been fucked by Hunter once.

So now that i've looked into it deeper. Hunter has had vag sex with main girls 6 times, main and what ifs combined. Sterling has had vag sex with main girls 5 times. We have a grand total of Hunter having 1 more vag sex with a main girl. Where is the favoritism towards Hunter you were talking about lol.

 

[andy maxxx]

That's not fair to only say what you have taste in counts as content.

Then you have nothing to worry about. There will not be any more What If's coming out for PV at least until the game is done. So by the time the game is over, Sterling will have more vaginal then Hunter in the main game, compared to Hunter in the main game and What Ifs.

I forgot to count what ifs for Brenna so add +1 to times Sterling has fucked Brenna. So right now we're looking at Hunter being in Brenna's vagina 4 times and Sterling in Brenna's vagina 3 times. Counting main game and what if for both.

So with no more what if's coming in. Sterling only needs 1 more vaginal penetration to be equal and 2 more to surpass. I mean, even as is, a 1 vag scene gap isn't as large as you make it seem. Hunter clearly isn't being favored.

If we look at Cath, Hunter has been in her vag 2 times and Sterling 3 times, main and what if combined. Ophelia has only been fucked by Hunter once.

So now that i've looked into it deeper. Hunter has had vag sex with main girls 6 times, main and what ifs combined. Sterling has had vag sex with main girls 5 times. We have a grand total of Hunter having 1 more vag sex with a main girl. Where is the favoritism towards Hunter you were talking about lol.

Come on, we all know there'll be ntr threesome with Brenna and Ophelia in chap 11 already from the previews. So even if the what ifs are gone, who knows how many more of this to come in the upcoming chapters. So in the end, it won't be fair to call the hunter x main girl scenes rare anymore.

 

[dartred]

Yeah, i did forget about Hunter's bad ends, but he gets 1 or 2 per chapter and never same girl in a chapter. we know Brenna and Ophelia are probably fucked by Hunter due to the teaser. So that's +1 for Hunter. We don't know how many times Sterling will fuck a girl in a chapter. I mean, he has vag fucked Brenna twice in a chapter before, so it could happen again. That's something that Sterling has going for him. He can fuck a girl multiple times a chapter, but Hunter can't. So with no more what ifs, the thing that is giving Hunter the edge gone, Sterling should skyrocket to the lead.

And the next part i know some won't like to hear, but with the chapters getting longer in the devs words. Since he is foregoing what ifs to spend more time on the last 2 or 3 chapters of the game. It would only be fair to increase the number of bad ends.

I'll use my previous example and keep the numbers simple. If he doubles the length of a chapter and gives 46 sex scenes. he has to double the bad ends from 2 to 4 to keep the bad ends only taking up 8.7%. It's Statistically fair for both sides, but vanilla fans get 23 new sex scenes and NTR only got 2 lol. It's really favored to Vanilla fans even if the % didn't change.

Of course this is me just breaking it down with numbers. Who knows how WWG plans to shift the game for the last few chapters.

 

[whizzeee]

Its weird he didnt give a release date yet, did he say anything on discord?

he said mid feb and in my mind that means roughly between the 15th and 20th. Could be today or tomorrow, but when someone says mid feb that is what I think personally. Porn devs always lie about update delivery, but so far this dev has been 10/10 with delivering on time - its a nice change of pace.