SquallofNight

Newbie
Jan 21, 2024
87
676
Personally, I'd be fine if Cole lives just so long as we get to deflate his ego some. "I know we've both been itching for this"? Cole, the MC has met with you all of twice. The sum total of your interactions is probably less than five minutes. You're not his nemesis just because you've gone "booga booga boo, I'm so scary and you better watch out for me", he has shown absolutely no concern for what you might be up to. Not a single scene has had him spare a thought for Cole. I'd be okay with Cole escaping (if a bit disappointed, I'd still prefer that he dies), but I absolutely need a dialogue option to tell him how little he mattered to the MC up until this very moment.
Holy shit, you're right! I never thought about it, but MC only comment about Cole was asking about Ella's kids to Christie LMAO.
Their only interactions with "hostility" to each other was Laurie (in the talkshow, you can provoke him, be neutral or just be friendly, and the last one leaves him with the biggest poker face).
Bitchboy heard Ella talk so much about MC (if she already talked so much about him to Jake, imagine to her kids) that he took it personal and now wants to claime the nemesis title.
 

FakeTemplar

Newbie
May 9, 2023
92
242
Man i replay the update again from the very begining making sure i do everything right end up with 579 power 47 skill and 38 corruption, but watching that ending again sucked and has me wondering i dont know about amber but how do liz ever would come back from that i mean she is half a head man how WW is gonna do it i cant tell honestly
Maybe not easy, but definitely possible.
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Rutonat

Well-Known Member
Sep 28, 2020
1,769
3,593
Evolving is off the tables for a while. WW mentioned on Stream (don't remember which one) that he hasn't drawn MC in his 4th yet, so MC probably isn't evolving in this fight. Besides, Cole isn't enough to require an Evo (even w/weapon), we'll be giving him the beating of a lifetime.
Well, the intense emotional state of the MC right now, and the fact his opponent is armed with a tailor-made weapon to boost his own power, would be grounds enough to trigger some massive power surge, up to an evolution. Can't blame me for considering it.
Plus, nothing says that WeirdWorld isn't going to change their minds on that and give him some sort of power boost, even if it doesn't go as far as evolution.

Though it would be extremely satisfaying to have him evolved to obliterate the little cunt.

Maybe not easy, but definitely possible.
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Don't forget that
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Apr 17, 2024
75
240
Holy shit, you're right! I never thought about it, but MC only comment about Cole was asking about Ella's kids to Christie LMAO.
Their only interactions with "hostility" to each other was Laurie (in the talkshow, you can provoke him, be neutral or just be friendly, and the last one leaves him with the biggest poker face).
Bitchboy heard Ella talk so much about MC (if she already talked so much about him to Jake, imagine to her kids) that he took it personal and now wants to claime the nemesis title.
I know, right? It's why I can't bring myself to hate Cole. His animosity for the MC is so one-sided, he comes across as more comedic to me than anything else. He's clearly built this relationship up in his head into something it isn't, because he's jealous that Ella gave someone other than him attention. I just want someone to let him in on the joke he's become.
 

SquallofNight

Newbie
Jan 21, 2024
87
676
Well, the intense emotional state of the MC right now, and the fact his opponent is armed with a tailor-made weapon to boost his own power, would be grounds enough to trigger some massive power surge, up to an evolution. Can't blame me for considering it.
Plus, nothing says that WeirdWorld isn't going to change their minds on that and give him some sort of power boost, even if it doesn't go as far as evolution.

Though it would be extremely satisfaying to have him evolved to obliterate the little cunt.
Oh no, i 100% agree w/you.
The power boost could come from the memories MC has gathered, remember when he woke up he was going haywire because of it (he even comments on being "power poisoned" as in: there's so much power going through his body that it's actually hurting him). So it could be something like that to boost him instead of an Evo.

Don't forget that
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The Strength Eaters can "Space Jump" through bodies of water, so blood or any liquid could work similarly (or this be a unique variation to her). If you would like to hear my theory for this:
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adanu

Member
Mar 28, 2020
135
235
Same to you. If you want to debate in good faith, all for it. But don't pretend you did not start this by essentially telling me my opinion is invalid because I view the twins as, in your words "morality pets".

Reduce my opinion to a straw man, get called out on it, then act offended.

I will afford you the same respect you afford me. Act like a dick, I will treat you as one. Have a nice day.
I never said your argument is invalid. I submitted that the argument is weak and demeaning to the characters in general, making them not-persons but rather a chain on the main character.

