Well we could do that. But isn't speculation based on available clues half the fun for in-progress stories?
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- Apr 26, 2020
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Potato/Beating a dead horse..............Well we could do that. But isn't speculation based on available clues half the fun for in-progress stories?
sorry, I'll stop now, promise.......
- Oct 29, 2021
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Hey everyone,
I've seen other developers doing Q&As, and some even do it pretty regularly.
So why not try it myself and see how that goes
The first part will be collecting the questions (Duh!) and depending on how many there will be, I'll pick a bunch of them to answer (and keep the remaining ones for possible future Q&As). If there will come up questions, that is... ;-)
To ask your questions, you can either use the comment function here or the corresponding channel on
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.There are no limitations for the questions (for now) but limitations might apply to the answers. I won't answer any questions where the answer would contain spoilers.
Cheers,
Ceo
- Aug 4, 2022
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- May 11, 2020
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Well, yes, if you play the Fiona path, and tell her about Neverwhere, and are open to her, She shadows you, but is the MC himself who tells her, on the bench just before he goes to the exchange, she even asks him to call her when he is back,
- Feb 11, 2024
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Ok, most of my questions you won't be able to answer because of spoilers. But what I'd really like to know is - regarding Finnabar ... WTF dude?
- Feb 11, 2024
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Finnabar is another one of those situations like I mentioned yesterday, where rather than fading my initial emotional reaction intensified. When I left the human world I was angry with the Templars (angrier because I still think they're lying - I don't think that MCs "parents" are his actual parents and I think Kaija is there to protect the Templars from him as much as to protect him - to monitor him for signs of ______ I guess. (I don't think the succubus, and the elves and the Valkyrie are interested in him because he's the child of Templars.) So, I think they are still lying about everything basically.
Anyway, so when I left I was angry with them but now they killed Finnabar (my favorite li in the game so far) and so now, unless something else happens before MC goes back - I'll be returning like
Anyway, so when I left I was angry with them but now they killed Finnabar (my favorite li in the game so far) and so now, unless something else happens before MC goes back - I'll be returning like
My whole, and biggest problem, with both parents and Kaija, isn't that they kept secret.I have been talking about Kaija with a good friend I recently converted to Neverwhere. He was an ex-operative and disgreed that Kaija should have come clean earlier. Having been ex-military myself and worked for the government where secrets were concerned. I do concede and see the point re-Kaija and her work secrets. I agree with Mav who pointed out Steph in LOF was tied up with her job, and its a very tough situation. Hence why Steph was redeemed later in the story.
Here is the but, the Templar leadership wanted Kaija to get close to the MC. To Kaijas credit she said no she wouldn't do that. The MC's father went in to bat for her over the issue. After that was cleared up, Kaija was to persue her FRIENDSHIP with the MC. That was her orders.
Kaija didn't do that, She started a relationship anyway and then went the next step and moved in with him. Kaija decided to deceive the MC by becoming involved with the MC despite her orders not too. On all the paths she did this because it was, quote, easier. On the love path she falls in love with him later, but it doesn't matter. It's an asshole act by anyone, as Mav said, male or female. Even if the MC was gay and Kaija was a dude, its still a fucked up thing to deliberately do to someone. It has nothing to do with keeping secrets because of her job, she deliberately started that relationship and jumped in to bed with him to make it easy on herself with no thought of consequences for the MC. She did it contrary to her orders, because that issue was specifically dealt with at Council level. I wouldn't want her as a friend, let alone a life partner/wife in RL or a fantasy situation. Of course, the Templar council weren't going to complain because they wanted her to do that in the first place. That doesn't excuse Kaija.
I hope Kaija is redeemed, but I can't see a path to it, but Ceo has a pretty devious mind, so you never know in Neverwhere.
I think the parents are worse. That let their son get involved with a woman they know didn't love him (On all paths). How can you do that to your child. They should have intervened, removed Kaija and appointed someone else to watch over him. On the love path, just because she came to love him later, does not excuse them.
PS I love you too Mav
It always was, and always will be, they put their son (for Kaija, person she calls "friend"), in fake relationship.
That's insanely fucked up and I don't see redemption for her.
Oh, they can definitely work together to save the world, or whatever the big picture is, but being friends or in relationship? Never.
Hiding things? Sorry to disagree with some here, but I honestly see very little wrong with it. Heck, MC knew she's doing secret stuff and she can't tell him about it. That's fair.
Parents not telling him? Again, no big deal. They couldn't have known (initially) someone will go after MC in human world.
Letting a child live life outside of life-endangering environment is actually quite nice of them.
All parents had to do, to avoid this situation, was tell Kaija "Don't be in relationship with our son, it will hurt him beyond anything imaginable once he finds out". Not out of his life, just out of relationship.
But nope, they were happy with arrangement. Makes them sleep easy at night, knowing someone watches their son.
Fuck them.
Repeating example I mentioned hundred-ish pages ago.
Take situation (non-love path) into account.
MC is in fake relationship for few years, finds out his girlfriend is actually secret agent with him only to make her job easier, no real feelings for him.
Parents are happy with it because it helps them keep him safe.
Meanwhile, MC is in love with her. Perhaps, after 5 years, he even planned to propose.
Mentally? MC is now mentally scarred for the rest of his life.
All trust in women he meets from that point on will be heavily doubted, are they another agent sent to sleep with him to watch over him?
Do they like him, or are they there just to do their job?
The amount of fucked-up MC would be, living with that burden on his mind, would be insane.
Trust issues? Buddy, good chance he'd be fucking paranoid for years, with definite need for serious psychological help.
And all of that came with blessings of his parents.
For supposedly intelligent people, they sure did everything in their power to fuck up their sons life.
