VN Ren'Py Where It All Began [Ch. 3 Full] [Oceanlab]

[mommysboiii]

to be clear I think both of ocean games have good cheracters, story, writting but I just think SG got more lucky and was more conistent from the start WIAB lost a lot of momentum with the rework but we will see how good the story will be in the future but I think that there is a high liklyhood that it will be the more itneresting story because ocean has more playground and writting possiblities with WIAB compared to SG so we will see but WIAB has definetly a higher possiblitie to be more interesting and have a way higher tension curve if done right

in SG he will get problems even if a men breath in the same direction as one of the love interest which will make the story possibilities way less itneresting and it will be super difficult story wise so WIAB definitly has a HUGE advantage

 

[holaje12]

its not your point was that ntr is always less sucessfull because people complelty avoid it and dosent have much fans (maybe because people compare their seiz too other people or are insecure or whatever reason) but than this would also happen in porn that people would avoid it also for the same reasons.

Why would people avoid gangbang or bbc stuff. You are not making any sense. Those kinks are not disliked by anyone. If you want to make a valid comparison then talk about the extreme cuck porn where the cuck eats the cum of the bull out of her wifes pussy. That is the porn that most might want to avoid, or maybe some scat or pegging. Gangbang,bbc, bukkake thats not "extreme" porn or niche, thats everyday stuff. You are comparing apples and oranges

no this is just your claim with solo examples

No, thats my claim with two examples of devs offering both options having two different outcomes. You can look for even more examples. Like the dev for Golden Boy that has recently removed all ntr from his game in order to try and gain more support. But no matter how many examples I brought up you will keep in denial so, it is pointless.

if a big majority of people feel insecure in a VN over pixels they would also feel insecure about pixels in porn and the big budget high qualtie stuff also has a little bit of story stuff IF WE TALK ABOUT BUG BUDGET

No, dude. Do I really have to explain the difference between an avn and real porn?
Even if you say theres insecure people, they only get insecure because they self insert in the MC. And take decisions and affect the story. That only happens in avn. High quality and BIG BUDGET porn do not have a story lol. The usual: "Help step-bro, I got stuck in the washing machine" does not qualify as story lmaoo. Or making a parody porn about the pirates of the caribbean does not qualify as a story lmaoo, why are we even discussing this??

again you have solo examples I could do the same know and mention all sucessfull mangas with ntr tag and pornos and Visual novels that have ntr tag and are doing very creat but I will not do it because this examples with good and bad are on both sides.

I didnt say ntr games couldnt do well, I said they could. But never as good as non ntr games.
Anyway, too much spam. So I'll stop here.

 

[mommysboiii]

I didnt say ntr games couldnt do well, I said they could. But never as good as non ntr games. Show me a ntr AVN that is making the same money as BaDIK or Summertime Saga or even NLT and I'll concede to you.
But please dont bring up irl porn stuff, thats so stupid, I cant believe I am having that conversation.

this are not even good written or super complex games and you proof my point with this that it has more to do with luck and be at the right time at the right place and a little bit of skill.

and its not really fair there are like 3 or 5 creators that have that numbers (so statisticly if most games are women collecting games they have a higher chance to be on top because there are like millions of this games) and keep in mind this games came first and fastly build a loyal fanbase (with little competition at that time) I can garantee you if any of this games would have OPTIONAL ntr at the start they would still make the same amount of money maybe there would be 100-400 patreons less but with that numbers definitly nothing HUGE

taffy tales (uberPie), our red string (eva kiss), a promise best left unkept (hangovercat),seeds of chaos (venus noire) and plety more same for pornos and mangas

 

[holaje12]

this are not even good written or super complex games and you proof my point with this that it has more to do with luck and be at the right time at the right place and a little bit of skill.