There was never any implication of invalidation on my part.
 
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adanu

Member
Mar 28, 2020
135
235
Evolving is off the tables for a while. WW mentioned on Stream (don't remember which one) that he hasn't drawn MC in his 4th yet, so MC probably isn't evolving in this fight. Besides, Cole isn't enough to require an Evo (even w/weapon), we'll be giving him the beating of a lifetime.
We've barely had any serious fights with the MC at level 3 using tentacles and his new powers. It'd be pretty ridiculous to not see something badass from the MC before an evo.
 

Ddlc

Member
Jun 22, 2017
293
995
Cole's rivalry to Mc is laughable to be honest, before the twins i had a lot of things against him on a personal level but no reason to actually want him dead. After all he is a bully, he puts his own people at risk, he resorts to violence when it's harmful to his cause, he is an hypocrite who only cares about people being experimented on when it's himself under the knife, and furthermore he is a coward who dares to threaten people stronger than him just to not follow through and look like a clown.
A despicable charater ? yes but even villains can be engaging, Thanos i can respect, even Langdon makes a good impression but Cole ???
He seems like somenone you need to teach humility not like a powerful enemy you need to defeat no matter the cost, its quite pathetic.

By the way i see a lot of people bringing up his new weapon, but do we really need to even worry about that ?, Mc has been testing his skill against absolute monsters like Michael and Val, last update he can even absorb a memory of an alt-human fighting with nine arms, back in the day he could deal with Klaus plasma spear just because Klaus didn't have enough training, there is no way Cole is much better.
Even if his knife fucks you up by a simple touch Val's Dark Gouge and Michael's Crimson Knife operate the same it's not new, if Evander antimatter couldn't destroy Mc in a single strike and he just kept coming back what hope Cole even has ?
The way i see Cole either won't be able to explode Mc like before or will give up after realizing it's pointless, regular flames are useless against Mc heavy armor so he will try close range with his knife, which is stupid because Cole has no regeneration and being at Mantis Blade distance will kill him.
This guys is thoughly fucked, he needs to evolve or simply die.
 

weezal

Member
Jul 5, 2022
467
834
Cole's rivalry to Mc is laughable to be honest, before the twins i had a lot of things against him on a personal level but no reason to actually want him dead. After all he is a bully, he puts his own people at risk, he resorts to violence when it's harmful to his cause, he is an hypocrite who only cares about people being experimented on when it's himself under the knife, and furthermore he is a coward who dares to threaten people stronger than him just to not follow through and look like a clown.
A despicable charater ? yes but even villains can be engaging, Thanos i can respect, even Langdon makes a good impression but Cole ???
He seems like somenone you need to teach humility not like a powerful enemy you need to defeat no matter the cost, its quite pathetic.

By the way i see a lot of people bringing up his new weapon, but do we really need to even worry about that ?, Mc has been testing his skill against absolute monsters like Michael and Val, last update he can even absorb a memory of an alt-human fighting with nine arms, back in the day he could deal with Klaus plasma spear just because Klaus didn't have enough training, there is no way Cole is much better.
Even if his knife fucks you up by a simple touch Val's Dark Gouge and Michael's Crimson Knife operate the same it's not new, if Evander antimatter couldn't destroy Mc in a single strike and he just kept coming back what hope Cole even has ?
The way i see Cole either won't be able to explode Mc like before or will give up after realizing it's pointless, regular flames are useless against Mc heavy armor so he will try close range with his knife, which is stupid because Cole has no regeneration and being at Mantis Blade distance will kill him.
This guys is thoughly fucked, he needs to evolve or simply die.
I would greatly enjoy if Cole did evolve but still got his ass kicked, that would be the most cathartic end imo. True humiliation.
 

Simpgor

Active Member
Apr 18, 2020
818
2,220
According to the first(?) stream WW did we know that at the very least the "player" will be getting at least some of Cole's backstory, while WW didnt make it clear if MC would be seeing it or if it would be extra context for us (like some of klaus stuff was "seen/told" to MC while some is not yet we still see it)

if you throw him a 4th evo (the one that would give him a redesign) in the same fight I feel like the (narrative) chances of killing him go down quite a bit :BootyTime:, on top of that you also have to consider that unless Ella Doll and MC are done interacting for the foreseeable future she has to return to the MC before he leaves the dimension which means the chances of Cole seeing her are pretty high IMO.
 
