VN Ren'Py Heart Problems [v0.8 Final] [Xenorav]

[Jericho85]

If the reason for the delay is an emergency or a convincing reason, then there is no problem, but if the reason for the delay is because he wants to delay, then this is a despicable thing because he takes from the money of people and donors, so he must speed up his work if there is no reason to prevent him.. Don't forget money of the people that they spend to get the updates.. Hope he comes soon

Those patrons are donating freely. It's their decision and they do it because they want to support the project. I'm modestly supporting eight different VN projects and I throw $1 at Xenorav every month for that very reason... Because Heart Problems is one of my favorites. I think it's worth the support and a buck a month is no skin off my back. Back when Xenorav paused subs for a couple months, a lot of patrons were saying the pause wasn't necessary but he did it anyway.

So trust me dude, no one is getting "scammed". Imagining some nefarious "Despicable" plot is just a waste of energy and unnecessary negativity. Whether the silence means there was an emergency or not doesn't matter to me. The dev is allowed to work at his own pace and I'll toss my measly $1 at Xenorav every month until the day Heart Problems is finished or abandoned.

 

[goodbye890]

Those patrons are donating freely. It's their decision and they do it because they want to support the project. I'm modestly supporting eight different VN projects and I throw $1 at Xenorav every month for that very reason... Because Heart Problems is one of my favorites. I think it's worth the support and a buck a month is no skin off my back. Back when Xenorav paused subs for a couple months, a lot of patrons were saying the pause wasn't necessary but he did it anyway.

So trust me dude, no one is getting "scammed". Imagining some nefarious "Despicable" plot is just a waste of energy and unnecessary negativity. Whether the silence means there was an emergency or not doesn't matter to me. The dev is allowed to work at his own pace and I'll toss my measly $1 at Xenorav every month until the day Heart Problems is finished or abandoned.

while i do agree with your take that they're subscribing at their own volition, i must to clarify that many crowdfunding platforms, including patreon, offer subscription based models where patrons receive certain benefits in return for their ongoing support. While some people may choose to donate freely out of sheer goodwill, its also common for individuals to subscribe to support the developers work and gain access to exclusive content or updates, by subscribing, patrons not only contribute to the financial aspect of the project but also help ensure its continued development, it creates a win-win scenario where supporters get to be part of the creative journey, while the developer receives consistent funding and motivation to fulfill their vision, so its not merely about individuals wanting to give money as a donation, but rather a mutually beneficial arrangement.

 

[Turki 10]

 

[H a a svd]

Those patrons are donating freely. It's their decision and they do it because they want to support the project. I'm modestly supporting eight different VN projects and I throw $1 at Xenorav every month for that very reason... Because Heart Problems is one of my favorites. I think it's worth the support and a buck a month is no skin off my back. Back when Xenorav paused subs for a couple months, a lot of patrons were saying the pause wasn't necessary but he did it anyway.

So trust me dude, no one is getting "scammed". Imagining some nefarious "Despicable" plot is just a waste of energy and unnecessary negativity. Whether the silence means there was an emergency or not doesn't matter to me. The dev is allowed to work at his own pace and I'll toss my measly $1 at Xenorav every month until the day Heart Problems is finished or abandoned.

But brother what about the pinned post days ago.. That's mean nothing?!

 

[Jericho85]

But brother what about the pinned post days ago.. That's mean nothing?!

Means nothing.

while i do agree with your take that they're subscribing at their own volition, i must to clarify that many crowdfunding platforms, including patreon, offer subscription based models where patrons receive certain benefits in return for their ongoing support. While some people may choose to donate freely out of sheer goodwill, its also common for individuals to subscribe to support the developers work and gain access to exclusive content or updates, by subscribing, patrons not only contribute to the financial aspect of the project but also help ensure its continued development, it creates a win-win scenario where supporters get to be part of the creative journey, while the developer receives consistent funding and motivation to fulfill their vision, so its not merely about individuals wanting to give money as a donation, but rather a mutually beneficial arrangement.

