Mod Ren'Py Abandoned Time For Dragons - Defiler Wings: Deranged Dragon Mod [29-07-2020] [Jman]

3.50 star(s) 8 Votes

Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
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Who knows how to solve this problem?
Go to the indicated line in lair_conquest.rpy and change it to
Code:
            call arena(encounter=['old_knight']) from _call_arena_68
Make sure all the spacing is exactly as you found it, too.

I was thinking about perhaps adding a dog to the geezer, but decided against it and now there's a 'phantom' enemy there. :(

The other issue has been reported before, change the offending lines in Girl.rpy to
Code:
        def girl_power_roll(self):
            return self.hp//10 + random.randint(int(self.attack),int(self.attack+self.attack_mastery))
Flies out to torture a city woman
How are you torturing them, anyway? The smaller lizards are really bad at it... On the other hand, you've apparently grown wings already?


Evil Earthworm Jim: That's probably because one of the girls is easily pliable ('lust'-y) and the other is not ('proud', 'innocent'). Affection isn't everything when it comes to actual sex. And the 'completely broken' is when she's under your paws, not when she's plotting to escape in the middle of your slumber. :p

Returning girls from minion status is done via Lair - Orders - Release minion. Girls become captives again, dragonspawn go and rampage around the Kingdom, mercenaries just leave.

And, um, I'm not giving that scheming witch any more power than she already gets from the sperm. ;) You'll get the ability to, erm, create a magical condom of sorts yourself. And who has ever heard of a dragon going to an abortion clinic? o_O :ROFLMAO:
 
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ixet_mad

Newbie
Mar 24, 2019
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Thank you very much! The error no longer crashes. )

But I'm not sure if these were the last bugs ...) 0) 00
 

Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
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Most likely not. Even if they were, I've probably created some new ones in the meanwhile. :p
 

Evil Earthworm Jim

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Dec 21, 2019
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And I'm saying that such a thing does not exist in RL, nor in Deranged Dragon, for reasons of both gameplay and aesthetics. You can easily change that to your liking, if you want to. You'll just eliminate something like one third of the reason why I implemented the extended lair system in the first place. I'm understandably not very keen on undoing my own work. :(


That's just normal dragon paranoia. :p If they don't run away pretty quickly, chances are they won't do it at all.


Again, only girls who are too powerful for your lair can run away. A fully terrified peasant lass will be almost guaranteed to never escape.

It is something to encourage you to come out of that ravine, or cave or ruin, and actually settle somewhere nice, instead of waiting until you're leveled enough to skip straight to the endgame lairs.


Then you're losing out on a significant aspect of the game. E.g. a few 50-copper goblin henchmen will make it actually possible to kill stray dogs with a cat-sized dragon. Plus, draining other captives dry is the only meaningful development you can give to your girls, otherwise they just sit there, lay eggs and get fucked. :)


What costs? Expenses stay the same, the only 'cost' is the opportunity cost of not getting more eggs/milk. Since you don't use minions, and 'non-virgin' eggs are lower-quality anyway, I'm not exactly sure what you mean here.


For one, lair security works for all girls, both current and future ones. It's a one-time cost, not affected by new acquires or the total number of girls.

For another, the Deranged Dragon does not have permanent mind-affecting magic. And he can't exactly go to the local sheriff and say "Hey, have you seen a girl with a shiny magical dragon brand run through here? That's my property, and I expect an officer of the law to help me catch her!"


They shouldn't be able to escape a solid lair. Show me your setup+captives and I'll see if the formulas need adjustment.


A 'broken' girl gets a pretty large reduction in wanting to run away. By wholly 'eliminating this issue', I'd also eliminate other mechanics I happen to like.


My point is that a dozen torture sessions isn't comparable to evolving your dragon and building up your lair. Remember, I was attracted to this game because I can customise my lair and dragon, not because I can corrupt girls via magical slime. :p


But it is. That's exactly the point, conquest is an unstable and precarious state of affairs. Conan wanted to hear the 'lamentations of their women', not their fake moans. :p I'm not really into the whole vore/guro/torture thing, but I definitely prefer (virtually) dominating/tricking spirited women over just brainwashing them into eternal complacency. Lots of historical tyrants were that way as well, and the women could and did take advantage of this.
Eh I know you've only my word on this but that attitudes does exist in real life my friend, My mother died believing my father did no harm and was a saint and she got it worse than I did (hes been dead awhile thankfully). You say chances are the wont run away, "chances" means they can. :) again "almost guaranteed" isn't a guarantee :D if I'm going to put the work in I want the returns :) otherwise I'd may as well just stay in the smaller lairs and just use nothing but cages. As I've said, the combat isn't an issue so any arguments revolving around combat are not applicable to me that's why it's on the highest difficulty because it's too easy because of it's simplicity mostly (I don't know how you would balance it but if you could I suppose there would be a reason again to take priestess with me) ~~ The costs I was talking about was losing the girl. The cost of using a girl is too high (death or runs away), remember, I only recruit girls I've taken a liken too so losing any of them is upsetting, and as I've mentioned I can't actually figure out what you mean when you say you can take them out of your minions tab. I haven't been able to do this yet. Once she's in there I can't interact with her and if you release her doesn't that mean she is release from your charge? Obviously security doesn't apply to all girls as you've mentioned above angels can escape from anywhere bar the underwater lairs (so I'll have to have one which isn't really my choice at that point), too many 'maybes' and 'should' I really enjoy base building, I'm all about it but seems like no matter how well I do there's always that chance the the girls will escape even if it's 0.1% that's still not definite. As for the branding remember it's magic :) you've already mentioned above that the dragon being magic makes up for a lot of inconsistency in how things work (regarding pregnancy) remember it's magic so it works, like magic :D slap a magic mark on the girl and the dragon can just smell her out or something, he already does this when smelling out virgins and gold and all manner of other things is it really to much of a leap or he could just send the many minions you amass and have a probability of their success based off of the kingdoms state and the girls state, I'm not suggesting you do this just elaborating :D Unfortunately I don't have a lair setup right now, I'm going through the game again bug hunting :) but I'll do just that when I'm starting to play. As for eliminating a mechanic in the game that you rather enjoy, I'm sorry I didn't mean to come down on that. I was just stating it how it was :) having to always worry if you locked the house up before you went to go to work is a pain, and doesn't leave me enjoying that aspect. It's a trap or a land mine you might step on every time you rest. Every time you close your eyes you could die (loose your favorite girl), that's not particularly fun :) for myself anyway but it is as it is I don't expect for you to change your mind, it would be nice if there was a way to stop it for those who don't like it such as myself as I can't really remember it being a problem in the base game, or at least it wasn't a concern, as I've stated before. It's your mod and it's here for your enjoyment and everyone is lucky enough to share in it but it doesn't change how I feel in the matter. I play video games to escape my hopeless reality where I have no real power in my life I don't like to be reminded of it. :) It's the same with completely breaking the girls, if it where possible I would rather have it just to eliminate her running as one reason, even if it was you needed 1000 affection then at least if you manage to actually care for a girl to get her that high (don't lose her from XYZ) then it means there's not accidentally breaking her. As far as your last point goes, torture versus leveling, I'm maximum level and I can lose her all the same as if I was level one. There needs to be a visible reward for doing these things, yes your ability to control them is greater, but after 100 hours of play I don't want great I want absolute, I don't want to lose out on all that hard work because of RNG and I would rather hear "fake moans" (which in my opinion they wouldn't be fake because you've completely dominated the girl, the girl she was before is gone the one you've created wants to be treated the way you treat her, because that's her life, that's who she is now) than no moans at all. :D
 
