Imagine listening to her dirty talk every time you have sex.
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That's a very fair question and probably hard to answer for any game thats still being developed with us knowing only parts of the story, but I'll try.Do you think in this game it's how the LI's are portrayed or more the MC himself? He comes across as extremely passive in a lot of the situations. I mean, I get that it's part of what he's going through but it's to the point where other parts of the story are trying to progress regardless of that and it affects the perception of those he's involved with. Seems like you blame Els for not jumping him and Kana for doing so too enthusiastically.I'm kidding, but do want to recognize that he's not been blameless himself.
As far as Els goes, it gets worse every episode. The first real 1on1 Interaction we get is at her new apartment and tell me how often has it happened in your life that you needed to tell a friend that you wanna hang out more one on one for it to happen ? I mean that's supposed to happen naturaly/organicaly but for Els it feels like she just fliped a switch in her head and now all of the sudden she wants more 1 on 1 friend time and opens up, its eerie and a bit creepy.
Then the tit for tat question thingy, I get that it's most likely a tool (imo very poorly) used to enhance the story, but man it's the opposite of friendship. Friendship is about doing/sharing things without expecting anything but friendship in return and now those 2 are caught in a loop of "Yea okay, but only if you do it too." I was very pleased that we had the option as the MC to put an end to it, in the car ride back from the garage and I hope that really does end that disaster of a friendship dependency.
Then how she treated her dad. Dude gets out of the car, greets them, says ONE sentence about MC's car and she goes bitch mode. They go inside, he asked about MC living with Allister and she goes bitch mode again. MC and her dad talk about the military and she gives him the stare of death. Not even all of those combined justify her reactions to each of those by themselves. It's like she goes nuclear at the slightest chance of losing even the tiniest bit of control and I HATE control freaks.
The pool scene - everything that happens is her doing : she goes to the pool, undresses and jumps in and then says something along the lines of "happy ? its rare to get me naked!", but the MC didn't get shit, it was all her from A to Z and now she expects a fanfare and a firework display ? That scene felt like the MC is supposed to feel grateful that she graces him with her almighty knockers, almost as if she has that entire scene backwards.
Completely breaks the MC's trust by using her old intelligence contacts to get the MC's file, now I get she wants to help, but the ends doesn't justify the means, this constant theme of her believing she knows better than anyone else is triggering. If she wants the MC to come clean and share, earn it - the hard way, the RIGHT way, but you don't go behind your supposed friends back against his wishes, that was again a total bitch move.
And finally the constant switch between hot and cold. "I'm very fond of you" vs "...under the delusion that I'm interessted in you.", "care deeply about you" vs "I'm immune to your flirting" at the garage she gets mad for the MC flirting and then when they go christmas shopping she gets all hand holding in the cinema and on the street. She has to make up her mind and either not hold back because she's afraid the MC will say "no" or just be the best friend she can be, the back and forth is super anoying.
Like right now, she is at the very bottom of the pile for me, I wouldn't even trust her to heat up Lasagne for the MC.
As for Kana, it's really only the sex scene that was super bad, and I can understand that one can blame the MC for being passive as soon as anything gets real, but we have ample confirmation that the dude knows how to fuck, he literally makes every woman he touches have her eyes roll back into her head, but here he acts like a blow-up doll. As I said, I believe Kana is salvageable, and there is nothing wrong on principle with having a girl thats aggressive in the sack, but I sure hope they have a more balanced sex life moving forward, because that scene just lacked any and all intimacy or balance.
As for the MC, he's clearly still hung-up on Zaina on top of his myriad of other problems, in particular blaming himself for literally everything, which admittingly is getting really old too, but I guess that's part of the main arc and we just have to live with it untill the game offeres a solution to it.
Vi or Amrith would, in many ways, be perfect, but I just can't see them as viable GF's because they are 2 very important pillars that hold the MC upright and allow him to heal. Plus the whole big brother angle makes it feel just not right.
So here's hoping for Kana 2.0, Serena or Ines to turn into women that could give the MC what he needs and deserves.
