VN Ren'Py Chasing Sunsets [v0.9a] [Stone Fox Studios]

[felicemastronzo]

Yup, but we already have Fiona for that.

Disclaimer The text below does not refer to any character in this VN... Before fans of certain character grill me.

Yeah I dislike the virgin but lesbian experienced trope. Not because the fact that the LI is no longer a virgin but because it seams a stupid workaround (sex is sex in my book). If she is no longer a virgin be mature about it do not try to feed me contrived explanations.

By that workaround the LI could be the biggest slut but she is virtuous because she has not had a penis?

I too have never understood this distinction, if a girl is emotionally and sexually into another relationship it doesn't matter with whom.

but it has to be said that in the genre, there are no real lesbians, only heterosexuals waiting for the protagonist's cock

 

[DavDR]

I too have never understood this distinction, if a girl is emotionally and sexually into another relationship it doesn't matter with whom.

but it has to be said that in the genre, there are no real lesbians, only heterosexuals waiting for the protagonist's cock

It's funny Felice but also a problem that no one has tackled due to no NTR hysteria. That's why Male villains in this medium are so often buffoonish and ineffectual. And it's ruined many a good game that had real potential.

 

[felicemastronzo]

I think she doesn't have those feelings for tara. She sometimes considers her sister. I don't know what he described, but even after Mc disappeared years, there was no relationship between Tara and Jaye.
I know that it was her first kiss with her and the first time she had sex as well, but they are not partners or a love story between them, they are closer to friends than that

we were not referring to this game
I was being very general

But consider that Jaye's first kiss was with her best male friend, with the same premise as Tara, without any emotional involvement, would you feel the same way?

 

[Turki 10]

Is Jaye supposed to be loyal to him and she doesn't even know he has feelings for her? Mc didn't hint, didn't tell her, didn't do anything. He tried to get away when they were kids. Then he ran away without even speaking to her.

 

[DA22]

It wouldn't change anything. Mc was the one who chose to stay away from Jaye. He never hinted to her that he loved her.What I see is that the two of them are wrong. Jade even after the party when she was taking a shower, she was asking herself if he had feelings for her.

Uhm no it was Jaye who did that after MC made his first mistake and tried to make up for that and never forgave him after, leading to the whole shenanigans over the years between the two that finally led MC to deciding to break all contact with his family. Jaye kept him away as much with her actions as other way around, remember both also do not know how other really feels nor has been willing or comfortable enough to ever open up about that.

Now also I know females are slightly more open to touching eachother as males, but Tara and Jaye went way further as kissing and a grope or two at least a few times. Even if not always shown but more implied and Tara tended to impersonate Mc at least once.

Well that does start to straddle the uncanny valley of having full on sex with someone else however you wish to call it, besides that last being weird enough and kind of obsessive in its own right. If a girl has done anal 20 times she is also still technically a virgin if only count penetration by a male in the pussy. It also would mean though any lesbian that has been active sexually for last thirty years with women since those are what turn her on and she has feelings for would still be a virgin.

Well I guess my definition of sexually inexperienced and a virgin differ from yours and is less technical. Not that I care in this case, I think Jaye was well within her rights to do as she did, just the firm declaration they are not lesbian or bisexual for sure despite their actions, made me kind of laugh and shake my head. If you would not be, then why make such a point of it in the first place. MC and Jaye were not in a relation, promised each other or whatever. Exactly the opposite in fact, they may both want to and be jealous of the other but the setup is that they are not, just in my games I prefer not to see the action without Mc or the LI's abused by an asshole, but that is my preference.

Also if a girl in current times is still a real virgin at age 23 yo one does slightly wonder if she has any sex drive at all or something else is wrong with her in connecting with people. Now 23 is still believable in a way under circumstances like firm religious believes, but 35 gets really suspicious.

 

[Turki 10]

Uhm no it was Jaye who did that after MC made his first mistake and tried to make up for that and never forgave him after, leading to the whole shenanigans that finally led MC to deciding to break all contact with his family.

Now also I know females are slightly more open to touching eachother as males, but Tara and Jaye went way further as kissing and a grope or two at least a few times. Even if not always shown but more implied and Tara tended to impersonate Mc at least once.

