Ren'Py Abandoned Teacher's Pets [v2.06.1] [irredeemable]

[bradb87]

Bwa ha ha ha ha, My twisted imagination has just had a series of spoilers appear that I will post just to ruin the experience for people. You have been WARNED.

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HA, I warned you all and you didn't listen. Now you have had those surprises ruined.

TY to the testers, Mods and Deem for the work and hints (while not spoiling things).

I'm not looking. I'm not looking. I'm not looking. I'm not loo...

Fuck, I looked. That's it. Ruined.

 

[jackkane]

1.7 Previews (big thx to @Ryahn for gathering them)

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man those titties are huge...I think it's that female teacher you fuck at the gym.

 

[Storm4n]

Bwa ha ha ha ha, My twisted imagination has just had a series of spoilers appear that I will post just to ruin the experience for people. You have been WARNED.

Spoiler

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

HA, I warned you all and you didn't listen. Now you have had those surprises ruined.

TY to the testers, Mods and Deem for the work and hints (while not spoiling things).

You... you monster! you've ruined it for me!

 

[lowcody]

Is the game now completely seduction based, or does the MC still use immoral techniques to get the girl? To me the main character's success with depraved strategies is what has always separated this game from more "vanilla" seduction games.

 

[Potato]

Is the game now completely seduction based, or does the MC still use immoral techniques to get the girl? To me the main character's success with depraved strategies is what has always separated this game from more "vanilla" seduction games.

Every girl has her own way, plus the dick choices are unique.

 

[Lenor]

If you have to consistently lock the thread and ban people from commenting maybe people have legitimate concerns that should be allowed to be discussed.

That makes too much sense, get out of here!

 

[Oysteren]

Not that it's the fault of the moderators of this forum, but this excessive nagging and conspiracy theories are largely deems fault. There is nothing wrong about missing a deadline every once in a while. It happens. I think the reason that people are getting so suspicious is that he kept on stating that it would be out by the end of the year, even up until a few days before. Then it turns out that there is shit-loads of work left a week later, once people are given more insight into the details, clearly in order to "calm them down."

It all makes sense from deems perspective, I suppose. It's not that uncommon to misjudge deadlines, and quite a few people have a need not to disappoint. Once the deadline has been breached, it makes sense to try to calm people down by showing them details to debunk their concern. The problem is, that it's also exactly what one would do if the project was abandoned, and you wanted to string people along until the next payment was due.

I can't really claim to have a solution. The circumstances surrounding the deadline are unfortunate enough that it makes sense for this to have some impact on deems trustworthiness among his patrons. His income might, therefore, take a hit. Now, I get that you don't much feel like having this thread be clogged with people whining on and on about this, but it's really only one person who is to blame for the state of affairs. It therefore makes sense for people to have a place to vent their frustration and semi-reasonable doubts.

I do, however, think that the only reasonable conclusion to any debate is: If you don't trust him anymore, that makes sense. Feel free to cancel your donations until release. As long as deem redeems himself before next payment is due, there is no problem. And if he doesn't ... well, then their suspicions were well grounded.

PS: I hope this isn't one of those posts you have to delete. I just wanted to share my opinion on the whole matter, hopefully in a reasonable way. Personally, I am looking forward to finding out how the game looks in 2.0, and don't much care about all the drama.

 

[ltpika]

I hope the MC's personality doesn't change. I like that he is an unashamed perv.

 

[SlapHappy]

Plain and simple the dev's, Deem especially, has handled this whole situation very, very badly, no PR skills at all. When it started I was so excited because TP was my favorite game and I wanted to see what they'd do with it but now I just don't care, or only a very tiny bit anyways. It's coming? Meh.

How many times do you get to lie to your financial supporters and say "really soon", "within a few days", "by the end of year", etc. and then 3 weeks later it's "I've still got lots of work to do" before people realize you're just full of shit and stop giving you money for words that mean nothing?

When it is actually publicly released I'll believe these lying dev's, maybe...

Edit - this was meant to be constructive criticism not 'bitching and moaning', I spent years running a PR department for a multinational and there are so many ways this situation could have been handled very well but instead they chose the worst way - lying to the people financially supporting their venture.

If something like this happens again it's better to just say "we don't know when it will be done because we are constantly tweaking and changing things as we go and trying to make sure that when we do release it that it will be everything you want and expect it to be. It could be a week or it could be a month, please be patient and we assure you the end result will be worth the wait. Thank you for your continued support."