Last edited:

Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
Go to the indicated line in lair_conquest.rpy and change it to
Code:
            call arena(encounter=['old_knight']) from _call_arena_68
Make sure all the spacing is exactly as you found it, too.

I was thinking about perhaps adding a dog to the geezer, but decided against it and now there's a 'phantom' enemy there. :(

The other issue has been reported before, change the offending lines in Girl.rpy to
Code:
        def girl_power_roll(self):
            return self.hp//10 + random.randint(int(self.attack),int(self.attack+self.attack_mastery))

How are you torturing them, anyway? The smaller lizards are really bad at it... On the other hand, you've apparently grown wings already?


Evil Earthworm Jim: That's probably because one of the girls is easily pliable ('lust'-y) and the other is not ('proud', 'innocent'). Affection isn't everything when it comes to actual sex. And the 'completely broken' is when she's under your paws, not when she's plotting to escape in the middle of your slumber. :p

Returning girls from minion status is done via Lair - Orders - Release minion. Girls become captives again, dragonspawn go and rampage around the Kingdom, mercenaries just leave.

And, um, I'm not giving that scheming witch any more power than she already gets from the sperm. ;) You'll get the ability to, erm, create a magical condom of sorts yourself. And who has ever heard of a dragon going to an abortion clinic? o_O :ROFLMAO:
haha noooooo since when do you knock up your pets >< what are you doing to your dogs :D I was talking about getting her spade or something hahaha.
 

Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
I was just given the opportunity to rob a mithrial mine even though I was scouring the sky region. I'm not sure if this is intended or not so I'm raising it now:)
 

Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,295
957
attitudes does exist in real life my friend, My mother died believing my father did no harm and was a saint and she got it worse than I did.
That's a bit different. She probably didn't get kidnapped and held captive by your father at an early age, when such a thing is at least somewhat possible. She most likely held that position because she had nothing else, and it would have made her life choices meaningless if she went back on that. So she had a lot of incentive to cling to that position, even if deep down she knew she was deluding herself.

The dragon's victims have none of that: their homes aren't always intact, but their extended family usually is. They're forcefully kidnapped, raped and tortured, pretty much explicitly against their will. They need either a full, long-term brainwashing regimen or a permanent magical spell to overcome that. The latter I'm declaring nonexistent, because I don't like the implications, and the former is far, far harder for a dragon to achieve than just amassing lair security and growing a couple of extra tentacled heads.

You say chances are the wont run away, "chances" means they can.
The 'chances' can actually become 0. And the only way for them to rise again if you change your lair somehow (releasing minions, moving, rebuilding), or the prisoners gain power by torturing other captives.

I said 'chances' because I don't know the exact circumstances of your victims' escape attempts. They might have had a, say, 6% chance of escaping, and a single lair move or half a dozen extra goblins would have eliminated that. So the next 10 attempts would have likely failed, and if you went for a few extra guards, no further attempts would have been made. Thus, 'chances'.

if I'm going to put the work in I want the returns
You do get them. Better lairs explicitly forbid certain races from escaping at all, and most of them come with built-in defenses and increased 'inaccessibility', which reduces the chances to escape even further.

otherwise I'd may as well just stay in the smaller lairs and just use nothing but cages.
Most smaller lairs aren't expandable. And your total number of 'free-range' captives :D will be capped by lair space.

Also, it's a PITA to constantly store and release girls. Anyway, the proper place for a pregnant girl is not a cage, it's a Breeding Pit or Milking Farm. They can't escape from there, either. All the tentacles, you know. ;)

As I've said, the combat isn't an issue so any arguments revolving around combat are not applicable to me that's why it's on the highest difficulty because it's too easy because of it's simplicity mostly (I don't know how you would balance it but if you could I suppose there would be a reason again to take priestess with me)
Does the combat comment come from actual playtesting or just as a general impression? Because evolving your dragon to be badass takes time, and you have only 666 days at most to start producing Sparks to stave off the demon invasion. I'm pretty sure you can't build a dragon badass enough to successfully fight Architot in just 666 days.

And my argument wasn't about combat per se, but rather that I'd personally keep my favourite 'waifus' around my dragon, not locked away. They can also develop as minions, whereas they only degrade as captives.

The costs I was talking about was losing the girl. The cost of using a girl is too high (death or runs away), remember, I only recruit girls I've taken a liken too so losing any of them is upsetting
That's why you have several squads. If you're doing something dangerous, you break out the big, bad and expandable lizardmen. When you're just chilling around, kicking puppies and scaring peasants, you take your 'waifu team'.

And you build up your lair to meet the standards of the girl before you approach her, obviously. Again, just like IRL. :p

release her doesn't that mean she is release from your charge?
No. Just try it.

Obviously security doesn't apply to all girls as you've mentioned above angels can escape from anywhere bar the underwater lairs, too many 'maybes' and 'should' I really enjoy base building, I'm all about it but seems like no matter how well I do there's always that chance the the girls will escape even if it's 0.1% that's still not definite.
Angels can escape from underwater, too. I think only the Forgotten Temple suppresses them. But that's the hard cap. There's also a soft one. A run-of-the-mill angel with 111 affection (the max) would have a
Code:
100 + 9*10 - 42 - 111 - 2*25 = -13 -> 0%
chance to escape from a freshly conquered cloud castle and a
Code:
100 + 9*10 - 0 - 111 - 1*25 = 54%
chance to fly away from an impregnable but otherwise bare mountaintop.

