RPGM A Struggle with Sin [v0.5.8.5b] [Chyos]

[Tehemai]

Eh, while there are discussions to have about level scaling and how it's bad in most cases, i don't really mind it personally in this one. Personally didn't really feel like getting weaker when leveling up, but that might also be because i tried to always upgrade my gear as soon as possible. Also different combat actions have different speeds, so there's also that.

While it is weird that goblins are way tougher than most orcs you encounter, it's done like that due to game balancing reasons in the story. If orcs were tougher than goblins, Chyos would have to change the story by switching orcs and goblins around and that would be bit hard considering the storyline. Also it's reasonable that you can't beat every enemy on every stat or their primary stat. You just have to try and build MC and waifus in a way, that they can beat enemies even if some of them are faster or stronger than they are.

But now days, after playing from the start so many times, i usually just skip parts of the grind by giving myself few extra stats with cheat book.

Yea, as I said it's not a big deal to me either. But sugarcoating is not necessary, it's obviously not great design. I don't think it's really justified by balancing either. Dynamic scaling is always a risky venture but one thing we all know is that a level up should never feel like a level down. That's the classic trapping of the design. Oblivion fell for that too and got roasted for it.

Personally I think you should also absolutely be able to keep up with a mere goblin if you're focusing the stat and even sacrificing armor slots. It's still in the end of the day just a regular goblin, not an emerald powered hedgehog or a metal slime. But I suppose that's more opinion. Getting progressively slower though? Definitely not ideal. And it's not like it's the only stat, their damage and tankiness also go up.

As for the difference between orcs and goblins, I'm not really sure about that one either. It may have been implemented late, but the goblin quest is not remotely late game. I naturally got to it well before cultists on my playthrough. And they max at 20ish. And with tia taunt I was still able to farm them for absurd xp because of that level scaling. A single group of goblins quickly starts giving you more xp than saving all of rumah. It actually breaks the game balance if you fight too many. They even have an infinite spawn trigger.

TLDR, it doesn't bother me but level scaling right now is busted. I still think dev time management is an issue so I don't really mind if it doesn't get fixed for a while though. There are other issues, not a priority at least for me.

 

[Samuel Hidayat]

Yea, as I said it's not a big deal to me either. But sugarcoating is not necessary, it's obviously not great design. I don't think it's really justified by balancing either. Dynamic scaling is always a risky venture but one thing we all know is that a level up should never feel like a level down. That's the classic trapping of the design. Oblivion fell for that too and got roasted for it.

Personally I think you should also absolutely be able to keep up with a mere goblin if you're focusing the stat and even sacrificing armor slots. It's still in the end of the day just a regular goblin, not an emerald powered hedgehog or a metal slime. But I suppose that's more opinion. Getting progressively slower though? Definitely not ideal. And it's not like it's the only stat, their damage and tankiness also go up.

As for the difference between orcs and goblins, I'm not really sure about that one either. It may have been implemented late, but the goblin quest is not remotely late game. I naturally got to it well before cultists on my playthrough. And they max at 20ish. And with tia taunt I was still able to farm them for absurd xp because of that level scaling. A single group of goblins quickly starts giving you more xp than saving all of rumah. It actually breaks the game balance if you fight too many. They even have an infinite spawn trigger.

TLDR, it doesn't bother me but level scaling right now is busted. I still think dev time management is an issue so I don't really mind if it doesn't get fixed for a while though. There are other issues, not a priority at least for me.

Chyos said he'll rebalance the game in the next update. Don't know which version though.

 

[123Ins123]

Tia and Katherine dont have 3some in this update yet, right?

It seems not yet.

 

[Tehemai]

Chyos said he'll rebalance the game in the next update. Don't know which version though.

Yea, I heard about that but I wasn't sure what he's balancing. But despite everything, I actually don't think he needs to worry about it too much yet since the game is still seemingly early in development. I'm sure he'll need to do it again before long as more content gets implemented anyways.

But I suppose if he's doing that already, he should probably fix the current glaring scaling issues. Maybe tune regular enemy scaling a bit down (xp&stats), quest/boss xp up and put more sensible level caps.

 

[Evangelion-01]

People don't talk about serious matters much around children that are only a few years old, kids that age barely give a shit about anything, and people have almost no memories of those ages in the first place. No, that isn't obvious. You seem to have just made it up. I certainly haven't seen any explanation from anyone, and the only dialogue so far has been Rick saying he doesn't like her because she's big and strong.

If they didn't in your childhood that's one thing but in general Parents worry about their kids haveing a child with potentially the strength of an adult and a short temper has nearly a guarnatee for a broken bone every once and now (and Tia did prove she had that capacity).