 

[Pantisocrat]

because people might like this game and would hate to see it go down the drain?

I might be misunderstanding you, but it seems like you're asking me to picture someone who doesn't trust the dev, but likes the game, and thinks they can somehow like, save the game or something, by expressing their doubts about the dev on a pirate forum that represents at best a very small percentage of the dev's actual backers. Maybe there are people who feel that way, but if there are, their way of thinking is so clearly mistaken that there's no point indulging them. If deem is lying/whatever, I just don't see how yelling about it on F95zone is going to make any difference.

Regardless, the mods have seemingly spoken and deem is being given a shot. If it all goes tits-up and it turns out he's been lying and like, bribing people to support his lies (note to prospective malicious devs - I will accept such bribes and my rates are highly competitive) then I guess we'll just have to live with it. I don't see what we gain by having a bunch of people screaming about it beforehand. Other hand, if deem is being truthful, we're definitely going through a lot of hassle and stress with paranoid accusations being hurled about the place. There's no upside to allowing it in the worst case scenario and plenty of downside no matter what.

 

[lowcody]

I hope the MC's personality doesn't change. I like that he is an unashamed perv.

This is so true for me too. I also prefer it when the females (particularly in the case of Meghan's character) maintain a decent amount of innocence instead of turning into complete sluts like most corruption games.

 

[Dasati]

Is the game now completely seduction based, or does the MC still use immoral techniques to get the girl? To me the main character's success with depraved strategies is what has always separated this game from more "vanilla" seduction games.

Mind control is out, but the MC is still a lying, depraved, underhanded dick lol Depends on the girl though, e.g with Meghan things have to be done gently coz of her shyness whilst Kaitlyn has a more brazen attitude and responds better to a more devil may care approach.

 

[Lotex]

Plain and simple the dev's, Deem especially, has handled this whole situation very, very badly, no PR skills at all. When it started I was so excited because TP was my favorite game and I wanted to see what they'd do with it but now I just don't care, or only a very tiny bit anyways. It's coming? Meh.

The whole situation is just too conveniant to believe for a lot of people, one thing happened and another and another to someone who's pretty much a nobody if you don't know this game. It's not like he has the script for something like the new Star Wars, Harry Potter or whatever movie, but if you leave everything that was before the end of the year aside and just take the last few days of 2017 and the beginning of 2018 into account it's clear that, as you said, mistakes were made, either miscommunication or miscalculation. Pair this with no statement that clears things up about the first version only being a very buggy alpha one and still some things to patch up like bad renders or something like this and you get the mess that this thread is at the moment.
A simple statement of maybe 3 or 4 sentences of himself and not just the peons would've probably been enough to calm the situation down a bit so it doesn't escalalate left and right, but nothing like this really happened and that leaves people worried and unsatisfied, even if they're not patrons. Oh and this whole "you don't pledge so you're not allowed to complain" is utter bullshit by the way, this is a forum that is based on exchange and communication and if two people talk about how poor the situation was handled that is still a discussion, albeit a negative one and NOT a complaint. It would be complaint if people message Irredeemable directly. For now let's just hope that this'll be a warning for the next time something similar happens and the situation will be handled in a different fashion.

 

[Oysteren]

I might be misunderstanding you, but it seems like you're asking me to picture someone who doesn't trust the dev, but likes the game, and thinks they can somehow like, save the game or something, by expressing their doubts about the dev on a pirate forum that represents at best a very small percentage of the dev's actual backers. Maybe there are people who feel that way, but if there are, their way of thinking is so clearly mistaken that there's no point indulging them. If deem is lying/whatever, I just don't see how yelling about it on F95zone is going to make any difference.

Regardless, the mods have seemingly spoken and deem is being given a shot. If it all goes tits-up and it turns out he's been lying and like, bribing people to support his lies (note to prospective malicious devs - I will accept such bribes and my rates are highly competitive) then I guess we'll just have to live with it. I don't see what we gain by having a bunch of people screaming about it beforehand. Other hand, if deem is being truthful, we're definitely going through a lot of hassle and stress with paranoid accusations being hurled about the place. There's no upside to allowing it in the worst case scenario and plenty of downside no matter what.

There might very well be backers here. Furthermore, people might be interested in finding out whether it's worth waiting around for/checking every once in a while or not. Even if the opposite is true, people generally respond better to being heard than to being stifled. I repeat, delete stuff that is pure spam, but let people get a channel to air their legitimate grievances, either in this thread or by creating a thread for it.