As for the branding remember it's magic...
Sure. But I don't like the lore or aesthetic implications of powerful and permanent mind-affecting magic. Nothing good has ever come from stories that try to play around with this, IMO.

And sending out your minions and getting consistent results is really only viable when you're on the brink of invasion as is. Furthermore, I'm not particularly keen on implementing girl-tracking mechanics when just stealing a new girl will serve that purpose most of the time just as well. If I wanted to do anything more in-depth there - which I really don't - I'd actually go for Arhin Mahariel's 'girl fates' system first. Which, unfortunately for you, involves a lot more escaping. :p

smell her out or something, he already does this when smelling out virgins and gold and all manner of other things
I'm not sure the dragon actually differentiates between different (virgin) smells. I can smell pancakes. I can't track down one specific pancake even if my life depended on it. :LOL:

having to always worry if you locked the house up before you went to go to work is a pain, and doesn't leave me enjoying that aspect.
I can understand that worry and I can assure you that if you hire enough goblins, nobody will escape your lair ever again. No, the Goblin Union isn't paying me to say that, honest! :D

there was a way to stop it for those who don't like it such as myself
Grow wings, make your lair on a mountaintop, and don't go after demon or angel girls. Problem solved until you start wanting angels, then you need to get a better lair and build some defenses. You'll need them anyway, or the Knights/Thieves will rob you blind. There are lots of intermediate options as well that don't require you to live like a hermit, but discovering them is the fun in the game.

there's not accidentally breaking her
There's always 'accidentally breaking her'. You're a dragon, not a teddy bear. Don't play with your toys when they're leaking the red stuff. :)

As far as your last point goes, torture versus leveling, I'm maximum level and I can lose her all the same as if I was level one.
'Leveling' means lair leveling. A big, scary max-level dragon in a crappy cave or gully is just an invitation to run away.

I would rather hear "fake moans"
Fortunately for you, 'fake' moans already exist, if you've paid any attention to the sound effects. That's another thing higher affection gets you, moaning instead of screaming.

which in my opinion they wouldn't be fake because you've completely dominated the girl, the girl she was before is gone the one you've created wants to be treated the way you treat her, because that's her life, that's who she is now) than no moans at all.
If you want to take a stab at a submod and add a 'mind-broken' branch to rape_labels.rpy, be my guest. I could even include it and make it a game option if anything actually useable comes out of it. But I'm not doing it myself.

As for 'spaying' girls... I think the 'magical condom' is enough, and actually has a minor cost as well. What if you wanted to get her pregnant again at some point? I'm not going down that rabbit hole, at least not now.

Obviously, we have different fetishes which can't truly coexist in a single setting. You want total control, I want great power with attendant pitfalls. In my experience, the latter makes for more interesting gameplay as well. YMMV.


Edit:
I was just given the opportunity to rob a mithrial mine even though I was scouring the sky region. I'm not sure if this is intended or not so I'm raising it now
Sky events has a mix of other location events that can be seen from the sky, if it not changed.
Nothing is changed there. More precisely, this is one of the 'devastation' events. If you paid attention to the text, the dwarves were having difficulties with that mine, and the payout was less than usual.

Maybe there should be more stuff visible from the sky? 'Regular' sky is pretty bare. But I'm not exactly certain what I should put there, as even a mine high in the mountains raises questions. And the few events available are some of the most powerful in the game.
 
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Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
That's a bit different. She probably didn't get kidnapped and held captive by your father at an early age, when such a thing is at least somewhat possible. She most likely held that position because she had nothing else, and it would have made her life choices meaningless if she went back on that. So she had a lot of incentive to cling to that position, even if deep down she knew she was deluding herself.

The dragon's victims have none of that: their homes aren't always intact, but their extended family usually is. They're forcefully kidnapped, raped and tortured, pretty much explicitly against their will. They need either a full, long-term brainwashing regimen or a permanent magical spell to overcome that. The latter I'm declaring nonexistent, because I don't like the implications, and the former is far, far harder for a dragon to achieve than just amassing lair security and growing a couple of extra tentacled heads.


The 'chances' can actually become 0. And the only way for them to rise again if you change your lair somehow (releasing minions, moving, rebuilding), or the prisoners gain power by torturing other captives.

I said 'chances' because I don't know the exact circumstances of your victims' escape attempts. They might have had a, say, 6% chance of escaping, and a single lair move or half a dozen extra goblins would have eliminated that. So the next 10 attempts would have likely failed, and if you went for a few extra guards, no further attempts would have been made. Thus, 'chances'.


You do get them. Better lairs explicitly forbid certain races from escaping at all, and most of them come with built-in defenses and increased 'inaccessibility', which reduces the chances to escape even further.


Most smaller lairs aren't expandable. And your total number of 'free-range' captives :D will be capped by lair space.

Also, it's a PITA to constantly store and release girls. Anyway, the proper place for a pregnant girl is not a cage, it's a Breeding Pit or Milking Farm. They can't escape from there, either. All the tentacles, you know. ;)


Does the combat comment come from actual playtesting or just as a general impression? Because evolving your dragon to be badass takes time, and you have only 666 days at most to start producing Sparks to stave off the demon invasion. I'm pretty sure you can't build a dragon badass enough to successfully fight Architot in just 666 days.

And my argument wasn't about combat per se, but rather that I'd personally keep my favourite 'waifus' around my dragon, not locked away. They can also develop as minions, whereas they only degrade as captives.


That's why you have several squads. If you're doing something dangerous, you break out the big, bad and expandable lizardmen. When you're just chilling around, kicking puppies and scaring peasants, you take your 'waifu team'.

And you build up your lair to meet the standards of the girl before you approach her, obviously. Again, just like IRL. :p


No. Just try it.


Angels can escape from underwater, too. I think only the Forgotten Temple suppresses them. But that's the hard cap. There's also a soft one. A run-of-the-mill angel with 111 affection (the max) would have a
Code:
100 + 9*10 - 42 - 111 - 2*25 = -13 -> 0%
chance to escape from a freshly conquered cloud castle and a
Code:
100 + 9*10 - 0 - 111 - 1*25 = 54%
chance to fly away from an impregnable but otherwise bare mountaintop.