They are good by porn game standards, both in visuals and story. But there are ntr games with similar quality or even much better renders that dont make even half . And thats no luck, thats always the losers excuse.

taffy tales (uberPie), our red string (eva kiss), a promise best left unkept (hangovercat),seeds of chaos (venus noire) and plety more same for pornos and mangas

Yes, those games you mentioned are doing good, thats what I said, the ntr games can do good but not top money.

and its not really fair there are like 3 or 5 creators that have that numbers (so statisticly if most games are women collecting women games they have a higher chance to be on top because there are like millions of this games) and keep in mind this games came first and fastly build a loyal fanbase (with little competition at that time) I I can garantee you if any of this games would have OPTIONAL ntr at the start they would still make the same amount of money maybe there would be 100 patreon but definitly nothing HUGE

Statistically if there are less ntr games then they should be doing much better economically than non ntr games. Because the target audience of non ntr games would be scattered around many different non ntr games. Thats how supply and demand works. And that shows that the non ntr audience is so huge that it can sustain the vast majority of games and even the top earning ones. In contrast the ntr audience struggles even with their limited options and have to be helped by those who dont care about ntr as long as it is avoidable.
I can garantee you that if any of those games I mentioned ever add ntr they'll lose a huge chunk of suscribers, but they wont add it, because know better. Lets just stop here too much spam and we'll never agree anyway. And stop talking about irl porn when discussing games, it is annoying, like some dude bringing up soccer when discussing basketball. Makes no sense. Bye

 

[mommysboiii]

Yes, those games you mentioned are doing good, thats what I said, the ntr games can do good but not top money.

dude what do you consider top notch money most of this games I mentiont make over 10.000 dollars a month(thisa re like top 1% of creators) do you have any idea how much that is for a niche thing like EROTIC VISUAL NOVELS there are like 3 or 5 guys that make your 50 k number a month because they build a LOYAL FANBASE at the start of this site THEY GOT LUCKY most people are not insecure or write in this forum at all they dont care what they jerk of too they were the first there are plenty of guys that have good renders and are the same like the games you mentioned harem with better renders that make maybe 1000 bucks a month

why do you think companys try to make mass effect 69 and assasins creed 20 and not new ips?? becasue they build a loyal fanbase and its risky to start new ip even with most skilled devs in the world and endless money in the world

most people dont care about optional ntr they just like the cheracters and build a connection with the community and cheracters they would still simp over there bad dig cheracters even with optional ntr

 

[Euron13]

Realistically with how slow this game progresses, both in terms of the narrative and release dates, I don’t think heavy NTR is going to be a huge issue for a while yet.

 

[The D0n]

dude what do you consider top notch money most of this games I mentiont make over 10.000 dollars a month(thisa re like top 1% of creators) do you have any idea how much that is for a niche thing like EROTIC VISUAL NOVELS there are like 3 or 5 guys that make your 50 k number a month because they build a LOYAL FANBASE at the start of this site THEY GOT LUCKY most people are not insecure or write in this forum at all they dont care what they jerk of too they were the first there are plenty of guys that have good renders and are the same like the games you mentioned harem with better renders that make maybe 1000 bucks a month

why do you think companys try to make mass effect 69 and assasins creed 20 and not new ips?? becasue they build a loyal fanbase and its risky to start new ip even with most skilled devs in the world and endless money in the world

most people dont care about optional ntr they just like the cheracters and build a connection with the community and cheracters they would still simp over there bad dig cheracters even with optional ntr

I do and I have stated why. NTR is a low share of the market in every aspect and to the majority of the userbase is a turn off.

That is why it is important to either make one or the other as narratively it just does'nt work.

Luck has nothing to do with it... and to assume like your assumption that everyone shares the same kink to you is breathtaking, a lot of people avoid mastubory kinks as they are not into the act. No one is at fault just pick a lane as a Developer.

NTR and Solo are like Oil and Water.....

 

[WastedTalent]

Spoiler: Tags aren't the issue here....