Well that does start to straddle the uncanny valley of having full on sex with someone else however you wish to call it, besides that last being weird enough and kind of obsessive in its own right. If a girl has done anal 20 times she is also still technically a virgin if only count penetration by a male in the pussy. It also would mean though any lesbian that has been active sexually for last thirty years with women since those are what turn her on and she has feelings for would still be a virgin.

Well I guess my definition of sexually inexperienced and a virgin differ from yours.

I never said she's a virgin She's had sex with Tara It's sex in the end She's not a virgin I said Mc never says his feelings to her and she doesn't know he has feelings for her

 

[DavDR]

Excuse me, I don't know what you're talking about, especially about male villains. What I see is that two girlfriends share a special moment. It doesn't mean that they love each other or that they are both lesbians. As for Christian, if you mean, I think it was Jaye's attempt to forget Mc

No I was talking about something said earlier in that discussion, that the LI's in these games are often virgin but lesbian until they encounter the MC's magical cock. That there can never be a true rival for the LI's affection's because the Dev's fear the hysterical cry of NTR!

 

[DavDR]

Uhm no it was Jaye who did that after MC made his first mistake and tried to make up for that and never forgave him after, leading to the whole shenanigans over the years between the two that finally led MC to deciding to break all contact with his family. Jaye kept him away as much with her actions as other way around, remember both also do not know how other really feels nor has been willing or comfortable enough to ever open up about that.

Now also I know females are slightly more open to touching eachother as males, but Tara and Jaye went way further as kissing and a grope or two at least a few times. Even if not always shown but more implied and Tara tended to impersonate Mc at least once.

Well that does start to straddle the uncanny valley of having full on sex with someone else however you wish to call it, besides that last being weird enough and kind of obsessive in its own right. If a girl has done anal 20 times she is also still technically a virgin if only count penetration by a male in the pussy. It also would mean though any lesbian that has been active sexually for last thirty years with women since those are what turn her on and she has feelings for would still be a virgin.

Well I guess my definition of sexually inexperienced and a virgin differ from yours and is less technical. Not that I care in this case, I think Jaye was well within her rights to do as she did, just the firm declaration they are not lesbian or bisexual for sure despite their actions, made me kind of laugh and shake my head. If you would not be, then why make such a point of it in the first place. MC and Jaye were not in a relation, promised each other or whatever. Exactly the opposite in fact, they may both want to and be jealous of the other but the setup is that they are not, just in my games I prefer not to see the action without Mc, but that is my preference.

Also if a girl in current times is still a real virgin at age 23 yo one does slightly wonder if she has any sex drive at all or something else is wrong with her in connecting with people. Now 23 is still believable in a way under circumstances like firm religious believes, but 35 gets really suspicious.

And yet it's the MC who thinks everything was his fault, though the Jaye haters insist it was all her.

 

[Hermith]

No I was talking about something said earlier in that discussion, that the LI's in these games are often virgin but lesbian until they encounter the MC's magical cock. That there can never be a true rival for the LI's affection's because the Dev's fear the hysterical cry of NTR!

There are no true rivals in games like this not just because people would cry about ntr and shit, but because the genre doesn't really allow one to exist. There can be rivals, but not true rivals, that would just ruin people's fun. Most people are not playing these for the dead serious competition. I'm sure there are people who enjoy playing stuff with the hardest difficulty just like some enjoy to see their character fail, but those are completely different genres.

That being said ntr is disgusting as it is not just simple cheating. Cheating is usually not without reason and it allows interesting stories.

 

[DavDR]

There are no true rivals in games like this not just because people would cry about ntr and shit, but because the genre doesn't really allow one to exist. There can be rivals, but not true rivals, that would just ruin people's fun. Most people are not playing these for the dead serious competition. I'm sure there are people who enjoy playing stuff with the hardest difficulty just like some enjoy to see their character fail, but those are completely different genres.

That being said ntr is disgusting as it is not just simple cheating. Cheating is usually not without reason and it allows interesting stories.