The benefits listed on each tier are perks but not obligations. The tiers are still donations at the end of the day and the tiered benefits are available when they're available. If a patron isn't getting what they think they're "entitled" to, then they can just write a nasty letter to the dev and unsub. They're still not owed anything at the end of the day. Donations are for support, not expectations.

Spoiler: This is what Patreon says on the matter:

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[goodbye890]

Means nothing.



The benefits listed on each tier are perks but not obligations. The tiers are still donations at the end of the day and the tiered benefits are available when they're available. If a patron isn't getting what they think they're "entitled" to, then they can just write a nasty letter to the dev and unsub. They're still not owed anything at the end of the day. Donations are for support, not expectations.

Spoiler: This is what Patreon says on the matter:

You don't have permission to view the spoiler content. Log in or register now.

i see what you mean on the nature of donations and the steps patrons can take if they feel unsatisfied with the benefits and stuff but i still think its essential to consider the broader context of subscription-based crowdfunding platforms like Patreon.
while its true that the benefits listed on each tier are perks and not obligations, its also important to acknowledge that these tiered benefits play a significant role in attracting patrons to pledge their support, patrons choose to subscribe and contribute because they believe in the project's potential and want to see it come to fruition, their ongoing support is not solely based on goodwill, but also on the expectation of receiving certain exclusive content or updates in return, platforms like patreon provide a structure where creators and supporters enter into a mutually beneficial arrangement. This arrangement allows creators to receive consistent funding and motivation, which is crucial for their continued development, while supporters get to be part of the creative journey and gain access to exclusive content. It is not just a one-sided act of giving money but rather a symbiotic relationship. and your right that they can just unsub, also you say donations but its subscriptions i would say that they are for expectations, hence the symbioltic relationship aspect, but i do see what you mean though

 

[Cryptist]

Update 8 was released weeks ago --

into the wild so it can run free.

 

[Jericho85]

i see what you mean on the nature of donations and the steps patrons can take if they feel unsatisfied with the benefits and stuff but i still think its essential to consider the broader context of subscription-based crowdfunding platforms like Patreon.
while its true that the benefits listed on each tier are perks and not obligations, its also important to acknowledge that these tiered benefits play a significant role in attracting patrons to pledge their support, patrons choose to subscribe and contribute because they believe in the project's potential and want to see it come to fruition, their ongoing support is not solely based on goodwill, but also on the expectation of receiving certain exclusive content or updates in return, platforms like patreon provide a structure where creators and supporters enter into a mutually beneficial arrangement. This arrangement allows creators to receive consistent funding and motivation, which is crucial for their continued development, while supporters get to be part of the creative journey and gain access to exclusive content. It is not just a one-sided act of giving money but rather a symbiotic relationship. and your right that they can just unsub, also you say donations but its subscriptions i would say that they are for expectations, hence the symbioltic relationship aspect, but i do see what you mean though

Oh definitely not a one-sided thing. I just think the payoff for patrons is more about the project itself, not any side perks. Patrons give money to Creators whatever they think they are worth or whatever they feel comfortable in donating.

Besides, I think there are two types of patrons. One type, for example, just want an early release or some exclusive wallpapers. Those types will just sub for a grand total of 5 minutes to get whatever they want out of it, then cancel immediately. From my experience, those types are not going to stay subbing at that tier month to month after they got what they wanted.

The other type are people that choose to stay subbed month to month (regardless of tier). When people stay subbed, they aren't typically doing it with any kind of expectations or obligations in mind. They know what they're doing and they're doing it just to support the project, not any side perks.

 

[kadgilek]

 

[goodbye890]

Oh definitely not a one-sided thing. I just think the payoff for patrons is more about the project itself, not any side perks. Patrons give money to Creators whatever they think they are worth or whatever they feel comfortable in donating.

Besides, I think there are two types of patrons. One type, for example, just want an early release or some exclusive wallpapers. Those types will just sub for a grand total of 5 minutes to get whatever they want out of it, then cancel immediately. From my experience, those types are not going to stay subbing at that tier month to month after they got what they wanted.