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[mommysboiii]

NTR is a low share of the market in every aspect and to the majority of the userbase is a turn off.

low share dosent make over 10.000 dollar a month in a niche market like erotic visual novels

That is why it is important to either make one or the other as narratively it just does'nt work.

what do you mean it dosent work narratively?? I already showed games that make over 10.000 dollars a month and are narratively fantastic with OPTIONAL NTR seeds of chaos ,our red string.......................... they are narratively on top compared to the average no story pokemon/women collecting games

Luck has nothing to do with it

I know its difficult to understand and it hurts the ego but yes its like everything in life 80% luck 10% right moment at the right time and 10% skill I know it hurts the ego but I am sorry it is what it is there are plenty of people that have better renders, better writting and (only make 1500 dollar a month) even if they are objectivly better than the 50 k a month games in every possible way AGIAN there is a reason why big companys making assasin creed 33 inestad of taking risk or beaing innovative

everyone shares the same kink to you is breathtaking

again most people are not insecure and they really really really dont care if they jerk of on bukakke,gangbangs,lesbian conent,milfs,teens,dominant ,sub content,pegging,trans/shemale content or whatever they really dont CARE at all

to the majority of the userbase is a turn off.

no the majority dosent care and dosent write in this forum or is insecure about pixels they dont care about gangbangs and all that stuff THEY JUST WANT interesting cheracters,interesting story and hot scenes to jerk of MOST PEOPLE ARE NOT INSECURE ON PIXELS

 

[Feru452ax]

MOST PEOPLE ARE NOT INSECURE ON PIXELS

Just wanted to post to agree HEAVILY with this. I don't judge, but I can't avoid to think that people crying over NTR on a porn game made with pixels are just VERY sad with their current life.

If a person isn't sad with their life, if they have a partner at their side, if they have a good job, friends, etc. they wouldn't get so hurt and angry at a pixel doing something. Or they wouldn't create feelings for a bunch of pixels assembled that LOOKS LIKE a person.

Like I said, I don't judge. The way world is these days, with all those stimulus bombing, and the pathetic "work untill you bleed so you can have the merit of not starving" created in neoliberalism for some wealthy people become "coaches" , all the filters on social media, etc, etc, etc. it's hard to be happy with your own life.

But people should stop to think the obvious for 2 sec: CHARACTERS IN A GAME/TV SHOW/MOVIE DON'T EXIST.

If NTR is not forced on the game, just avoid. If it's forced, don't play.
People who don't like scat on porn games will just skip it right? People who don't like lesbianism or gay content will skip it right? People who don't like harem will skip it right?

ust do the same, stop falling in love with pixels in an atempt to make yourself happier, it won't work.

 

[WICKEDp4th]

Just wanted to post to agree HEAVILY with this. I don't judge, but I can't avoid to think that people crying over NTR on a porn game made with pixels are just VERY sad with their current life.

If a person isn't sad with their life, if they have a partner at their side, if they have a good job, friends, etc. they wouldn't get so hurt and angry at a pixel doing something. Or they wouldn't create feelings for a bunch of pixels assembled that LOOKS LIKE a person.

Like I said, I don't judge. The way world is these days, with all those stimulus bombing, and the pathetic "work untill you bleed so you can have the merit of not starving" created in neoliberalism for some wealthy people become "coaches" , all the filters on social media, etc, etc, etc. it's hard to be happy with your own life.

But people should stop to think the obvious for 2 sec: CHARACTERS IN A GAME/TV SHOW/MOVIE DON'T EXIST.

If NTR is not forced on the game, just avoid. If it's forced, don't play.
People who don't like scat on porn games will just skip it right? People who don't like lesbianism or gay content will skip it right? People who don't like harem will skip it right?

ust do the same, stop falling in love with pixels in an atempt to make yourself happier, it won't work.

I kinda agree with you on this, but i want to add another layer to that stuff, to think about.