Sure. But I don't like the lore or aesthetic implications of powerful and permanent mind-affecting magic. Nothing good has ever come from stories that try to play around with this, IMO.

And sending out your minions and getting consistent results is really only viable when you're on the brink of invasion as is. Furthermore, I'm not particularly keen on implementing girl-tracking mechanics when just stealing a new girl will serve that purpose most of the time just as well. If I wanted to do anything more in-depth there - which I really don't - I'd actually go for Arhin Mahariel's 'girl fates' system first. Which, unfortunately for you, involves a lot more escaping. :p


I'm not sure the dragon actually differentiates between different (virgin) smells. I can smell pancakes, I can't track down one specific pancake even if my life depended on it. :LOL:


I can understand that worry and I can assure you that if you hire enough goblins, nobody will escape your lair ever again. No, the Goblin Union isn't paying me to say that, honest! :D


Grow wings, make your lair on a mountaintop, and don't go after demon or angel girls. Problem solved until you start wanting angels, then you need to get a better lair and build some defenses. You'll need them anyway, or the Knights/Thieves will rob you blind. There are lots of intermediate options as well that don't require you to live like a hermit, but discovering them is the fun in the game.


There's always 'accidentally breaking her'. You're a dragon, not a teddy bear. Don't play with your toys when they're leaking the red stuff. :)


'Leveling' means lair leveling. A big, scary max-level dragon in a crappy cave or gully is just an invitation to run away.


Fortunately for you, 'fake' moans already exist, if you've paid any attention to the sound effects. That's another thing higher affection gets you, moaning instead of screaming.


If you want to take a stab at a submod and add a 'mind-broken' branch to rape_labels.rpy, be my guest. I could even include it and make it a game option if anything actually useable comes out of it. But I'm not doing it myself.

As for 'spaying' girls... I think the 'magical condom' is enough, and actually has a minor cost as well. What if you wanted to get her pregnant again at some point? I'm not going down that rabbit hole, at least not now.

Obviously, we have different fetishes which can't truly coexist in a single setting. You want total control, I want great power with attendant pitfalls. In my experience, the latter makes for more interesting gameplay as well. YMMV.
That's fair I suppose, I can't argue against your first point :) As for your combat remark, I'm basing this off of the original game, I haven't had the opportunity to play your mod normally yet and I never took them with me (favorite) because I didn't want to lose them through combat :) Your comment about putting them in the tentical pits, I never liked the idea, it's like giving away your favorite toys to the dirty kid to play with and when you get them back it doesn't seem to matter how much you clean them, you know he did all sorts of filthy things with them. As for your branding comment, I don't think it has anything to do with brain washing, your chipping them just like you would your pet that's all and when I was talking about smelling them out I was actually meaning that that's how the dragon would be able to track them, not the girl themselves but the mark on them and it would be a magic sense he would have for sensing out magic things :) You've misunderstood however what I meant about breaking I was talking about mental breaking them in the context of our conversion above, again I think you've miss understood my comment about the fake moans too, I was making the comment that I would rather have fake moans than nothing at all again in the context of my message, loosing the girls through whatever means. Lastly I'm worried about attempting to mod the game, firstly I don't have the technical ability to do so secondly, I'm worried that if I started cutting a tucking I would end up just taking the fairy portion of the mod away and playing the base game as the base game addresses a lot of the current criticisms I have with your mod, which basically boils down to our differing opinions on ownership. :) This is our main difference in opinion at the moment that is, I'm not being given complete control over my captives, where as the base game does this already I wouldn't even mind if it took extra steps. :) Girls escaping and girls dying so frivolously, it's like someone is just taking them away from me again. Like the fairy thing all over again. I know you can just lock them up but as you say this gets tedious taking them in and out again, you can just pop them in the tentical pits but that damages them and sullys them I think your idea of popping them in your ranks and taking them out only when you want to spend time with them is going to be my only solution at the moment epsically now that you can actually be intamate with them and not knock them up but I would still like to just again mention that, if they accept being in your army that should be the final level of there taming, they are willing accepting joining your army and commenting acts of atrostrositys, killing there kin and laying waste to the lands they pomised to protect and again once they are in the army the are in a position to do the most damage to you so it doesn't make all that much sense that when you take them out they suddenly become unruly again and defiant once you've taken away there weapons again and there powers to do anything against you :D. Once they accept going into your army they accept your rule. Although I would like to point out the irony cheekly if I may of you suggesting not capturing angels or demons cutting out that content when you where criticizing me earlier for making suggestions that would cut out large portions of content ;)
 
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Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
If it wouldn't be a huge big project and you felt up too it, you could just tell me what switches I needed to turn off so girls couldn't escape or die from child birth or if you wanted (to be honest I'm not hot on this idea) You could just give me the fairy portion of the content as a mod, you mentioned it was easy to implement, I would rather keep most of your mod as I've stated before I really like what you've done with huge amount of it and I've said you expressed a far greater openness and understanding than most content creators and that's not specific to here, I haven't seem many content developers on here that have been willing to have this level of back and forth with one of there consumers. I think it's amazing personally and they way you've conducted yourself has been five star for sure :) I don't know how it is on your other mod but I can't see your unsympathetic side here. You've been nothing more than accommodating or have at least try to be in my point of view. Sure I'm not getting everything I want but if I want you to change your mind on something then it's up to me to make the appropriate argument for it and if I can't then that's my failing not yours, after all I have enough of a time getting a five year old to eat her veggies and some how I end up chumpped but I'm a big softy.
 
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Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,295
957
Your comment about putting them in the tentical pits, I never liked the idea, it's like giving away your favorite toys
But, but... These are your tentacle pits! :p

Anyway, I can symphatise with that and Tentacle Pits aren't necessary. But they're definitely convenient.

And if you want safe pregnancies, I don't really see how these would happen without some sort of help. The dragon is definitely not going to be hiring midwives. If you feel so strongly about the pits, rename them to 'Pregnant waifu corner' or what have you and replace the picture with something cuter. Me, I like my dragon hardcore. :cool:

You'll also be able to just forgo impregnation for your favourites, if that's what you want. But you have to give up something. This is not the 'Dragon God Simulator'. :p

As for your branding comment, I don't think it has anything to do with brain washing, your chipping them just like you would your pet that's all and when I was talking about smelling them out I was actually meaning that that's how the dragon would be able to track them, not the girl themselves but the mark on them and it would be a magic sense he would have for sensing out magic things
Well, I suppose that could work. It's not a particularly meaningful or easy thing to properly implement, though. As I said, you can get new girls rather easily, and the vast, vast majority of them are going to be just as good as your old ones. So tracking down escapees is mostly aesthetic.