Any time you make a decision in a game based on knowledge from outside the game is metagame and bad design for rpgs. You know, like noticing that a character has dialogue options, and so assuming they must be the person to talk to about something even though you have no in-narrative reason to think they'd be the source of that info.

Metagame aspects can be good in non-narrative contexts, like color coding in games to communicate where to go, or what you can interact with can be very useful.

If you like bad game design and nonsensical puzzles to progress them, that's a personal issue of yours.

So if you fail to get yourself into the game and would need to check back with the Walkthrough (which can be entirely avoided by useing logic, keeping track of the Questlog and dialogues of Characters) it's Metagame and bad design?
That's an entirely personal definition of this and hencefor a personal, but not a valid point.

Yea, as I said it's not a big deal to me either. But sugarcoating is not necessary, it's obviously not great design. I don't think it's really justified by balancing either. Dynamic scaling is always a risky venture but one thing we all know is that a level up should never feel like a level down. That's the classic trapping of the design. Oblivion fell for that too and got roasted for it.

Personally I think you should also absolutely be able to keep up with a mere goblin if you're focusing the stat and even sacrificing armor slots. It's still in the end of the day just a regular goblin, not an emerald powered hedgehog or a metal slime. But I suppose that's more opinion. Getting progressively slower though? Definitely not ideal. And it's not like it's the only stat, their damage and tankiness also go up.

As for the difference between orcs and goblins, I'm not really sure about that one either. It may have been implemented late, but the goblin quest is not remotely late game. I naturally got to it well before cultists on my playthrough. And they max at 20ish. And with tia taunt I was still able to farm them for absurd xp because of that level scaling. A single group of goblins quickly starts giving you more xp than saving all of rumah. It actually breaks the game balance if you fight too many. They even have an infinite spawn trigger.

TLDR, it doesn't bother me but level scaling right now is busted. I still think dev time management is an issue so I don't really mind if it doesn't get fixed for a while though. There are other issues, not a priority at least for me.

Here is a point to consider.
We don't really know much of these Goblins, they were bred by a Dark Elf with strong magical powers.
I think Chyos will adress the Level difference in the next Bianca Update when you return to the mine and find one of their breeding grounds as Chyos hinted so far... I could imagine that the Dark Elf placed some rituals/wards to strentghen the Goblins in that lair.
Also in order to Save Bianca and Gavina you either need silver arrows (from the Cultist Questline) or to be Gwen/Ishas apprentice (which requires to hunt swamp beasts, which have the same Level as Cultists)

 

[Nighthumper123]

Joiplay sucks is there any alternatives that I can use?

 

[zARRR]

Any time you make a decision in a game based on knowledge from outside the game is metagame and bad design for rpgs. You know, like noticing that a character has dialogue options, and so assuming they must be the person to talk to about something even though you have no in-narrative reason to think they'd be the source of that info.

Metagame aspects can be good in non-narrative contexts, like color coding in games to communicate where to go, or what you can interact with can be very useful.

If you like bad game design and nonsensical puzzles to progress them, that's a personal issue of yours.

Man did you just contradict yourself?
Wasnn’t metagame design bad in general lmao.

I am giving up on you explaining things tho, since you would call bad design half of the games that don’t follow your perspective on things.
The Sheika statues in Oot give me hints even if they have no in-narrative reason! That‘s bad design right there!
Some metal gear solid bosses require me to use external methods! Hell of a bad design!
Going down on a pipe by pressing “down“ in super Mario bros requires intuition? Bad design!
The entirety of Pathologic

And don’t get me started on the other things I have mentioned for Rick to have in game relevance<!

Yeah, and some people might want to fornicate with their dogs. Do you have a relevant point, or are you just butthurt I'm criticizing this game?

Why being rude?
He gave a point and you basically answered “However your mother”.

Joiplay sucks is there any alternatives that I can use?

Use the PC

 

[Ottoeight]

Guys, why are you still answering him?

 

[Evangelion-01]

Guys, why are you still answering him?

Cause it's a break to more "theonewhomsnameyoumayneversay", "svegme pls" or "I need to get cucked real bad" replies you normally get otherwise.

 

[Nighthumper123]

Man did you just contradict yourself?
Wasnn’t metagame design bad in general lmao.

I am giving up on you explaining things tho, since you would call bad design half of the games that don’t follow your perspective on things.
The Sheika statues in Oot give me hints even if they have no in-narrative reason! That‘s bad design right there!
Some metal gear solid bosses require me to use external methods! Hell of a bad design!
Going down on a pipe by pressing “down“ in super Mario bros requires intuition? Bad design!
The entirety of Pathologic

And don’t get me started on the other things I have mentioned for Rick to have in game relevance<!