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TheOneZR

Newbie
May 4, 2023
30
69
34 days until june and time is gonna pass very slowly at least that is gonna feel like it as it is with good things
 
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Apr 17, 2024
75
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So, my mind wandered as I was out jogging and I came up with a theory that kind of ballooned into a crazy string of connections. Looking back through the search function I don't think anyone has proposed this before, but I might be wrong. In either case, my crazy theory:

The Lord of the Dark is the Great Lord of the sea-dweller alternate humans.

Here's my logic:

A theory I've seen thrown around is that the Lord of Dark, despite being the one in charge of the Dark trait, is not actually the 7th Apostle but something that took their place. Aglaecwif lists the Lord as something separate from the 12 Apostles when talking about the gods the monsters worship. She also calls the Lord of Dark by the alternate titles of "God Slayer" and "Apostle Devourer", so that raises the possibility that the Lord of Dark has authority over Dark by right of conquest, and killed the actual 7th Apostle to consume their power.

So why the Great Lord of the sea-dwellers as this usurper? Well, for one thing, it just fits his character. The Lord of Dark has declared war against the gods, in the name of severing their parasitic connections to other life and freeing the cosmos from them. The Great Lord of the sea-dwellers fought a war against the gods to prevent them from binding his people in their parasitic connections and making them slaves or worse. Plus, they're both called "Lord". Maybe that's a spurious argument, but it would be odd for a narrative to have two guys called the same thing with the same motivations that have no connection at all.

In terms of more specific connections, we know the Lord of Dark has a dead wife. He says as much to Valravn when turning him into a monster, that he's doing it in memory of his bride. Meanwhile, the Great Queen of the sky-dwellers, the Great Lord's counterpart, appears to have died before their war with the monsters was over. In the memory we see in the second Nyx dream, the sky-dwellers are motivated by sorrow and the Great Lord is fighting on his own. The Great Queen dying would fit that.

On a related note, the memory refers to the sky-dweller warriors as "valkyries". The mythical valkyries, the demigoddesses that took the brave to Valhalla, were accompanied by ravens. So the Lord of Dark selected a raven as his Chosen in memory of his bride, and the Great Queen had warriors whose names evoke a connection to ravens. That feels meaningful, to me. Hell, valravns and valkyries even come from the same cultural background and are etymologically related. The "val-" prefix translates to "of the slain". Valravns are the ravens of the slain, valkyries are the choosers of the slain.

Also, the Vestige spoken to in the dream accompanying Heri up the tower can be asked about Henri, and says this: "His like has not been seen since the time of our people. Of our great lord...If properly wielded, even a god would not hesitate to bring down their full might in opposition. As was the case with our great lord. We are surprised he has been allowed to live. His like have been reviled since our fall." So the great lord was a superhuman of the same incredibly strong sort as Henri, one that the gods themselves had to fight with all their might, and that after the fall of the alt-humans his kind were considered a priority target for elimination. It sounds like something the Great Lord did in that battle made them warry of his sort of being. Something like killing an Apostle and consuming it, perhaps?

Additionally, if you prescribe to the theory that Henri is a dual-spawn and his "lost power of a forgotten god" is an Arbiter trait, that furthers the comparison to the Great Lord, as the alt-humans seem to have had access to an Arbiter trait. Going back to the second Nyx dream, the memory shows that the alt-humans were working on a soul-powered weapon for the Great Lord. Soul is the Arbiter trait composed of Dark and Light. Nyx even says, when activating the soul orb she harvests from the ruins "Heh. The dark, the light, and...". That implies a thesis-antithesis-synthesis relationship and that it is indeed the Soul that's being invoked and not just some other means of manipulating soul energy, like whatever Nyx herself uses.

So, then, to summarize, my theory is that the Lord of Dark originated as particularly powerful superhuman in the sea-dweller civilization. He ascended to the position of their ruler, made peace with the queen of the sky-dwellers, and cemented the union between their peoples with a marriage. Together they led their peoples against the monsters, but she died and he was left to face them on his own. Against the odds he managed to defeat the 7th Apostle, consuming it and taking its power for his own. But his people fell, and now he's waging his war single-handedly.

Or maybe he's something else entirely. But the more I thought about this the weirder it seemed for these things to not be connected, so here's my big scrawling conspiracy wall of a theory. I look forward to people poking at my logic.
 