You've misunderstood however what I meant about breaking I was talking about mental breaking them in the context of our conversion above
In that case, I have absolutely no idea what 'there's not accidentally breaking her' means. There are no accidental mind-breakings, neither in the game now nor proposed in this thread. o_O

again I think you've miss understood my comment about the fake moans too, I was making the comment that I would rather have fake moans than nothing at all again in the context of my message, loosing the girls through whatever means.
I have no idea what moaning has to do with escaping. The girls already moan to deceive you, then run away during the night. Or moan because they're nymphos and don't run away. Or scream and writhe, but don't dare to run. Etc. Not everything needs to be spelled out by the game.

Lastly I'm worried about attempting to mod the game, firstly I don't have the technical ability to do so
Ren'Py and Python are very newbie-friendly. Granted, all the Russian text in the code might trip you up a little, and not everyone enjoys coding or scripting.

I would end up just taking the fairy portion of the mod away and playing the base game as the base game addresses a lot of the current criticisms I have with your mod, which basically boils down to our differing opinions on ownership.
As far as I can tell, your only substantial criticism is that girls run away from you when at max affection. Changing that takes one, maybe two lines of code. And, as the above examples with cloud castle/impregnable peak show, most of the time the girls actually won't be running away. You're being overly influenced by test games without well-built lairs.

girls dying so frivolously
Why are your girls dying? I don't think I changed anything fundamental there. Too much combat, or torture or breeding pits or dragon sex killed your captives dead in the base game as well.

If you mean the pregnancies, well, I'm giving you the options to either skip pregnancies or use the pits.

it's like someone is just taking them away from me again. Like the fairy thing all over again.
The fairy thing was that you couldn't do anything about it. Even now, if you can't beat the duo, you don't get the fairy or even anything at all. Similar thing with other girls: with enough work and care, they'll never die or escape, but you need to put in that work.

I would still like to just again mention that, if they accept being in your army that should be the final level of there taming, they are willing accepting joining your army and commenting acts of atrostrositys
All sorts of conscripts/levies have committed atrocities across history. Doesn't mean many of them didn't desert when the opportunity presented itself.

The max-affection girls are not 'tamed'. Instead, they're fully cognisant of just how terrible the dragon is and how badly he can hurt them. So they'll gladly take the easy way out and join the rampages. No more dragon sex, egg-laying, goblins torturing you when the dragon isn't looking... They get to boss around goblins instead. What's not to like?

No running away, though, since the dragon is always with them outside the lair, and they're together with the other minions most of the time.

again once they are in the army the are in a position to do the most damage to you
Maybe, but that's also why they have to watch themselves more. The dragon might forgive or forget a wilful toy. He'll definitely remember and most likely just eviscerate the girl who got half a dozen lances stuck in his tail because she tried to get cute.

it doesn't make all that much sense that when you take them out they suddenly become unruly again and defiant once you've taken away there weapons again and there powers to do anything against you
The difference is, as Dragon Priestesses they're hurting other people. They can't do much about it - because dragon! - so they don't worry too much about it. But getting chucked in the breeding pens again means their own soft backsides are again in immediate danger of dragon-cock, not to mention the goblins getting touchy etc. So they'll fight back if it's not completely hopeless, unless they're totally broken.

I think what you're seeing here is the hidden 'dignity' stat at work. High affinity affection can usually cancel out prideful attitude during dragon sex, but 'dignity' multipliers above 1 (angels, elves and nobles have 2, peasants, demons and oni have 0.5) can let them retain some if not all pride. So angels, elves and nobles will never be truly broken, although if they're at or above 50 affinity, they should not be fighting back, just praying harder or clenching their teeth or fists.

Bottom line: Runaway girls are very much avoidable as it is. Pregnancy deaths only matter in the long term if you refuse to use the pits/farms. You'll be able to skip pregnancies altogether if that's the case. The reason I'm not really sold on you just avoiding both mechanics altogether is my selfish desire to get playtesting for the complete mod. You really should try it out without hanging onto every girl you come across and only collect those you can securely handle, while building yourself (i.e. your lair) up to the next level.

Edit:
you suggesting not capturing angels or demons cutting out that content when you where criticizing me earlier for making suggestions that would cut out large portions of content
My suggestion was to do so temporarily, until you find/develop a lair that can actually hold angels/demons safely.

Edit2:
Hmmm... This happens in Darkwood when you press Research Chance.
I think that's also something that's basically been reported. Just turn off the 'living expenses' notifications (Lair - Orders) for the time being.
 
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Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
But, but... These are your tentacle pits! :p

Anyway, I can symphatise with that and Tentacle Pits aren't necessary. But they're definitely convenient.

And if you want safe pregnancies, I don't really see how these would happen without some sort of help. The dragon is definitely not going to be hiring midwives. If you feel so strongly about the pits, rename them to 'Pregnant waifu corner' or what have you and replace the picture with something cuter. Me, I like my dragon hardcore. :cool:

You'll also be able to just forgo impregnation for your favourites, if that's what you want. But you have to give up something. This is not the 'Dragon God Simulator'. :p


Well, I suppose that could work. It's not a particularly meaningful or easy thing to properly implement, though. As I said, you can get new girls rather easily, and the vast, vast majority of them are going to be just as good as your old ones. So tracking down escapees is mostly aesthetic.


In that case, I have absolutely no idea what 'there's not accidentally breaking her' means. There are no accidental mind-breakings, neither in the game now nor proposed in this thread. o_O


I have no idea what moaning has to do with escaping. The girls already moan to deceive you, then run away during the night. Or moan because they're nymphos and don't run away. Or scream and writhe, but don't dare to run. Etc. Not everything needs to be spelled out by the game.


Ren'Py and Python are very newbie-friendly. Granted, all the Russian text in the code might trip you up a little, and not everyone enjoys coding or scripting.


As far as I can tell, your only substantial criticism is that girls run away from you when at max affection. Changing that takes one, maybe two lines of code. And, as the above examples with cloud castle/impregnable peak show, most of the time the girls actually won't be running away. You're being overly influenced by test games without well-built lairs.