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- Nov 14, 2017
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if mc would say to some girls that they are perfect housewives then he would get severe beating.
There's no accounting for taste I guess.
Reenie would be my last choice. Just seemed like some mediocre hoe you'd bang quick to me. She offers it up immediately, no effort involved, there is no point to her other than something you'd bang quickly but never tell your friends about....and she just comes off as desperate like the ring girls or like a fucktoy you play with a few times like them too. I sure as fuck wouldn't want a chick like that long term for my MC...and the way it sounds with the MC being a playboy he already encounters dozens or hundreds of women like that anyways. She's just thrown right at you...and I'm sure that was the point of her...so the player didn't get blueballed and have to wait chapters to see some sex while relationships are built...given this is an adult game and fappers expect to be able to see fap material.
All the other girls I find interesting in some way...with their backstories...and I enjoy more the games that have a building of relationship first. Although I have my favorites I think all 5 main Li's are solid options, even with their character flaws. Vi and Amrit in my view are perfect however for the purpose of romantic relationships...they have built up trust and loyalty with the MC. They could be just lifelong friends and would still be loyal to the MC...this in my view is a solid foundation to start with if you're after a longer romantic relationship. Amrit is a bit newer to the MC and his circle, unlike Vi and Alistair....but it's still apparent she has also built up a solid foundation of trust and loyalty with the MC too. I also would like to see Ines and how she turns out. So far I like her and she is intriguing and up there with Vi and Amrit for me but need to see how things turn out with her...she has some demons we need to find out first...but I don't mind one bit having her around a lot with Vi and Amrit...she fits well within the circle and is very nice eye candy to have around.
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They have been friends for years, so no idea where that "immediately" comes from. And the reason she offers sex is because :
Serena : "In all that time, I've never seen you this angry. You're doing a good job of hiding it, but I can feel it radiating off of you. If you don't fight something, or fuck something, you're gonna explode."
I would understand if you would see her more as a friend with benefits, but if that qualfies her as a "hoe" for you, then we have very different definitions on what a "hoe" is.
She fosters animals, works at the centre for free, helps the MC as his agent, goes shopping with and for Vi on a days notice and becomes an impotant friend for Vi.
So we agree in principle, there is no accounting for taste.
Thanks for the well put together response. I'll pay more careful attention to how Els acts in particular next time I play from the start and see if it changes my perception of her (it's been a bit so the details aren't fresh in my mind anymore). She's no doubt very screwed up and clearly has issues with behaving or even knowing how to behave properly towards others. There's a number of things you've said I don't disagree with about her behavior but personally a lot of that behavior just made me want to know more about why she is the way she is (and some things I've just assumed based on what we know and I've been somewhat understanding of). I'm drawn to damaged/messed up individuals to some degree and in AVNs they're usually the characters I most want to know more about but I can definitely understand your issues and frustrations with her rationally.
More generally, I've felt like a lot of the way she acts is very much a facade, so ultimately how I see her will depend on what I see when we do get to see more of the actual her. It may come out very differently in her, but I saw a lot of her as a mirror to hold up to a lot of the issues the MC has... which realistically makes them likely a bad pairing, but in the game has made me just hope they'll at least help each other figure some of their problems out. The potential trust issues I do also agree on. When I first played I do remember thinking Els was one of the few that had good chemistry with the MC very early on and it's possible that initial attachment plus her gorgeous face and my own love for Irish and Scottish women has turned me unknowingly into a blind fanboy.
I think we've likely just been on very diverging paths with regards to our perceptions of her. For instance, the father scene I didn't take issue with at all and read completely differently. We knew she had issues with her family and her father which we likely don't even know the extent of and to me she seemed rather tame in that scenario without being too uncharacteristically passive or lashing out. Even if she's in the wrong with her disdain for parts of her family, it still exists and is something she needs to work out. I can see how it would bother you though as you were already in a position where she annoyed you and everything she did was just making things worse by that point. For me, I was perhaps too light on her in coming from the opposite direction.