Why being rude?
He gave a point and you basically answered “However your mother”.

Use the PC

My PC overheats last month and I'm saving to buy a new one

 

[zARRR]

My PC overheats last month and I'm saving to buy a new one

Then just wait, the game wasn’t meant for android or joy play

 

[HentaiKami]

My PC overheats last month and I'm saving to buy a new one

Better to wait, at least then you have way more new content to play when you finally have pc to play this with.

 

[Tehemai]

Here is a point to consider.
We don't really know much of these Goblins, they were bred by a Dark Elf with strong magical powers.
I think Chyos will adress the Level difference in the next Bianca Update when you return to the mine and find one of their breeding grounds as Chyos hinted so far... I could imagine that the Dark Elf placed some rituals/wards to strentghen the Goblins in that lair.
Also in order to Save Bianca and Gavina you either need silver arrows (from the Cultist Questline) or to be Gwen/Ishas apprentice (which requires to hunt swamp beasts, which have the same Level as Cultists)

Definitely looking forward to Dark Elf stuff and of course a plot device to justify the imbalance is really always a plausibility. Not worried, just felt it need to be pointed out. The guy that brought it up did touch on some valid criticism and imo it's more constructive than focusing on the more subjective stuff we don't agree on.

Saving Bianca or Gavina is kinda irrelevant since you get there before that. You don't need to finish gavina, you just need to start it. You can get there really early naturally and you can break the game's entire leveling curve with just a little farming because of how it works.

I know this because initially I was struggling early game to get xp, so I searched the thread and found a lot of cultist recommendations. But many in game days before I actually got to the cultists, I stole a single jewel for bianca and was given access to the cave. Which requires almost no time and turned out to be infinitely more broken than the cultists. And because it required facing goblins at every level, the problems with the scaling was easily observable as the fights would get harder. I went from 6 to 35 and the only thing that stopped me from doing it in a single in game day or getting to 60+ was me.

There's other issues with the game that may be more important, but he's right that it's technically one of them. The scaling system simultaneously punishing, logically inconsistent and exploitable.

 

[Ottoeight]

Cause it's a break to more "theonewhomsnameyoumayneversay", "svegme pls" or "I need to get cucked real bad" replies you normally get otherwise.

Well, I guess I'm going to start asking for questions, too.

- please, I need ntr save.

- I'm stuck at the beginning. Is there a walkthrough?

- I need cheats. Where are the cheats?

- I can't find the violin.The game must be bugged for sure.

- I have 67 mercenaries at my camp but I can't hire more. I swear I didn't break my saves by cheating.

- I can't trigger the Rick-MC-Thomas-Kate gangbang hidden scene they told me Chyos implemented. What am I supposed to do?

- I'm playing this hyper-ultra-mega-giga-compressed version (down to 568 K!!!) but the games crashes. Please help

- is the cat really a cat? there must be a secret plot involving the cat for sure.

- is there ntr? should I play with ntr off?

 

[Survivor54]

Well, I guess I'm going to start asking for questions, too.

- please, I need ntr save.

- I'm stuck at the beginning. Is there a walkthrough?

- I need cheats. Where are the cheats?

- I can't find the violin.The game must be bugged for sure.

- I have 67 mercenaries at my camp but I can't hire more. I swear I didn't break my saves by cheating.

- I can't trigger the Rick-MC-Thomas-Kate gangbang hidden scene they told me Chyos implemented. What am I supposed to do?

- I'm playing this hyper-ultra-mega-giga-compressed version (down to 568 K!!!) but the games crashes. Please help

- is the cat really a cat? there must be a secret plot involving the cat for sure.

- is there ntr? should I play with ntr off?

Don't forget "Hey, who can get pregnant so far?"

 

[Ottoeight]

Don't forget "Hey, who can get pregnant so far?"

No need to ask: I know it's Lucius.

 

[zARRR]

No need to ask: I know it's Lucius.

Actually is Giron, he has been pregnant since the beginning of the game!
Can’t you see that belly?
Must be triplets

 

[Tehemai]

Actually is Giron, he has been pregnant since the beginning of the game!
Can’t you see that belly?
Must be triplets

Of course, that's why he made sure Yasmine was physically ready to nurse 3. Good dad Giron.

 

[Nighthumper123]

Where can I find dress for lyvia

 

[Samuel Hidayat]

Where can I find dress for lyvia

Giron's Mansion, 2nd Floor, bottom right room.