Btw, no one is saying that people should be "yelling about it on F95zone", nor "screaming about it beforehand". I'm saying people should be allowed to have this kind of level-headed discussion about the topic. ... because this is a forum ... and this is a thread about the game. It follows that discussion about the probability of the existence of the game is of interest, even if it's only to get people to calm the fuck down. Even if there is no discussion worth having, people's position should still be acknowledged when they are told to calm the fuck down, given that the dev is responsible for things going tits-up to begin with. The "angry mob" if we imagine that there is one, therefore has good reason to be angry, even if their anger is impotent at solving the issue.

 

[botc76]

This is all so ridiculous.
I remember every update having bugs and needing fixes. Everybody should be aware of the problem that Irredeemable had with patreon and he stated how much that had gotten to him, then there was this whole business with the hacker attack on his homepage.

He lost his drive for a while, understandably and he didn't lie about that.
Then he started working on it and yes, it took him a bit longer to finish the alpha, then as SEVERAL testers and mods here have attested there were unforeseen problems with game-breaking bugs happening.

That is a perfectly understandable and reasonable explanation for any delay and yet people here come up with ridiculous conspiracy theories, accuse other posters and mods here of lying, of being bribed by the dev to lie...

What a load of bullshit. Even if this was nothing but laziness on his part, even if all the criticism was valid, since when does one single fucking instance of screwing up validate so much anger, so many attacks?

There are a lot of devs who constantly push back deadlines, who vanish for months and have no problem cashing in the money despite that.

I would understand it if some of his high tier patreons complained, but the way the guy gets attacked here, by people who just want to consume his work without doing anything for it seems completely out of proportions, if you consider that we have the 8th of January today, so we are not even talking about a delay of 2 weeks here AND with good reasons.

I think many people here don't get that we are talking about devs here that do the work alone or almost alone.
This isn't EA or Ubisoft, these aren't triple-A games. These aren't experienced programmers in the first place. Wonky builds and bugs are to be expected, personal shit will influence development.

Of course the dev has an obligation to his patreon backers, but not to every Tom, Dick and Harry here.

 

[Oysteren]

This is all so ridiculous.
I remember every update having bugs and needing fixes. Everybody should be aware of the problem that Irredeemable had with patreon and he stated how much that had gotten to him, then there was this whole business with the hacker attack on his homepage.

He lost his drive for a while, understandably and he didn't lie about that.
Then he started working on it and yes, it took him a bit longer to finish the alpha, then as SEVERAL testers and mods here have attested there were unforeseen problems with game-breaking bugs happening.

That is a perfectly understandable and reasonable explanation for any delay and yet people here come up with ridiculous conspiracy theories, accuse other posters and mods here of lying, of being bribed by the dev to lie...

What a load of bullshit. Even if this was nothing but laziness on his part, even if all the criticism was valid, since when does one single fucking instance of screwing up validate so much anger, so many attacks?

There are a lot of devs who constantly push back deadlines, who vanish for months and have no problem cashing in the money despite that.

I would understand it if some of his high tier patreons complained, but the way the guy gets attacked here, by people who just want to consume his work without doing anything for it seems completely out of proportions, if you consider that we have the 8th of January today, so we are not even talking about a delay of 2 weeks here AND with good reasons.

I think many people here don't get that we are talking about devs here that do the work alone or almost alone.
This isn't EA or Ubisoft, these aren't triple-A games. These aren't experienced programmers in the first place. Wonky builds and bugs are to be expected, personal shit will influence development.

Of course the dev has an obligation to his patreon backers, but not to every Tom, Dick and Harry here.

I think we may be speaking past each other. I'm at least not saying that he lies, nor that there is a conspiracy, nor that people should be angry with him. I'm saying, as I stated in my first post, that there have been a lot of mistakes made. Mostly on a PR-side of things. These poor marketing-choices explain people's distrust. It doesn't excuse bad behaviour that follows from this distrust, but it explains it, and should be handled. So no, all the anger that may have been flung his way (I haven't read all the previous comments, but ofc some of them were garbage) isn't warrented.

I will again point out that it's not the length of the delay that is the problem, but the constant waffling on when it will be out. If he made an update towards the end of the deadline, say a week or half a week before, that he wouldn't make it, but that he would try to have it done by the end of january, that would be fine. It would indicate that he had misjudged how much work was left. He did, on the other hand, claim that the game would be out by january 1. two days before the deadline, reinforcing the idea that it was almost done.