The other type are people that choose to stay subbed month to month (regardless of tier). When people stay subbed, they aren't typically doing it with any kind of expectations or obligations in mind. They know what they're doing and they're doing it just to support the project, not any side perks.

i mean to each their own if thats what you think the division is between the two types of patrons you do you,i personally couldn't disagree more, but thats another topic, i was talking more so about the fact that there infact is something expected in return and that its not just donations out of goodwill but out of part taking in the mutually beneficial arrangement between developer and patrons, also i cant help but feel that you made the point of the two types of patrons as to invalidate the patrons' criticism of not being fairly reciprocated by just putting all patrons in either of the two categories, one of them being some sort of greedy swindler stereotype and the other category simply being how you would want people to act like, also why are you just saying things for the sake of saying things like, "those types will just sub for a grand total of 5 minutes to get whatever they want out of it then cancel immediately" i mean how would you ever know that? i think in reality almost everyone would agree that there are many different types of patrons out there with its vast diversity finding itself within this example too, but once again as i said thats a completely different topic so idk

 

[kadgilek]

 

[JamesBond154]

Mid July yas <3 <3

mid July + 9 Days

 

[Jericho85]

i mean to each their own if thats what you think the division is between the two types of patrons you do you,i personally couldn't disagree more, but thats another topic, i was talking more so about the fact that there infact is something expected in return and that its not just donations out of goodwill but out of part taking in the mutually beneficial arrangement between developer and patrons, also i cant help but feel that you made the point of the two types of patrons as to invalidate the patrons' criticism of not being fairly reciprocated by just putting all patrons in either of the two categories, one of them being some sort of greedy swindler stereotype and the other category simply being how you would want people to act like, also why are you just saying things for the sake of saying things like, "those types will just sub for a grand total of 5 minutes to get whatever they want out of it then cancel immediately" i mean how would you ever know that? i think in reality almost everyone would agree that there are many different types of patrons out there with its vast diversity finding itself within this example too, but once again as i said thats a completely different topic so idk

Nah, I'm not criticizing either type of patron. I'm not calling anyone greedy. I think both types of patrons are perfectly valid in their reasonings for spending their money the way they want and subbing for however long they want whether it be 5 minutes or 5 years.

As far as the patrons who feel they're "not being fairly reciprocated" well... they're probably not going to be patrons very long. They'll just stop subbing. No one has a gun to their head.

This whole thing is a bit of a tangent, but the bottom line for me is that I don't think the people who donate regularly to Xenorav - or any VN dev - feel like they're getting cheated out of anything by having to wait longer for some updates than others. I'd assume that like me, a lot of them have been donating to several devs for a while so this isn't their first rodeo. If they no longer have faith in the dev, then they just stop subbing. But it's a completely autonomous decision. They're not paying for a product, they're making a donation. That changes the dynamic of cost/value quite a bit, IMO.

And frankly, I think that while Xenorav isn't as consistent with updates as I'd like, I don't think he's trying to pull anything over on anyone like a few people here keep suggesting. In the end we're all going to fap away about 40% of our water weight once the update drops, but for now we just have to wait. So no reason to spoil the mood with complaints about the dev or negative speculations.

 

[Fate stay]

Xenorav please release the update
My dick is about to explode

 

[polopol2325]

Xenorav please release the update
My dick is about to explode
View attachment 2794654 View attachment 2794655

you are not the only brother

 

[TitmusPrime]

Nah, I'm not criticizing either type of patron. I'm not calling anyone greedy. I think both types of patrons are perfectly valid in their reasonings for spending their money the way they want and subbing for however long they want whether it be 5 minutes or 5 years.

As far as the patrons who feel they're "not being fairly reciprocated" well... they're probably not going to be patrons very long. They'll just stop subbing. No one has a gun to their head.

This whole thing is a bit of a tangent, but the bottom line for me is that I don't think the people who donate regularly to Xenorav - or any VN dev - feel like they're getting cheated out of anything by having to wait longer for some updates than others. I'd assume that like me, a lot of them have been donating to several devs for a while so this isn't their first rodeo. If they no longer have faith in the dev, then they just stop subbing. But it's a completely autonomous decision. They're not paying for a product, they're making a donation. That changes the dynamic of cost/value quite a bit, IMO.