What part of 'visual NOVEL' don't you get. The antagonist is a key part of story telling that presents the hero with obstacles to overcome, leading to character growth. A weak antagonist makes for a weak story. And since this is a visual novel and not a game, story is the vital element.

 

[DA22]

And yet it's the MC who thinks everything was his fault, though the Jaye haters insist it was all her.

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Yeah as MC also blames himself for other things and at least takes some responsibility for his actions, which Jaye did not with one exception, the night after the party when she decides to rub one out instead of act with indeed bigger consequences as she could have known or easily predicted at that moment.

Never heard of the trick of giving false information from one side. Same MC did feel guilty for his reaction to Jaye after he came home from game as anyone would finding out what happened just before and that fueled his behavior at party even more likely, does that mean the reaction at that moment was weird as such no. Just when you get the extra information you may feel shitty you did not react differently as you did. It happened to me in my life and to most people.

Devs are manipulating us all the time, look at the whole and not just a word or two, here and there. Jaye's behavior when comes to MC is pretty self centered and self absorbed overlooking or ignoring the most obvious consequences of her actions with regards to mc and that those are the exact opposite of what she professes she want, a good relation with him and MC acted juvenile as well, that is why they are in the mess they are in. If both had acted more adult and caring to each other and about the others feelings instead of only their own, they would likely not be in the mess they are now with how their relation is.

 

[DavDR]

Yeah as MC also blames himself for other things and at least takes some responsibility for his actions, which Jaye did not with one exception, the night after the party when she decides to rub one out instead of act with indeed bigger consequences as she could have known at that moment.

Never heard of the trick of giving false information from one side. Same MC did feel guilty for his reaction to Jaye after he came home from game as anyone would finding out what happened just before and that fueled his behavior at party even more likely, does that mean the reaction at that moment was weird as such no. Just when you get the extra information you may feel shitty you did not react differently as you did. It happened to me in my life and to most people.

Devs are manipulating us all the time, look at the whole and not just a word or two, here and there. Jaye's behavior when comes to MC is pretty self centered and self absorbed overlooking or ignoring the most obvious consequences of her actions with regards to mc and that those are the exact opposite of what she professes she want, a good relation with him and MC acted juvenile as well, that is why they are in the mess they are in. If both had acted more adult and caring to each other and about the others feelings instead of only their own, they would likely not be in the mess they are now with how their relation is.

Once again you are basing all of your judgements on one side of the story. We have yet to hear Jaye's side in all of this, and we already see Alex admitting that it was all his fault.

 

[DavDR]

Yeah as MC also blames himself for other things and at least takes some responsibility for his actions, which Jaye did not with one exception, the night after the party when she decides to rub one out instead of act with indeed bigger consequences as she could have known or easily predicted at that moment.

Never heard of the trick of giving false information from one side. Same MC did feel guilty for his reaction to Jaye after he came home from game as anyone would finding out what happened just before and that fueled his behavior at party even more likely, does that mean the reaction at that moment was weird as such no. Just when you get the extra information you may feel shitty you did not react differently as you did. It happened to me in my life and to most people.

Devs are manipulating us all the time, look at the whole and not just a word or two, here and there. Jaye's behavior when comes to MC is pretty self centered and self absorbed overlooking or ignoring the most obvious consequences of her actions with regards to mc and that those are the exact opposite of what she professes she want, a good relation with him and MC acted juvenile as well, that is why they are in the mess they are in. If both had acted more adult and caring to each other and about the others feelings instead of only their own, they would likely not be in the mess they are now with how their relation is.

Also, try to keep up with the story, when Jaye was in the shower Alex was at Tara's house. How could she act when he wasn't even there?

 

[Hermith]

What part of 'visual NOVEL' don't you get. The antagonist is a key part of story telling that presents the hero with obstacles to overcome, leading to character growth. A weak antagonist makes for a weak story. And since this is a visual novel and not a game, story is the vital element.

Just the usual confrontational and condescending style, but you're right, I'm not a VN expert. I'm just saying that in most stories, even in the greatest ones, no matter how strong and great an antagonist is the main character in the end always has plot armor that will help him/her prevail.

