VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.10.1] [Dr PinkCake]

[shazba]

With all the choices already made, we are already nearly locked DIK or CHICK, or basically neutral with mild eather side affinity.
Soon all the decisive choices will be decided by our former ones and the affinity thing will have shaped our char one of these 3 possibility.
I don't think we'll have much more decisive choice. This system is just a way to determine our char personality and the job is nearly done already, I see it more as the morality system in RPG but gradually implemented by our choices instead of being decided at trhe begining.

Yeah that's always the problem with having a linear scale -- whether it be Good/Evil, Law/Chaos, DIK/CHICK -- is that it's necessarily boxing you into a set of actions or reactions that are predictable. But the moment you diverge from that scale for the sake of story or character growth, like a DIK character confronting Sage about being her rebound guy, no matter how reasonable that is, it can and will cause confusion and criticism regardless of the merit of the interaction simply because players expect their choices to matter. This is why, if I were ever to make a game, I'd never put a system like this into it because it creates expectations and anxieties in players that they will be locked out of content they want for completely arbitrary reasons.

Here's the direct quote from the official season 1 walkthrough by DPC about what DIK points represent:

"In general, nicer/calmer/more mature actions remove DIK points and meaner/edgier/impulsive actions add DIK points."

In general, being a Massive DIK means you're mean/edgy/impulsive. That's a wide array of behaviors, as there's a big difference between being mean as opposed to being edgy as opposed to be impulsive. But still, it's not wide enough to actually allow for believable reactions to real situations. That's why you have these jarring moments in the game, like a DIK MC crying about Maya and Josy lying to him about their relationship when he should be trying to score the threesome right away, or crying about being Sage's rebound guy when by all accounts he should be much more confident and less insecure about that. Then, on the other end, when the scale is working as intended, all it's really doing is locking you out of content you might enjoy and giving you access to content you might not. For example, giving DIKs access to Madame for working at the Pink Rose is something I'm not interested in, and locking Bella's 69 option which I am interested in behind a CHICK check for no reason.

What is it about being meaner/edgier/impulsive that means I can't go down on Bella? Only the fact that she's a CHICK LI -- but is that even true, because you can romance her perfectly fine as a DIK, just like you can romance Sage perfectly fine as a CHICK. It don't make no sense, so I definitely share the fear that future content I'm interested in will be arbitrarily locked behind my affinity score for no good reason.

Anyway thanks for coming to my TED talk

I think the system works fine.

As well as choices (like as a total DIK you can choose to push Chad in the cafeteria, check out Sage’s g-string in the college hallway, push your lunch to fuck Envy’s ass in the private room, hop in the hot tub with Mel, Sarah and Heather, invite the girls into the shower at the HOTs, just to name a few scenes), it also changes the mc’s tone in heaps of conversations.

Your choices let you play as a character who is either aloof and disrespectful, or as a sincere, thoughtful guy.

It could have been a startup option (choose whether you want to be a “tough guy” or a “metrosexual”), but this way it’s a bit more dynamic.

Is it perfect? Nope. Can it be? Nope. But it’s novel, and I like it.

Sure, you don’t get to have a fulfilling relationship with Jill if you’re a DIK, and Quinn isn’t gonna take you seriously if you’re a Chick, but the game has great replayability, so just replay it and change your choices.

 

[ChipLecsap]

Who else feels like midterms are coming too fast? Anyone?

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[Skjall]

A quick google search of "academic year in Sweden" reveals, that it starts early September.
If DPC used his own country's usual start date, it makes sense that a month passed in-game and we're at October now, since the talk about preparing Helloween party.

 

[PashafromRussia]

A lot of images from the rooster dedicated to midterm exams. Either we are waiting for a new mini-game or mechanics dedicated to passing exams, or most of it will be devoted to studying. I wonder how we can pass the gender studies exam Jade?

 

[felicemastronzo]

A lot of images from the rooster dedicated to midterm exams. Either we are waiting for a new mini-game or mechanics dedicated to passing exams, or most of it will be devoted to studying. I wonder how we can pass the gender studies exam Jade?

What i am waiting for....

 

[DirtyMario]

A lot of images from the rooster dedicated to midterm exams. Either we are waiting for a new mini-game or mechanics dedicated to passing exams, or most of it will be devoted to studying. I wonder how we can pass the gender studies exam Jade?

We should kind of be through already since we studied her gender extensively

 

[PashafromRussia]

I think the system works fine.