Like I said, I'll try to keep a more critical eye on character behavior next time I start over particularly with some of the things you pointed out from the start and see if it changes things for me.Agreed on all this. I wasn't a fan of the introduction of the added Zaina trauma at all myself (he really didn't need added romantic issues to complicate things further) but I assume it ties into what his friend did. Occasionally when she would appear recently, I'd be thinking "Can I talk to the best friend trauma ghost instead at least?" Clearly they're tied together but lately he just seemed to be replaced to tell her story and rather than having it interwoven much yet from what I recall.
And you can't pick who you fall in love with... but can make decisions about who the MC will in a VN.
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I would not blame anyone for being drawn to Els, she is beautifull and she has all the right curves in all the right places. And you are probably right that my perception of her got dyed more and more negatively, because my initial impression of her was more on the negative side. That she also suffered some trauma is also without question and once we will know the details, maybe empathy and sympathy will shine a brighter light on her, but that's why I said "as of right now" and honestly that she got MC's file behind his back is the one big thing that's bordering on unforgiveable. You just don't do that to a person you love or who you consider a friend, that shortcut just left a really bad taste in my mouth.Thanks for the well put together response. I'll pay more careful attention to how Els acts in particular next time I play from the start and see if it changes my perception of her (it's been a bit so the details aren't fresh in my mind anymore). She's no doubt very screwed up and clearly has issues with behaving or even knowing how to behave properly towards others. There's a number of things you've said I don't disagree with about her behavior but personally a lot of that behavior just made me want to know more about why she is the way she is (and some things I've just assumed based on what we know and I've been somewhat understanding of). I'm drawn to damaged/messed up individuals to some degree and in AVNs they're usually the characters I most want to know more about but I can definitely understand your issues and frustrations with her rationally.
More generally, I've felt like a lot of the way she acts is very much a facade, so ultimately how I see her will depend on what I see when we do get to see more of the actual her. It may come out very differently in her, but I saw a lot of her as a mirror to hold up to a lot of the issues the MC has... which realistically makes them likely a bad pairing, but in the game has made me just hope they'll at least help each other figure some of their problems out. The potential trust issues I do also agree on. When I first played I do remember thinking Els was one of the few that had good chemistry with the MC very early on and it's possible that initial attachment plus her gorgeous face and my own love for Irish and Scottish women has turned me unknowingly into a blind fanboy.
I think we've likely just been on very diverging paths with regards to our perceptions of her. For instance, the father scene I didn't take issue with at all and read completely differently. We knew she had issues with her family and her father which we likely don't even know the extent of and to me she seemed rather tame in that scenario without being too uncharacteristically passive or lashing out. Even if she's in the wrong with her disdain for parts of her family, it still exists and is something she needs to work out. I can see how it would bother you though as you were already in a position where she annoyed you and everything she did was just making things worse by that point. For me, I was perhaps too light on her in coming from the opposite direction.
I wonder, if the dialogue the MC has with the "ghost" of Zaina in the cinema, is the closest the developer was willing to get us to who Els is, untill her story gets worked out and told at least.
The developer went with a very risky approach, asking players to take control of a MC without letting them know or understand the extent of his trauma and how much it shaped him makes it very difficult to emphasize or sympathize with his situation. I guess that is one of the big problems of playing a game during it's development progress. Once the game is finished it will probably all come together, but untill then, magnified by the long development process, it feels somewhat hard to get a grip on right or wrong.
And yes I'm 100% with you, the amount of trouble he seemed to have run into before the game even starts has to be some kind of world record. Betrayed by his best friend, lost his love, lost countless friends, had to witness Vi getting attacked, his mother barely speaks to him, suffers from hallucinations and can't get a full nights sleep to save his life. So I agree, we have crossed the point of when too much is too much a long time ago.
Agree to disagree. A fuckbuddy is a fuckbuddy...and is a hoe...I've never seen any of my male friends or acquaintances have much respect for the girls they fool around with and certainly never seen something like that develop into a happy long relationship with any of them either.