Why are your girls dying? I don't think I changed anything fundamental there. Too much combat, or torture or breeding pits or dragon sex killed your captives dead in the base game as well.

If you mean the pregnancies, well, I'm giving you the options to either skip pregnancies or use the pits.


The fairy thing was that you couldn't do anything about it. Even now, if you can't beat the duo, you don't get the fairy or even anything at all. Similar thing with other girls: with enough work and care, they'll never die or escape, but you need to put in that work.


All sorts of conscripts/levies have committed atrocities across history. Doesn't mean many of them didn't desert when the opportunity presented itself.

The max-affection girls are not 'tamed'. Instead, they're fully cognisant of just how terrible the dragon is and how badly he can hurt them. So they'll gladly take the easy way out and join the rampages. No more dragon sex, egg-laying, goblins torturing you when the dragon isn't looking... They get to boss around goblins instead. What's not to like?

No running away, though, since the dragon is always with them outside the lair, and they're together with the other minions most of the time.


Maybe, but that's also why they have to watch themselves more. The dragon might forgive or forget a wilful toy. He'll definitely remember and most likely just eviscerate the girl who got half a dozen lances stuck in his tail because she tried to get cute.


The difference is, as Dragon Priestesses they're hurting other people. They can't do much about it - because dragon! - so they don't worry too much about it. But getting chucked in the breeding pens again means their own soft backsides are again in immediate danger of dragon-cock, not to mention the goblins getting touchy etc. So they'll fight back if it's not completely hopeless, unless they're totally broken.

I think what you're seeing here is the hidden 'dignity' stat at work. High affinity can usually cancel out prideful attitude during dragon sex, but 'dignity' multipliers above 1 (angels, elves and nobles have 2, peasants, demons and oni have 0.5) can let them retain some if not all pride. So angels, elves and nobles will never be truly broken, although if they're at or above 50 affinity, they should not be fighting back, just praying harder or clenching their teeth or fists.

Bottom line: Runaway girls are very much avoidable as it is. Pregnancy deaths only matter in the long term if you refuse to use the pits/farms. You'll be able to skip pregnancies altogether if that's the case. The reason I'm not really sold on you just avoiding both mechanics altogether is my selfish desire to get playtesting for the complete mod. You really should try it out without hanging onto every girl you come across and only collect those you can hang onto, while building yourself (i.e. your lair) up to the next level.

Edit:

My suggestion was to do so temporarily, until you find/develop a lair that can actually hold angels/demons safely.

Edit2:

I think that's also something that's basically been reported. Just turn off the 'living expenses' notifications (Lair - Orders) for the time being.
Okay well to address your first point :) I've asked for an alternative to impregnating them if you'll mind. If that's what I have to give up to prevent them from dying then it sucks but so be it but my criticism is there (currently for my build) isn't a way to avoid this. If you want to play with them and actually finish playing with them you can't do so without getting them pregnant. To be honest as I've said earlier still mating and playing with them should be too separate things as the both do the same thing at the moment, get them pregnant. :)

As for your second point, it's not largely aesthetics at all, currently there isn't any loyalty in the game as far as the girls are concerned so imagine you put 100 hours in to the girl maybe fifty in game years, shes a bad ass, you don't want to lose her right but one night you forget to switch her over to a cage or your army and next day the RNG god smotes your arse and she's gone run away in the night, ouch. Again if she's a favorite too you don't want to lose her that way surely so popping a brand on her means she can't be lost that way. I'm not talking about just branding pesent girls you found a in day game ago. It's like a favorites list in a rpg, means you can't accidentally lose something that's precious to you. :)

" A 'broken' girl gets a pretty large reduction in wanting to run away. By wholly 'eliminating this issue', I'd also eliminate other mechanics I happen to like."

This was the point I was addressing is that if your concern is you don't like this type of thing and worried it is going to step on the mechanics you do like as to avoid "accidentally breaking them" you could make it something that happens at affection 1000 or something which means the only girls that are going to make it that high are ones that are your favorite that you do want to put the work into, considering the likely hood of a girl living that long is so small it's only likely to happen if you want and it means that as you don't really mind which girls you lose you don't ever need to worry about accidentally triggering this event as the requirements would be so high. My point is to break a girl to the point where she wouldn't run away (thus standing on a mechanic you like) you could set it so high that it couldn't possible happen by accident. You couldn't accidentally break a girl it could only be intentional because of the requirements. So when she reaches "affection" 111 you get option to "awaken" her bringing her completely into your control whilst at the same time people who don't want this, wouldn't have to do it.(y)

My comment about moaning was not to be taken literary I was making the point that I would rather have a slave to show me fake obedience to no slave at all. :) and where as your right I am being influenced by test games remember, I'm also influenced by my base game experience I know roughly what to expect this far on, ball park.

The girls dying I feel has been addressed largely as you've stated. As for the fairy comment I agree with you there however it's the same basic principle just as I can take all the precautions I can to steal the fairy I can also take all the precautions to stop my girls running away, but they can still get away, the titan and the ponsy prince might still flooke me. we've done this, even a 0.1 percent chances means there's still a chance and if base building a development is your kink how much of that are you really getting to do if all your doing is filling them with traps just to keep what you feel is yours, I can see what's going to happen now, I'm going to have maybe five cores or hatchery and 500 traps. That's not really great development that's a META. I guess it's not so bad if the bases are infinite but if your overly concerned about base building and lore and what have you it might break your immersion having thousands upon thousands or defense structures and cages :) However I don't know what that will do game wise dirtying the game, slowing it down or what have you.

I can't dispute your next couple of points (dragon priestesses), they're good and I don't know enough about the subject matter. (y) That's a fair suggestion however bare in mind what I've said in the past. I'm not snapping up everyone and I do pass on girls my concerns are only for my favorites it's just unfortunate that I only recruit girls I am interested in so I may pass by 10000 and only end up recruiting ten of them and it's these girls I am concerned about this is what this whole day has been about. I don't have hundreds and hundreds of girls in my cave I've a select few that I've seen and decided I've liked, There not necessary the strongest or the best but it's the ones I've like out of thousands so when I lose one, it hurts because they are one in a dozen or in a hundred. To be honest I don't recruit any girls until I've settled in a lair. I do so to advance the story and that's it I let them go, most of the time any girls I do come across I season before I eat :sneaky: although I guess that means that my dragon eats his own baby gravy. My point is that I act the way the dragon should 99% of the time and the only girls I don't want to do this too the only girls in my lair are the only girls that are my favorite.