And frankly, I think that while Xenorav isn't as consistent with updates as I'd like, I don't think he's trying to pull anything over on anyone like a few people here keep suggesting. We're all going to fap away about 40% of our water weight once the update drops.

I think this comes down to 2 different opinions on what Patreon is. Some see it as a simple transaction, I give you money monthly in return for a product, the expectations and content of which are preferably clearly communicated and met on time.
Others treat it as supporting a creator they like for little to no exceptional treatment, much like donating to a streamer or whatever. You can't exactly say either is more correct and it's down to the creator to clarify which of the two they plan on responding to, some of that comes in the form of devs letting patrons vote on content or making extra stuff for each tier etc.

I haven't followed xeno for long enough to assume their intentions but if the updates do regularly come out around when subscriptions end then you have to admit the pattern shows a cynical method for boosting subscription numbers. It's not the best way for doing patreon but it's not like he's scamming anyone either, it's always ultimately your responsibility and choice in how you spend your money.


Also if the update isn't 99% Amelie I will cry.

 

[goodbye890]

Nah, I'm not criticizing either type of patron. I'm not calling anyone greedy. I think both types of patrons are perfectly valid in their reasonings for spending their money the way they want and subbing for however long they want whether it be 5 minutes or 5 years.

As far as the patrons who feel they're "not being fairly reciprocated" well... they're probably not going to be patrons very long. They'll just stop subbing. No one has a gun to their head.

This whole thing is a bit of a tangent, but the bottom line for me is that I don't think the people who donate regularly to Xenorav - or any VN dev - feel like they're getting cheated out of anything by having to wait longer for some updates than others. I'd assume that like me, a lot of them have been donating to several devs for a while so this isn't their first rodeo. If they no longer have faith in the dev, then they just stop subbing. But it's a completely autonomous decision. They're not paying for a product, they're making a donation. That changes the dynamic of cost/value quite a bit, IMO.

And frankly, I think that while Xenorav isn't as consistent with updates as I'd like, I don't think he's trying to pull anything over on anyone like a few people here keep suggesting. We're all going to fap away about 40% of our water weight once the update drops.

"Nah, I'm not criticizing either type of patron. I'm not calling anyone greedy. I think both types of patrons are perfectly valid in their reasonings for spending their money the way they want and subbing for however long they want whether it be 5 minutes or 5 years."so why did you even go on a tangent about there are two types of patrons in the first place? im calling , and as far as your take goes on patrons who feel theyre not being fairly reciprocated, what your saying theyre probably going to do is literally one of the written down options in that patreon text you showed from their website, and once again i never disagreed to your point that theyre not being forced to do anything, i dont think anyone here is being forced to subscribe same way someone wouldnt be forced to go out and buy a bottle of water

"but the bottom line for me is that I don't think the people who donate regularly to Xenorav - or any VN dev - feel like they're getting cheated out of anything by having to wait longer for some updates than others" you sure about that? lol yeah tell that to all the icsitor subscribers, and while your at it tell it to the people posting angry comments on xenoravs patreon. you said "I'd assume that like me, a lot of them have been donating to several devs for a while so this isn't their first rodeo." why would you assume that? you also said "They're not paying for a product, they're making a donation. That changes the dynamic of cost/value quite a bit, IMO." well then your opinion would be wrong because a subscription is a form of paying for a product, also you keep using the word donation, realise that the main people who are criticizing xenorav aren't donators but subscribers, i dont know who your arguing with about donations besides yourself, because i dont think ive seen a single comment regarding people who are donating and not people who are subscribing

 

[Valmanway]

I love these threads of games that goes too long without updates.
It always (d)evolves into this exact same situation of people writing essays regarding the morality of devs supposedly milking their supporters and everything in between.
I've even taken part in some of those, it's good fun.
Keep up, boys.

 

[jhonatanw]

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Clean and better quality version

 

[Piyush1481481]

View attachment 2795046

A 4K version please?