First i want to say, i'm not complaining about stuff in the AVN's. If i don't like it, i simply quit, but...
as a guy, that is relativly happy with his live, i still despise NTR to a degree, it's not because i fall in love with some artsy crafted women, but because i have the power of immersiveness (you can call it self-insertion), means i put myself very easy into the (any) main characters perspective (i'm simply made this way ). NTR is a very controversial topic, because i'm no cuck, i cannot enjoy this type of content, at least the Netorare part is a complete turn off for me.

I think you are right about some guys who dive to deep into the feelings department about "their" woman, but like i wrote, there are just simply (many) people who put themself into the MC's of these games and getting a huge turn-off by getting cucked. Obviously i cannot speak for others, but i would like to think that it is this way.

The public complaining is annoying, i agree.

 

[Dragon59]

Indeed, it's kinda odd that SG is so much more popular than WiAB (especially in Discord).

I have no clue what happened about the chapter count. I'm just guessing Ocean is taking a different approach to the story.

I know what it means here, but when I see SG, I can't help but think Suicide Girls.

 

[Ilhares]

I know what it means here, but when I see SG, I can't help but think Suicide Girls.
View attachment 2720828

I used to think about them, but I miss thr old logo (hair was up) and when they at least had a good reputation. Finding out from a couple locals how the company really treated them was a bit of a downer.

At least the pixel girls don't disappoint.

 

[omgx123]

Everybody project manager until it's time to do it for real and take responsibility for bad decisions
I mean SG will be released on Steam and it's a great opportunity to impress a huge audience and make the game widely known. But the responsibility is as great as the opportunity, there is only one chance to make the first impression. I'm perfectly sure Ocean rates the quality of the game for release on Steam much better than me, you, or anyone else and he is much more than anyone else interested in the success of the release. So if he sees music as the weakest point at the moment, I would trust him on that. After all, he made the game the way it is now, and most of us like it. Remember how much he was blamed and still being criticized for reworking the first chapters of SG? But if you read the reviews that are written in the thread by people who first saw SG, then in most cases there will be something along the lines: "Amazing graphics, simply the best, only a small part of the second chapter looks much worse, just a pimple on perfect skin, what was that lol?" Moreover, as far as I understand from the dev log, he still does not have the opportunity to purchase this super-duper cgi workstation anyway and the successful release can give such an opportunity. So if he believes that investing in music will add more value to the game at release than anything else, I'll trust him on that. It's a pity that WIAB's budget doesn't allow him to buy a good music only for this game, but in the past, many songs were common for both games and it worked perfectly, some songs became the hallmark of both games, so this is not a problem.

Well idk what he thinks exactly, did he do some kind of poll with 2 choices to his supporters? "Licensed expensive music or more update frequency with more content"
I am pretty sure the latter option would be chosen by most. And the thing is, if he releases an incomplete game on steam with updates/seasons to follow every time period, the people would be more eager to play the next update asap, and the dev should focus on releasing updates asap in this regard. On the other hand, if it was a full game release on steam and is completed, then the music would matter to complete the full package.
Anyway, the game is good, just the updates roll up too slowly, one almost have to replay from the start each time to remember what is going on.

 

[Ass Fan]

Man I still don't understand some people who complain because of the NTR even though it is optional and the player have the choice of it off or not at the beginning of the game
In the old version, this content was more focused on Miru's side So far, everything was fine with me because I didn't like that dragon version of her very much. Anyway now with some changes and this content being pulled to Leia I also confess that at the beginning it left me disappointed because she is my favorite but that's not why I'm going to keep complaining I'm just going to avoid it now for those who like it and are going to follow this path have fun everyone here has their own tastes and fetishes

 

[Nikko_]

Just a guess but it could be the NTR. That alone will alienate a huge amount of potential audience since it's pretty much a small minority of guys that like that kinda stuff.

Or it could be the fact that SG is way better written and has better characters. Not trying to hate WiAB, it is what it is. I dont think SG even has sex scenes. Keeping people interested despite the lack of it says a lot.