I play this game to be a motha fucking dragon beeeatch and I loooooove to smote a mother with fire and brim stone baby but doesn't mean I don't want to spend some quality time with my girls when I get home, pop my people slippers on eat a truck load of baby seals and spend the night watching ugly betty with my bitches before an evening a lust field debauchery. I just don't want to lose them.
 
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Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
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Again, I don't want to just start hacking up your mod ether, I think I've expressed sufficiently my interest in it and to start just cutting it up to me is like "I like what you've done but here's how you do it" it wouldn't be like that obviously but that's just how it feels, like I would be shitting on what have done. I know I've proposed changes but look at what I've asked for a way to stop death during pregnancy and away to garantee your girls don't run away, which you've already suggested would be easy. I don't think it's entirely unreasonable my requests or at least I've tried to be reasonable in how I've presented myself and I've suggested ways of doing it too so it doesn't step on your original vision. I've already turned off the death clock for a test girl, it's in elegant but I think it works and I've managed to do it for only specific girls too so it's just as if I've popped them on a protected list or favorites list. This is all I'm suggesting. :) going back to the magic brands. You could brand a girl but you've only so many brands so choose your girls wisely but a girl you brand will become a dragon bride or something but just means she can't be accidentally lost.
 
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Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,295
957
I've asked for an alternative to impregnating them if you'll mind.
And I said you'll get a 'magical condom' that does exactly this.

currently there isn't any loyalty in the game
...
one night you forget to switch her over to a cage or your army and next day the RNG god smotes your arse
Affection is loyalty, of sorts. It's just, well, the same kind of loyalty the current US president gets, a fine-weather one.

And a dozen or so traps + a dozen guards + girl-appropriate lair will guarantee no runaways. I don't know why this is not getting across to you. :(

something that happens at affection 1000 or something
There are three likely outcomes of this:
  • No actual effect on gameplay, since by the time you get to 1000 affection, your lair is already impregnable as far as running away goes. A medium amount of work for nothing but aesthetics I don't particularly like ('taming' girls).
  • Affection rises so fast the whole runaway mechanic becomes meaningless, as it is in the base game.
  • She runs away at affection 590, which will provoke the same complaints again.
Basically, runaways only happen when your dragon is a scrub or you screw up by e.g. trying to keep an angel on a bare mountaintop. I don't want to eliminate it from happening in either case.

And I definitely don't want cat-sized dragons preventing elven war maidens from running away from a hole in the ground just because they managed to torture them into abject terror with their 9 heads of doom that are all bark and no bite.

My comment about moaning was not to be taken literary I was making the point that I would rather have a slave to show me fake obedience to no slave at all.
And you get this and all possible permutations thereof depending on how well you're doing in the game.

and where as your right I am being influenced by test games remember, I'm also influenced by my base game experience I know roughly what to expect this far on
Yes, but this is not the base game. I can address the runaway system being unbalanced, i.e. girls running away from lairs they shouldn't be able or willing to. I'm not going to address it existing at all.

Girls run away from the dragon. The dragon prevents them from doing so by a combination of imprisoning them better, terrifying them, hiring guards, becoming more terrible etc. Not by pushing an 'awesome' button of magical no-escape.

Girls get rescued by Knights. The dragon again builds traps, hires guards, hides his lair and becomes bigger and badder. He doesn't press a magical button of 'charm Knight'.

Treasure gets stolen by Thieves. The dragon... well, the dragon can put a contract on a thief's head. But it's costly and the usual stuff will likely get the Thief anyway. You can even capture one for your amusement if you're lucky. ;)

All this is checked by testing girls (and Knights and Thieves) against appropriate lairs and dragons, not by hoping a gully without a single guard will defend against runaway angels if the dragon and affection levels are maxed.

we've done this, even a 0.1 percent chances means there's still a chance and if base building a development is your kink how much of that are you really getting to do if all your doing is filling them with traps just to keep what you feel is yours, I can see what's going to happen now, I'm going to have maybe five cores or hatchery and 500 traps. That's not really great development that's a META.
There are no '0.1% chances of escape'. It's either 1% or 0%. I guess I'll just post the pseudo-code for runaways so you'll see that your fears of '500 traps' are greatly exaggerated. Runaway chance in percent will be (negative chance is treated as zero, not a chance to get a new girl :D):
Code:
100 + 10*girl.power (the 'teal stat', basic angels have ca 10, peasants about 2) - affection (0-111) - lair.defense (a single trap gives 1-5, minions give 1-30 each, double that when in guard posts) - 25*lair.inaccessibility (0-3, e.g. starter lair is 0, ogre cave is 1, cloud castle is 2, Jötun castle is 3) - 2*dragon.fear (0-80)
Currently, it is even weaker:
Code:
100 + 5*girl.power - affection - lair.defense - 25*lair.inaccessibility
These are if the girl can actually try escaping at all (mermaids underwater, angels from mountaintops etc).

my concerns are only for my favorites
If you build your lair up well enough, no special girl will go missing from there. By the time you can afford to select angels from the sky, demons from the Darkwood, or get the elven queen or the fairy, your lair should be all but impregnable. If it is not, you lock them all up and go on a rampage to build up a secure lair to hold them in. A worthy goal for a girl-hoarding dragon, isn't it?

Again, I don't want to just start hacking up your mod ether
I don't mind. I welcome such attempts, in fact. There just aren't many people with the persistence or interest in doing that. I had exactly one person for my other mod, well, maybe also another who went sorta sideways before disappearing sometime in spring.

I know I've proposed changes but look at what I've asked for a way to stop death during pregnancy and away to garantee your girls don't run away, which you've already suggested would be easy.
Deaths during pregnancy: Tentacle Pits. Open up 'game\db\rooms.yaml' and change the fluff text to something like 'maternity ward' or whatever you like, if the tentacles bother you. You'll still get 'tentacled' messages when the girls die, but just try to keep them alive, okay? If they get low on HP, set them to torture some peasants in real cages for a few months. And they only need to be present during childbirth, not the whole time, to cut down on all the stat draining.

Edit: Or just keep them from getting pregnant altogether, since they're special.