 

[DavDR]

Just the usual confrontational and condescending style, but you're right, I'm not a VN expert. I'm just saying that in most stories, even in the greatest ones, no matter how strong and great an antagonist is the main character in the end always has plot armor that will help him/her prevail.

So sorry for your fefe's but I've always debated vigorously. If it's too much for you just ignore me.

I do think you're completely missing the point though. It's not the outcome, it's the path that makes or breaks the story. If the MC just sails through their adventure with little or no opposition it makes for a trite and boring story. Characters need to be challenged, suffer defeats and wounds, struggle. Without those elements all you have are boring Mary Sue's for protagonist.

 

[Hermith]

So sorry for your fefe's but I've always debated vigorously. If it's too much for you just ignore me.

I do think you're completely missing the point though. It's not the outcome, it's the path that makes or breaks the story. If the MC just sails through their adventure with little or no opposition it makes for a trite and boring story. Characters need to be challenged, suffer defeats and wounds, struggle. Without those elements all you have are boring Mary Sue's for protagonist.

My fefe is completely fine, don't worry. You are right, I did miss the point, but that's mostly because I think a 'true rival' would mean a somewhat open ending where ultimate defeat is possible, that's why I said there should be setbacks, but not defeats. A rival is a must, a strong rival is most welcome, but stories with true rivals are something else and it's not for everyone.

 

[DavDR]

My fefe is completely fine, don't worry. You are right, I did miss the point, but that's mostly because I think a 'true rival' would mean a somewhat open ending where ultimate defeat is possible, that's why I said there should be setbacks, but not defeats. A rival is a must, a strong rival is most welcome, but stories with true rivals are something else and it's not for everyone.

I would just like to see an AVN where the MC had to compete for the LI's affection with a believable rival. Someone who had the personality trait's that could possibly attract the LI, not just the cardboard cutout's and hopeless buffoon's that so many games give us.

 

[felicemastronzo]

So sorry for your fefe's but I've always debated vigorously. If it's too much for you just ignore me.

I do think you're completely missing the point though. It's not the outcome, it's the path that makes or breaks the story. If the MC just sails through their adventure with little or no opposition it makes for a trite and boring story. Characters need to be challenged, suffer defeats and wounds, struggle. Without those elements all you have are boring Mary Sue's for protagonist.

for now the 'negative' driving force is the parents of the two children

who first don't explain to Jaye the reason why her brother has left her (hopefully not a hole in the script), then let their son stay around for 5 years, even though they know where he is and even meet him secretly, they are perhaps also responsible for blocking Jaye's phone, and finally, post mortem, force the 2 in a situation that can be either glory or hell

 

[Hellkinglucifer]

for now the 'negative' driving force is the parents of the two children

who first don't explain to Jaye the reason why her brother has left her (hopefully not a hole in the script), then let their son stay around for 5 years, even though they know where he is and even meet him secretly, they are perhaps also responsible for blocking Jaye's phone, and finally, post mortem, force the 2 in a situation that can be either glory or hell

There's a reason why parents are usually dead or never seen in most good games unless it's a mother/son incest game. They never fit in a believable story. Also why the reason of separation is really stupid in brother/sister incest game. Jaye only finding out about the reason MC stopped going to school together with her in their face to face conversation on the yacht was ridiculous. It's a 17/18 years delay FFS 13 of which they were living together

 

[felicemastronzo]

There's a reason why parents are usually dead or never seen in most good games unless it's a mother/son incest game. They never fit in a believable story. Also why the reason of separation is really stupid in brother/sister incest game. Jaye only finding out about the reason MC stopped going to school together with her in their face to face conversation on the yacht was ridiculous. It's a 17/18 years delay FFS 13 of which they were living together

I hope the matter will be explained, otherwise it would be quite disappointing, so far apart from the brawl on graduation day, all the reasons for their estrangement are forced

the blocking of the phone could also be nonsense and not be explained (although it requires a lot of suspension of disbelief), but why the parents didn't explain to Jaye that her brother stopped accompanying her to give her the chance to be more appreciated in my opinion will need an explanation at some point

and not that they have forgotten... not with two sons who stop talking to each other in front of their eyes