She is thrown right at you as the player...in a sexual way...that's where the immediately comes from....which is also where the ring girl vibe comes from. Regardless how long the MC has known her. There is no romantic buildup with her. The game just says here....fuck her. She would have a big hole to dig herself out of from that initial impression if she's to become a serious Love interest.
I don't see her as a saint and I'm not convinced she's as selfless as you're trying to portray her. The MC pays her handsomely...her biggest paying client actually. She is good friends with Els and helps her out at the center...that's what good friends do. She hates the cat she's fostering but I don't think that would even matter anyways. Plenty of hardened criminals love pets but with people are not so good. She breaks professional code and asks her client for sex....her biggest client no less. Let's not pretend she's a saint or isn't at least somewhat self serving too.
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This demonstrates an element of character development and part of the enjoyment(?), or at least a necessary process, in drawing one into an AVN and investing in the character and the story - past, present and future. If everything was plain, simple and "black and white", there would be nothing to hold you're attention (unless you're only in it for the lewds).
Reality is often vague and hard to get a grip on - sometimes you want to escape that and is why we have sports, entertainment (wait, those are bad examples these days...
), but such things don't hold your attention or feed your mind very long or very much. Unraveling a character and a story (that has occasional and well done sexy scenes) helps to feed AND entertain the brain. Somehow, to me at least, that is more fulfilling and enjoyable than "meet LI1, fuck LI1; meet LI2 fuck LI2 etc.," so on, so forth until the second round with each when you add anal to the mix. Many of these AVNs are so damn predictable - that's why I like the ones more like the books I read - there's an element that makes you think and use your brain.Maybe I went off on a little bit of a tangent or this response seems like a non sequitur, but it is what came to my mind (it has very few straight lines). Basically, without a little bit of confusion at times, stories and characters get too predictable and just aren't worth the time - leave 2D characters for 2D stories; give 3D stories 3D characters, ambiguities and all.
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Well, those double standards doesn't speak for you and your friends. It's 2023, dude. Women have the same rights and can act the same ways like men. Okay, not everywhere. There are many uncivilised and backwarded places on this planet. The problem are men with such hypocritical views not women acting the same like men does for centuries.
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No, I don't think you went on too far and I fully agree with your points, just not for a MC, that the players are supposed to take control of.This demonstrates an element of character development and part of the enjoyment(?), or at least a necessary process, in drawing one into an AVN and investing in the character and the story - past, present and future. If everything was plain, simple and "black and white", there would be nothing to hold you're attention (unless you're only in it for the lewds).
Reality is often vague and hard to get a grip on - sometimes you want to escape that and is why we have sports, entertainment (wait, those are bad examples these days...
Maybe I went off on a little bit of a tangent or this response seems like a non sequitur, but it is what came to my mind (it has very few straight lines). Basically, without a little bit of confusion at times, stories and characters get too predictable and just aren't worth the time - leave 2D characters for 2D stories; give 3D stories 3D characters, ambiguities and all.
I love me a good mystery and I really look forward to find out more about Kana, Ines, Els and Serena. This game in particular has a really good handle on how fast it develops the characters and at what speed.
But all of that changes when it's the character you are supposed to make decisions for, at least for me. I always try to stay true to the story the developer has created, but when you only know that there was some trauma, it becomes tricky to know what's what.
We never got a baseline of how and who the MC was before the game starts, so we can't gauge how, whatever happened, effected him, and to what place we would like him to return, to find some serenity and peace.
And don't missunderstand, I'm not blaming the developer, he is the only one who has the whole picture, and when he created the entire story in his head it was complete and not in chapters, so it's really all about the process of game development.
I still believe it was a risky decision though, since in my opinion the MC is the one character you should be able to emphasize/symphasize with right from the start. Maybe if it was me, I would have added a 10-20 render intro that outlines his history and then remove it once I release the whole game on steam or any other plattform, it's somewhat of a "cheap" fix but it could've drawn more attention to this marvel of a game and maximised its chances to get support.
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And I don't mind that part, even for the MC - you get to decide where the MC is, why, and where the MC is headed. If developments further along cause you to reevaluate your perspective and how you might have approached things if you'd known newly revealed information earlier, it gives you an opportunity to extend the game (if it's one you basically enjoy to begin with) and replay that character using a different approach.