Runaways: About 100 in lair defenses will prevent almost all runaways. Add in special lairs, and the 'almost' will become 'certainly'. You'll need to get 50 defense as part of a quest anyway. That 100 defense is 20 rune traps or half a dozen Wyverns in guard towers, not 500 traps. 100 basic pit traps or goblins, at the worst. :)

Again))00
Damn, how do you do that? That 'randintdice' needs to be just 'randint'. I'm used to another game that has a dice(sides,number_of_dice) function to facilitate this.

Edit: And EE Jim is right, the combat skills suffer from mismatching graphics filenames.
 
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Jman9

Engaged Member
Jul 17, 2019
2,295
957
But now I'm stuck in a dream.
That 'minion_id' needs to be 'room.minion.id'. Although why you have minions when you're so poor is a mystery. o_O

Edit: You should go visit the sperm bank... er, the Witch, or something. :p
 

Evil Earthworm Jim

Well-Known Member
Dec 21, 2019
1,026
1,142
And I said you'll get a 'magical condom' that does exactly this.


Affection is loyalty, of sorts. It's just, well, the same kind of loyalty the current US president gets, a fine-weather one.

And a dozen or so traps + a dozen guards + girl-appropriate lair will guarantee no runaways. I don't know why this is not getting across to you. :(


There are three likely outcomes of this:
  • No actual effect on gameplay, since by the time you get to 1000 affection, your lair is already impregnable as far as running away goes. A medium amount of work for nothing but aesthetics I don't particularly like ('taming' girls).
  • Affection rises so fast the whole runaway mechanic becomes meaningless, as it is in the base game.
  • She runs away at affection 590, which will provoke the same complaints again.
Basically, runaways only happen when your dragon is a scrub or you screw up by e.g. trying to keep an angel on a bare mountaintop. I don't want to eliminate it from happening in either case.

And I definitely don't want cat-sized dragons preventing elven war maidens from running away from a hole in the ground just because they managed to torture them into abject terror with their 9 heads of doom that are all bark and no bite.


And you get this and all possible permutations thereof depending on how well you're doing in the game.


Yes, but this is not the base game. I can address the runaway system being unbalanced, i.e. girls running away from lairs they shouldn't be able or willing to. I'm not going to address it existing at all.

Girls run away from the dragon. The dragon prevents them from doing so by a combination of imprisoning them better, terrifying them, hiring guards, becoming more terrible etc. Not by pushing an 'awesome' button of magical no-escape.

Girls get rescued by Knights. The dragon again builds traps, hires guards, hides his lair and becomes bigger and badder. He doesn't press a magical button of 'charm Knight'.

Treasure gets stolen by Thieves. The dragon... well, the dragon can put a contract on a thief's head. But it's costly and the usual stuff will likely get the Thief anyway. You can even capture one for your amusement if you're lucky. ;)

All this is checked by testing girls (and Knights and Thieves) against appropriate lairs and dragons, not by hoping a gully without a single guard will defend against runaway angels if the dragon and affection levels are maxed.


There are no '0.1% chances of escape'. It's either 1% or 0%. I guess I'll just post the pseudo-code for runaways so you'll see that your fears of '500 traps' are greatly exaggerated. Runaway chance in percent will be (negative chance is treated as zero, not a chance to get a new girl :D):
Code:
100 + 10*girl.power (the 'teal stat', basic angels have ca 10, peasants about 2) - affection (0-111) - lair.defense (a single trap gives 1-5, minions give 1-30 each, double that when in guard posts) - 25*lair.inaccessibility (0-3, e.g. starter lair is 0, ogre cave is 1, cloud castle is 2, Jötun castle is 3) - 2*dragon.fear (0-80)
Currently, it is even weaker:
Code:
100 + 5*girl.power - affection - lair.defense - 25*lair.inaccessibility
These are if the girl can actually try escaping at all (mermaids underwater, angels from mountaintops etc).


If you build your lair up well enough, no special girl will go missing from there. By the time you can afford to select angels from the sky, demons from the Darkwood, or get the elven queen or the fairy, your lair should be all but impregnable. If it is not, you lock them all up and go on a rampage to build up a secure lair to hold them in. A worthy goal for a girl-hoarding dragon, isn't it?


I don't mind. I welcome such attempts, in fact. There just aren't many people with the persistence or interest in doing that. I had exactly one person for my other mod, well, maybe also another who went sorta sideways before disappearing sometime in spring.


Deaths during pregnancy: Tentacle Pits. Open up 'game\db\rooms.yaml' and change the fluff text to something like 'maternity ward' or whatever you like, if the tentacles bother you. You'll still get 'tentacled' messages when the girls die, but just try to keep them alive, okay? If they get low on HP, set them to torture some peasants in real cages for a few months. And they only need to be present during childbirth, not the whole time, to cut down on all the stat draining.

Runaways: About 100 in lair defenses will prevent almost all runaways. Add in special lairs, and the 'almost' will become 'certainly'. You'll need to get 50 defense as part of a quest anyway. That 100 defense is 20 rune traps or half a dozen Wyverns in guard towers, not 500 traps. 100 basic pit traps or goblins, at the worst. :)


Damn, how do you do that? That 'randintdice' needs to be just 'randint'. I'm used to another game that has a dice(sides,number_of_dice)' function to facilitate this.

Edit: And EE Jim is right, the combat skills suffer from mismatching graphics filenames.
Your points about traps are getting through to me but that isn't security my man and that's the point I'm try to get through to you :D traps can be demolished can be lost when you move lair and during that time you can lose all of your hard work (the girls), it's that simple :) if the girls can't run away because of something you do to them you never need to worry about anything happening to upset the status quo this is the point I'm trying to get across.

As for that 0.1% I wasn't being literal, I was choosing the smallest increment to illustrate my point :) same for that 1000 affection thing, You could do as I've stated about simply have it that at affection 111 you can awaken them (break them finally make them completely under your control) and if you don't want to, don't:)

It's true that if you argument is that the girls would run away from a cat dragon they would of course, I would assume but I don't think they should at all when you are maxed out, by your premise they shouldn't, using the logic of your point, yes your lair should be kitted out by then however again keeping your argument in mind the dragons size should greatly influence that run away positively as much as it does negatively. :) although thank you for outlining the exact defense required to keep everyone in check however where as you need defense to protect yourself against thief's and knights and what have you don't really need it for keeping the girls from running away like in the base game. If your concern though is that tiny wimpy dragons shouldn't be able to intimidate girls into not running away, you could just have it that when you up grade your body size it doesn't happen any more. You've said that there is a lair that universally garantees no escapes, which one is it.
 
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