P.S. And all they had to do was ask Kaija: "Do you love our son?"
No = Stop relationship.
Yes = Fine, but be ready for heavy discussion one day.
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- Aug 20, 2023
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And thats why we say "Fuck Kaija".
Regarding the question to Kaija:
I guess she could also do all this of her own volition, so even if Templars asked she could deny everything and still continue with her self assigned mission of protecting the MC.
This is a good example of what was mentioned a few pages earlier, in that Kaija's past and the character of her relationship with MC is different depending on player choices, which makes discussing it hard unless you clarify which path you're using as a frame of reference. You did that here (non-love path), so that's not a criticism, just an observation that bears repeating.
Most of my comments have been from the perspective of choosing "love point" options, where the relationship and feelings are essentially organic and real even if the original reason for Kaija to spend as much time with MC was not (at least not entirely). However, from what I've seen, if I instead used the frame of reference where these aren't chosen and the relationship is truly fake, then I agree with many others here that what Kaija and MC's parents did was super shitty.
- May 11, 2020
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nitkonikic ; Well, ok It is a way to feel and see the whole situation,
regarding Parents Kaija; the so called unforgivable lie, ( more a hard blow on MC ego) is alone Kaijas responsability.
The Fater in the "Sofa chat admits that he took a clumsy decision, to put an end to the annoying argument of the council wheter or not Kaija should whore her self out (Hate path) or not, her first assignment was the protection of MC using the fact that they go to the same High School, and she is close enough as not to raise any suspicion, MC true Identity (potential heir of the Grand greatmaster title) was kept secret to the outerworld and to the MC himself, and his sister.
Edit: understand me right I consider all staces and angles as valid points, I just struggle with some aproaches, to empatize or to grasp, specially with the resentfull and avenging ones.
and to be clear, even if some get a good amount of desabiguation, the way someone plays the MC (as his avatar in an VN) is always under influence of his own IRL personality ,
regarding Parents Kaija; the so called unforgivable lie, ( more a hard blow on MC ego) is alone Kaijas responsability.
The Fater in the "Sofa chat admits that he took a clumsy decision, to put an end to the annoying argument of the council wheter or not Kaija should whore her self out (Hate path) or not, her first assignment was the protection of MC using the fact that they go to the same High School, and she is close enough as not to raise any suspicion, MC true Identity (potential heir of the Grand greatmaster title) was kept secret to the outerworld and to the MC himself, and his sister.
Edit: understand me right I consider all staces and angles as valid points, I just struggle with some aproaches, to empatize or to grasp, specially with the resentfull and avenging ones.
and to be clear, even if some get a good amount of desabiguation, the way someone plays the MC (as his avatar in an VN) is always under influence of his own IRL personality ,
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I think a lot of it depends on which path you got first time through.
Mine was 2/5 points (back when chapter 2 came out), thus no feelings. And honestly, I found that part shocking.
Sure, I expected her to be super soldier from the start, that much was obvious. For her to tell my MC she doesn't like him...fucking hell that was new and unexpected.
I find little to dislike about Kaija on her love path.
Sure, she entered relationship without romantic feelings (which is incredibly bad), but she came to love MC, came to doubt some of her orders and, while it will take time, that relationship can be redeemed.
Granted, I hate her guts and will never see that, even on high relationship runs I'm doing, but there is perfectly valid reason some like her here.
Parents are the ones I can't forgive on any of the paths.
On love path, Kaija entered relationship for wrong reasons and they couldn't know that will change.
On non-love path, it was messed up from start to finish, yet they did nothing.
You don't make a blow on someone's ego by faking long-term relationship with them, you fuck up their life.
Both parties are at fault here. Parents more than Kaija, though I hate both.
See my reply above for why I think Kaija is better than parents. Though that's super-low bar.
If you're referring to not telling him about Templars, that, in my opinion, is incredibly harmless and I have no problems with that part.
But it's not, she is there for her job and as they both said the relationship developed its own dynamic. It may be real but definitely not organic. Unless you are using organic in a different meaning than what it means originally.
Does anyone think otherwise here? I thought the main discussion was whether they are forgivable or not. Curios thing.
Someone said (long, long, long time ago) that parents are probably also trying to help Kaija live normal life.But it's not, she is there for her job and as they both said the relationship developed its own dynamic. It may be real but definitely not organic. Unless you are using organic in a different meaning than what it means originally.
Does anyone think otherwise here? I thought the main discussion was whether they are forgivable or not. Curios thing.
I agree with that part.
But I also think they tried to give her that normal life at the expense of their son, in both scenarios (love and non-love)
And for that, I'd never be able to forgive them.
- Feb 11, 2024
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I might need to replay it, but at least on the love path my understanding was that she refused to start a relationship just to be close. Therefore, she originally was spending time with MC just as a friend. And then, before she knew it and without intent, the friendship had become something more. So her spending time with MC as a friend was part of her mission, but that transition into a relationship wasn't planned on her part and just happened naturally; hence, organic.But it's not, she is there for her job and as they both said the relationship developed its own dynamic. It may be real but definitely not organic. Unless you are using organic in a different meaning than what it means originally.
- Aug 4, 2022
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She was already your friend I thought. Maybe before she was even a member of the order?
She was, since childhood if I remember right. So she has multiple motives for spending time with MC as a friend. The mission is just part of it, but perhaps she spent just a bit more time with MC as a result of her orders than she otherwise would have.
- Mar 28, 2021
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I don't think it was said explicitly, but mostly likely she was raised/schooled within the order from childhood, and yes, they were friends or whatever before she became a full member. How that friendship came to be I would be interested to find out, could be another thing the order pulled so once she was a member she was already close to him.