Because I don't know everything up front, I tend to start multiple paths with different approaches as soon as I "meet" the MC. One path is always "how would I react naturally", while the others take me down other rabbit holes.
For this AVN, I have paths where MC is an unrepentant man-ho with a completely surly attitude, and other paths where he always tries to avoid being a dick. The extremes in this AVN so far aren't as far apart as in some others I've encountered, but there is a range and playing at different points on that range make things fun.
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I can see how this approach counters the lack of information the players have by the players putting in more effort, but it also circumvents the meaning of choice.
I just don't see how the players learning that their choices have been in tune with who the MC is retrospectively, adds anything but confusion to the story. But I respect your opinion and understand your point of view, and if you prefer a layer of darkness around the MC and you filling out all edges by using multiple paths then that certainly takes care of any ambiguity that occurs as we learn more.
Also going to need to agree to massively disagree on this stuff. We clearly have very different world-views and life experiences.
So going back to Serena specifically, I will agree somewhat in principal that there are likely things we don't know about her yet. Everything we've seen so far points to her being a good friend to the MC and the other girls. Doing good outwardly doesn't always make one a good person necessarily... she could be a serial killer in her spare time for all we know and the charity stuff is a front.
But as of now, there's nothing to indicate that she's not the good person she seems to be either.Can someone remind me if it's been made clear how much of a playboy he actually was vs. his reputation? I recall in the beginning there were lines where he indicated his old ways were indeed sleeping around (which means little since he's so ridiculously hard on himself) but then as things progressed usually when his reputation came up it seemed a lot less clear whether he genuinely was or whether a lot of the reputation just had to do with the one celebrity ex-gf debacle.
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Other than her actions I listed a few posts before the only real description comes from Els.So going back to Serena specifically, I will agree somewhat in principal that there are likely things we don't know about her yet. Everything we've seen so far points to her being a good friend to the MC and the other girls. Doing good outwardly doesn't always make one a good person necessarily... she could be a serial killer in her spare time for all we know and the charity stuff is a front.
"Reenie is a phenomenal attorney, with a heart of gold and a brain like a steel trap."
I think the most accurate account of truth vs reputation comes from Amrith when she recalls all the women the MC hooked up with as they traveled through asia and then later at their home, when she discusses the MC's exploits with Vi and Ines. But she also says he stoped a few months ago and that the MC seems "burned out". So he probably did sleep around a lot but then stoped on his own accord without us knowing why.
- Dec 27, 2017
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Some preview pics from the developer at Patreon:
Sneak Peek 04/02/2023
A nice little batch of renders today to start off our April, including a dash of Kana, media day, and the lovely Julia showing off the new UKFA uniform.
Thank you as always for the support and I hope you have a wonderful April.
Sláinte!
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Sneak Peek 04/02/2023
A nice little batch of renders today to start off our April, including a dash of Kana, media day, and the lovely Julia showing off the new UKFA uniform.
Thank you as always for the support and I hope you have a wonderful April.
Sláinte!
- Dec 12, 2017
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Thanks Walter for always providing the goodies, you rock bro!!!
Love the kana preview, middle one is a bit meh and the bottom ... is that the 2nd ring girl ?
- Dec 27, 2017
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I used to watch a lot of MMA, but lately I've been out of the loop, so someone help me, is the media day always in the same city where the event takes place ?
Many of the other preview pics we got looked a lot like they are on Mallorca, but that skyline looks like it's anywhere but Mallorca. Maybe I'm just realism-anal and the dev just took any skyline pic he could find or had laying around or maybe it's London and the media day always takes place where the organisation is located ?
Many of the other preview pics we got looked a lot like they are on Mallorca, but that skyline looks like it's anywhere but Mallorca. Maybe I'm just realism-anal and the dev just took any skyline pic he could find or had laying around or maybe it's London and the media day always takes place where the organisation is located ?
Why is Kana wearing boxing gloves? Is she going to try hitting other show wrestlers for real?