As well as choices (like as a total DIK you can choose to push Chad in the cafeteria, check out Sage’s g-string in the college hallway, push your lunch to fuck Envy’s ass in the private room, hop in the hot tub with Mel, Sarah and Heather, invite the girls into the shower at the HOTs, just to name a few scenes), it also changes the mc’s tone in heaps of conversations.

Your choices let you play as a character who is either aloof and disrespectful, or as a sincere, thoughtful guy.

It could have been a startup option (choose whether you want to be a “tough guy” or a “metrosexual”), but this way it’s a bit more dynamic.

Is it perfect? Nope. Can it be? Nope. But it’s novel, and I like it.

Sure, you don’t get to have a fulfilling relationship with Jill if you’re a DIK, and Quinn isn’t gonna take you seriously if you’re a Chick, but the game has great replayability, so just replay it and change your choices.

The nuance is that the character Сhick can have a relationship with all the main love interests. And Dik is only with Sage and Bella (unless he was stupid with Сathy). I guess the main idea is in the opposition of love and lust. If you like a girl, don't fuck with others. And vice versa. As a result, I assume the character Dik will be alone in the ending, and Chick will be fine.

 

[tipsytopsy]

The nuance is that the character Сhick can have a relationship with all the main love interests. And Dik is only with Sage and Bella (unless he was stupid with Сathy). I guess the main idea is in the opposition of love and lust. If you like a girl, don't fuck with others. And vice versa. As a result, I assume the character Dik will be alone in the ending, and Chick will be fine.

You can be on Jill's path too as a DIK, no? So thats Sage, Bella, Jill as both CHICK and DIK. Only Maya/Josy don't work as DIK. Thats 3/4 paths that work both ways. I don't see the problem there.

 

[magaclaawe]

Chick and dik system is just like in Mass Effect pointless and stupid. Its not really so bad like in Mass Effect but still the game would be better without it. If you are dik or chick should be shown to us with characters and their actions to us. Calling us out if we acted as a dik ot chick. The system could still be in the background for DrPinkCake.

 

[SpearOfReigns]

You can be on Jill's path too as a DIK, no?

Nope. Being a DIK will partially close Jill's path. She will hesitate stopping you when you climbed to her room, didn't touch herself thinking about you after, didn't ask you for morning jogging and wouldn't text you after Tybalt's presentation. It's pretty much closed already.

 

[tipsytopsy]

Nope. Being a DIK will partially close Jill's path. She will hesitate stopping you when you climbed to her room, didn't touch herself thinking about you after, didn't ask you for morning jogging and wouldn't text you after Tybalt's presentation. It's pretty much closed already.

"partially closed' is not a thing. You're either on the route or off it. That DPC didn't close the route for DIKs in ep7, to me, says that DIKs can get with her. You just miss out on content that CHICKs would get.

I really doubt DPC is gonna kick you off a LI path because of your affinity after letting you pursue that path on that affinity, especially after a potential affinity lock. You'll get kicked off the path because of some specific choices made, not because of your affinity.

 

[Marley300]

Who else feels like midterms are coming too fast? Anyone?

You must be registered to see the links

View attachment 1459196

Such a cutie
Is she in the HOT house or in a single dorm room like Patrick promised?
I really hope that this is the moment when we get a little time skip! I mean I know this is College but I rather skip to the parties then playthrough the exam and studying.
With those midterm’s coming, I’m almost tempted to do a save where you fail every test just to see if they are important. Imagine if you have to miss the parties because you fail and you have to retake everything.

 

[akki37]

Who else feels like midterms are coming too fast? Anyone?

You must be registered to see the links

View attachment 1459196

Face of maya looks better in this render. earlier she used to look like schoolgirl, in this she is looking like college girl.

 

[Klopdwerg]

You can be on Jill's path too as a DIK, no? So thats Sage, Bella, Jill as both CHICK and DIK. Only Maya/Josy don't work as DIK. Thats 3/4 paths that work both ways. I don't see the problem there.

Allthough i think that the Jill path will be Chick exclusive once she gives in.
Her character is really "build" to it. The showerscene after tennis, the one-girl-show after late night visit is all chickbased so i won't be suprised that once the decision is to be made that we have to be Chick. Maya and Josy were good with Neutral/Chick if i remember correctly but Jill.... she will be totally on the Chick side to get it going.

 

[Oliver Wendell Homely]

I'm looking forward to the coming release

As well as episode 8...

 

[asker]

Is it big update guys what do you expect from next update ?

 

[lemonfreak]

Is it big update guys what do you expect from next update ?