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Sayajin2205

Member
Apr 21, 2022
353
1,526
I
So, my mind wandered as I was out jogging and I came up with a theory that kind of ballooned into a crazy string of connections. Looking back through the search function I don't think anyone has proposed this before, but I might be wrong. In either case, my crazy theory:

The Lord of the Dark is the Great Lord of the sea-dweller alternate humans.

Here's my logic:

A theory I've seen thrown around is that the Lord of Dark, despite being the one in charge of the Dark trait, is not actually the 7th Apostle but something that took their place. Aglaecwif lists the Lord as something separate from the 12 Apostles when talking about the gods the monsters worship. She also calls the Lord of Dark by the alternate titles of "God Slayer" and "Apostle Devourer", so that raises the possibility that the Lord of Dark has authority over Dark by right of conquest, and killed the actual 7th Apostle to consume their power.

So why the Great Lord of the sea-dwellers as this usurper? Well, for one thing, it just fits his character. The Lord of Dark has declared war against the gods, in the name of severing their parasitic connections to other life and freeing the cosmos from them. The Great Lord of the sea-dwellers fought a war against the gods to prevent them from binding his people in their parasitic connections and making them slaves or worse. Plus, they're both called "Lord". Maybe that's a spurious argument, but it would be odd for a narrative to have two guys called the same thing with the same motivations that have no connection at all.

In terms of more specific connections, we know the Lord of Dark has a dead wife. He says as much to Valravn when turning him into a monster, that he's doing it in memory of his bride. Meanwhile, the Great Queen of the sky-dwellers, the Great Lord's counterpart, appears to have died before their war with the monsters was over. In the memory we see in the second Nyx dream, the sky-dwellers are motivated by sorrow and the Great Lord is fighting on his own. The Great Queen dying would fit that.

On a related note, the memory refers to the sky-dweller warriors as "valkyries". The mythical valkyries, the demigoddesses that took the brave to Valhalla, were accompanied by ravens. So the Lord of Dark selected a raven as his Chosen in memory of his bride, and the Great Queen had warriors whose names evoke a connection to ravens. That feels meaningful, to me. Hell, valravns and valkyries even come from the same cultural background and are etymologically related. The "val-" prefix translates to "of the slain". Valravns are the ravens of the slain, valkyries are the choosers of the slain.

Also, the Vestige spoken to in the dream accompanying Heri up the tower can be asked about Henri, and says this: "His like has not been seen since the time of our people. Of our great lord...If properly wielded, even a god would not hesitate to bring down their full might in opposition. As was the case with our great lord. We are surprised he has been allowed to live. His like have been reviled since our fall." So the great lord was a superhuman of the same incredibly strong sort as Henri, one that the gods themselves had to fight with all their might, and that after the fall of the alt-humans his kind were considered a priority target for elimination. It sounds like something the Great Lord did in that battle made them warry of his sort of being. Something like killing an Apostle and consuming it, perhaps?

Additionally, if you prescribe to the theory that Henri is a dual-spawn and his "lost power of a forgotten god" is an Arbiter trait, that furthers the comparison to the Great Lord, as the alt-humans seem to have had access to an Arbiter trait. Going back to the second Nyx dream, the memory shows that the alt-humans were working on a soul-powered weapon for the Great Lord. Soul is the Arbiter trait composed of Dark and Light. Nyx even says, when activating the soul orb she harvests from the ruins "Ah. The Dark, the Light, and...". That implies a thesis-antithesis-synthesis relationship and that it is indeed the Soul that's being invoked and not just some other means of manipulating soul energy, like whatever Nyx herself uses.

So, then, to summarize, my theory is that the Lord of Dark originated as particularly powerful superhuman in the sea-dweller civilization. He ascended to the position of their ruler, made peace with the queen of the sky-dwellers, and cemented the union between their peoples with a marriage. Together they led their peoples against the monsters, but she died and he was left to face them on his own. Against the odds he managed to defeat the 7th Apostle, consuming it and taking its power for his own. But his people fell, and now he's waging his war single-handedly.

Or maybe he's something else entirely. But the more I thought about this the weirder it seemed for these things to not be connected, so here's my big scrawling conspiracy wall of a theory. I look forward to people poking at my logic.
I might be tripping but I thought WW already said lord of the dark and the 7th are the same he just uses the name interchangeably.
 
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