Now, I'll stop going on and on about it. It was simply bad PR. I'm not saying that people reacted in a good way, just that their reaction was understandable, and that handling their anger by giving a reasonable explaination for his actions (which I think I did in my first post) is better than just saying "Unforseen events!" and telling them to shut up.

 

[Potato]

There might very well be backers here. Furthermore, people might be interested in finding out whether it's worth waiting around for/checking every once in a while or not. Even if the opposite is true, people generally respond better to being heard than to being stifled. I repeat, delete stuff that is pure spam, but let people get a channel to air their legitimate grievances, either in this thread or by creating a thread for it.

Btw, no one is saying that people should be "yelling about it on F95zone", nor "screaming about it beforehand". I'm saying people should be allowed to have this kind of level-headed discussion about the topic. ... because this is a forum ... and this is a thread about the game. It follows that discussion about the probability of the existence of the game is of interest, even if it's only to get people to calm the fuck down. Even if there is no discussion worth having, people's position should still be acknowledged when they are told to calm the fuck down, given that the dev is responsible for things going tits-up to begin with. The "angry mob" if we imagine that there is one, therefore has good reason to be angry, even if their anger is impotent at solving the issue.

The angry mob here were people who expected the testers to leak, and were critizing the fact deem wasn't in normal release mode yet. These were people who didn't pay deem, and still expected a free copy yesterday. Those reactions were removed and people were banned. Claiming their critique is legitimate is rubbish, the Patrons who are on Discord actually understand the situation.

Deem polished his renders/animations in previous alphaperiods too, and he has even released 2 updates in one month last year. A lot of the critisism was factually incorrect, and uncalled for people who get a free game and progress reports in this thread.

The testers/admins of deem could also be quiet, we still get to see and test stuff beforehand, but the people in this forum won't be in the loop anymore. Please remember that deem was one of the most active devs on this forum. And after the release/rewrite will probably return again when he's done polishing his work of art.

TL;DR People should stop critizing delays when they aren't paying, and welcome the info they get firsthand.

 

[fernandopoo]

...so let's begin this with my support, patience and understanding for the work, hard work, of creation. I've read the demands and complains of some people, and I really don't understand them. Perhaps, as an afterthought, it is because I don't pay a dime for this but they do. Then they should ask for refund or never put their money again on that or... But here, I assume it is free, work freely given, so as we say in my country "A caballo regalado, no le mires el diente", don't complain about a gift. It would be ungrateful and mostly stupid. So again thanks for the effort, looking forward for your results, and that is all, : )

 

[LeopoldWilliamReynolds]

Isn't f95zone a forum where people share pirated games and comics or am I missing something?

Yeah, we share, we appreciate, and we keep our heads down because we know that we're not entitled to anything. If you have a complaint, what do you get from sharing it here? What change can you possibly enact? "Well maybe some patrons frequent this site and will see this and remove their support" Oh yeah you're really opening eyes here. All those people who put money into the game are coming here to a pirate forum and just now learning that the game isn't out yet. It's not like they receive an email every time a Patreon update comes out or are aware of the things they pledge to. They need you to come here and fill the thread with accusations and passive aggressive "I'm just saying" comments.

 

[Oysteren]

The angry mob here were people who expected the testers to leak, and were critizing the fact deem wasn't in normal release mode yet. These were people who didn't pay deem, and still expected a free copy yesterday. Those reactions were removed and people were banned. Claiming their critique is legitimate is rubbish, the Patrons who are on Discord actually understand the situation.

Deem polished his renders/animations in previous alphaperiods too, and he has even released 2 updates in one month last year. A lot of the critisism was factually incorrect, and uncalled for people who get a free game and progress reports in this thread.

The testers/admins of deem could also be quiet, we still get to see and test stuff beforehand, but the people in this forum won't be in the loop anymore. Please remember that deem was one of the most active devs on this forum. And after the release/rewrite will probably return again when he's done polishing his work of art.

TL;DR People should stop critizing delays when they aren't paying, and welcome the info they get firsthand.

I'm not claiming that any previous critique is legitimate. I am arguing the case that people should be given some forum to air their grievances. If you actually read what you quoted, you would see that I only claim that the PR was bad, not the damn delays. I'm saying that this PR fluke is part of the cause of this backlash, or at least the intensity of the backlash.

Saying that it could have been handled even worse doesn't alleviate the poor handling. Now, I'm done arguing that it was handled poorly, I just think that it could be helpful for any developer to be made aware of where their mistakes may lie. It was not in the delay, it was in the waffling before and during the delay.