Neil dies in a house fire, MC gets spitroasted in a threeway with Chad and Troy and Jill loses her virginity to Burke

 

[Shizuro]

Allthough i think that the Jill path will be Chick exclusive once she gives in.
Her character is really "build" to it. The showerscene after tennis, the one-girl-show after late night visit is all chickbased so i won't be suprised that once the decision is to be made that we have to be Chick. Maya and Josy were good with Neutral/Chick if i remember correctly but Jill.... she will be totally on the Chick side to get it going.

Feels like this is the same kind of conversation that says chick sage is good too, since it's not closed but same as jill you miss alot of content no?

I don't really care about dik or chick affinity or who "belongs" to either side just feels like it's the same convo over and over again

 

[Ashley young]

I can kind of see where they're coming from. Sage starts off as a DIK LI because you gain points and unlock scenes with her by being a DIK. But in the later episodes, CHICK MC's can still hook up with Sage and apparently being a CHICK with Sage has a better progression of their relationship. This is because, no matter whether you're CHICK or DIK, the MC basically pussies out with Sage and cries about being her rebound guy, which makes no sense if you're a massive DIK who is customer of the year at Quinn's restaurant (like mine). So it's not really Sage's shift in personality, I can still see her lean heavily towards DIKs for personality and big DIK energy, it's the fact that so far anyone can get on her path and by some accounts the CHICK way of doing so is more rewarding.

Personally, and this is just me, I'd be fine with Sage becoming a neutral girl and Quinn, Lily and Nicole being DIK girls They fit the spirit of being a DIK much more than Sage does right now imo.

People seem to misunderstand the DIK / CHICK scale. It is a measure of your affinity. Basically, if you act like a dickhead, pick up fights or fuck around, you will have a larger DIK rating. If you're a chill, peaceful and repectful dude then you a a larger CHICK rating.
With CHICK, you end up with deeper relationships with main girls, while with DIK you get a larger variety of side girls.

 

[ename144]

I think the system works fine.

As well as choices (like as a total DIK you can choose to push Chad in the cafeteria, check out Sage’s g-string in the college hallway, push your lunch to fuck Envy’s ass in the private room, hop in the hot tub with Mel, Sarah and Heather, invite the girls into the shower at the HOTs, just to name a few scenes), it also changes the mc’s tone in heaps of conversations.

Your choices let you play as a character who is either aloof and disrespectful, or as a sincere, thoughtful guy.

It could have been a startup option (choose whether you want to be a “tough guy” or a “metrosexual”), but this way it’s a bit more dynamic.

Is it perfect? Nope. Can it be? Nope. But it’s novel, and I like it.

Sure, you don’t get to have a fulfilling relationship with Jill if you’re a DIK, and Quinn isn’t gonna take you seriously if you’re a Chick, but the game has great replayability, so just replay it and change your choices.

The system works reasonably well as long as you don't think about it, but it runs into big problems on any sort of close inspection. It serves it's main role of providing replay value by making a "horndog" route feel very different from a "nice guy" run, and the Major Decisions add an element of gameplay that livens up the Visual Novel narrative.

But it starts to break down if you question what makes the Major Decisions so major: why is giving Steve a shoulder to cry on more important than defending Chad when he's nearly expelled? Why is fooling around with Jade a Major DIK act, but fooling around with Bella is neutral (and even occasionally CHICKish)? There's really no rhyme or reason to why most of those decisions are the big ones, which undercuts the system considerably.

In addition, the distinction between Status and Affinity is both poorly implemented and unnecessarily confusing. Sometimes, Status seems to be the MC's reputation/style whereas Affinity is more like his inherent personality: thus Status determines his speech patterns while Affinity will eventually go on to govern his actions in a 'crisis.' But that gets muddled when, for example, Jill will only offer to shower with an MC with CHICK affinity; by the previous logic, either she should only offer to shower with an MC who has CHICK status, or else an MC with CHICK Affinity should refuse to take advantage of her when showering. Similarly, the MC can only get a threesome with Mona and Camila if he has serious DIK Status, whereas you'd expect the MC should need DIK Affinity to make the attempt (and maybe DIK Status for them to accept). In the end, each system arbitrarily means whatever makes for better gameplay at the time.

I do think Permanent Affinity could be an interesting development, but it really depends on how it's implemented. If done well, it will help simplify the narrative (since things will eventually boil down to at most 3 "routes") while making the restrictions feel like an organic outgrowth of how we've chosen to mold the MC. If done badly, it will wreck the illusion that our choices ever mattered by forcing us to do things our MC would probably never have done, simply for the sake of the meter.

It's hard to be too optimistic given just how underthought the initial DIK/CHICK system was. Still, for all its faults BaDIK has been fantastic up to this point so I'm willing to give DPC the benefit of the doubt for now. Here's hoping!