 

[The D0n]

Just wanted to post to agree HEAVILY with this. I don't judge, but I can't avoid to think that people crying over NTR on a porn game made with pixels are just VERY sad with their current life.

If a person isn't sad with their life, if they have a partner at their side, if they have a good job, friends, etc. they wouldn't get so hurt and angry at a pixel doing something. Or they wouldn't create feelings for a bunch of pixels assembled that LOOKS LIKE a person.

Like I said, I don't judge. The way world is these days, with all those stimulus bombing, and the pathetic "work untill you bleed so you can have the merit of not starving" created in neoliberalism for some wealthy people become "coaches" , all the filters on social media, etc, etc, etc. it's hard to be happy with your own life.

But people should stop to think the obvious for 2 sec: CHARACTERS IN A GAME/TV SHOW/MOVIE DON'T EXIST.

If NTR is not forced on the game, just avoid. If it's forced, don't play.
People who don't like scat on porn games will just skip it right? People who don't like lesbianism or gay content will skip it right? People who don't like harem will skip it right?

ust do the same, stop falling in love with pixels in an atempt to make yourself happier, it won't work.

Fair point, not that anyone addressed my point about the writing .... but I guess that must be crying in some weird way.

Either the story works as a Solo or they write a NTR plot... that is the beginning, end and only issue with NTR and Solo development.

Next person to bang on about people complaining about NTR without addressing my very simple point can save us all time and don't even bother to reply

 

[yossa999]

Well idk what he thinks exactly, did he do some kind of poll with 2 choices to his supporters? "Licensed expensive music or more update frequency with more content"
I am pretty sure the latter option would be chosen by most. And the thing is, if he releases an incomplete game on steam with updates/seasons to follow every time period, the people would be more eager to play the next update asap, and the dev should focus on releasing updates asap in this regard. On the other hand, if it was a full game release on steam and is completed, then the music would matter to complete the full package.
Anyway, the game is good, just the updates roll up too slowly, one almost have to replay from the start each time to remember what is going on.

Hey, as a game fan, I'm with you with all my heart. I would prefer more content over the music any day. Moreover, there are quite enough free tracks, not songs, but simply relaxing, trance music, which makes an excellent background for the darkish and foggy surroundings of most of the scenes in the game. But here we step into the artist's territory. Perhaps he does not consider the first season complete without key songs (not to mention his perfectionism), and here the final decision is up to him and not to user polls. Players will grumble and forget that the update took a month longer, but it is much more difficult to forget the absolute harmony of the picture, plot, cinematography and music. Moreover I can't deny that in some scenes music does really matter. Just imagine the most romantic movie you can think of. The lead characters are dancing to the end of love, wouldn't you think that music is extremely important to such a setting, to convey their feelings to the viewers as well as the looks, touches and whatnot? And poorly chosen music can simply turn the meaning of the scene from romance to travesty.

 

[Nachtfalke]

I really have a big problem to understand "NTR" correctly, so I am of the opinion it means cheating.

Of course I would never want to see other men on my girl, but what about other women? I read something about Lesbian NTR.

If my girl makes out with other girls it would not bother me is that the NTR ?

Sorry but in Germany maybe 5% would share their girl with other guys but I think 80% would like a bi girlfriend.

I have now in the game NTR on on as long as no man goes to my girlfriend, but if I set it to off comes no girl to my girlfriend ?

 

[dervalle007]

I really have a big problem to understand "NTR" correctly, so I am of the opinion it means cheating.

There you are not alone. Sometimes I feel like there are as many definitions of NTR as there are stars in the sky. But for the sake of simplicity, cheating describes it pretty well. There are just a lot of different perceptions of what cheating is. I recently played a game (The Lust City) where one of the LIs rode a dildo and there were actually some complete idiots who took that as NTR and cried about it.