Ren'Py Heavy Five [Ch.2RS] [Nottravis]

4.10 star(s) 64 Votes
Discussion Reviews (64)
moskyx

moskyx

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Jun 17, 2019
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imnotoverhere said:
You may not be intentionally lying, but the reality is for months and months the same phrase is used whenever anyone asks about how much longer, "sometime this month or early next month". There are now chats in multiple other threads and people were making jokes about when that line was going to be used this month. The honest truth is that you don't know when it will be complete.

This reminds me of a trick airline pilots used when a flight is delayed after boarding but they don't know for how long. Pilots use the 30m rule. They'll go on the radio and tell passengers that there's a slight delay that will be ~30m. After 30m they'll hop on and tell people the delay is lasting a bit longer than expected, it's looking like it's going to be another 30m. Why do they do this? Simple... their research shows that passengers will stay calm if given a deadline that doesn't seem too far off even if it's inaccurate. People are hopeful so they don't make a problem. After the second or 3rd time of saying that, people start to trick themselves into believing the next time it really is going to be 30m (after all... it's been 1.5 hours... surely it really is only 30m more).

Notti made a post in January saying that February was the target date, after that anytime someone asked about the timeline, someone would respond with either the end of that month, or sometime the next month. I'm starting to think the flight crew isn't sure how long maintenance will take.
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Your point being...? Just wait, it's not like you're actually paying for it (if you were, I guess you'd be whinning in her patreon and not in a pirate forum). People ask for release date and other people just tell them what they know, there's no reason to be salty about it. It's ready when it's ready.
 
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imnotoverhere

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Jun 25, 2017
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moskyx said:
Your point being...? Just wait, it's not like you're actually paying for it (if you were, I guess you'd be whinning in her patreon and not in a pirate forum). People ask for release date and other people just tell them what they know, there's no reason to be salty about it. It's ready when it's ready.
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Yeah, that's my point. It will be ready when it's ready. So stop with the bullshit timelines that nobody believes anymore. I know this is a pirate forum and if you look through my post history I have not once demanded that something be released so I'm not sure why you commented that... unless you thought it was an easy way to discredit my opinion. I know that's an easy thing to say in order to shut down people who criticize a developer for taking a long time, but that's not what I did. I just pointed out that, like clockwork every month certain members, comment that the game will be released this month or the end of next month, and that it's super transparent. Speaking of salty, why are you getting salty when people point out this out to others? You're getting awfully defensive for someone else.
 
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moskyx

moskyx

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imnotoverhere said:
Yeah, that's my point. It will be ready when it's ready. So stop with the bullshit timelines that nobody believes anymore. I know this is a pirate forum and if you look through my post history I have not once demanded that something be released so I'm not sure why you commented that... unless you thought it was an easy way to discredit my opinion. I know that's an easy thing to say in order to shut down people who criticize a developer for taking a long time, but that's not what I did. I just pointed out that, like clockwork every month certain members, comment that the game will be released this month or the end of next month, and that it's super transparent. Speaking of salty, why are you getting salty when people point out this out to others? You're getting awfully defensive for someone else.
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OK, whatever
 
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Loady

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Dec 28, 2018
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Avaron1974 said:
People only have so much info to give on here, Notty doesn't post here, she abandoned this place a long time ago. I think it was January the last time she popped her face in and even then she didn't hang around.

Whatever info people have to post here they are trying to patch together from wherever they can get it from.
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This is fair but needs to be better communicated. When someone asks and gets an answer, it's implicit that there's some information behind the estimate, be it from patreon or discord or what have you.

This thread is a lot more mature and patient than most other games' threads. The readers understand that the dev is doing a lot more and working on her own to make something special. It's fine if it takes longer, but putting out optimistic release dates only adds drama when they've historically missed. Especially unnecessary when the missed estimates aren't even the dev's fault but just the result of optimistic fans trying to be helpful.

It's much more helpful to say "we don't know but this is her last report, so we'd like to think it'll take X longer because that's how long similar work has taken her in the past."
 
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I'm Not Thea Lundgren!

I'm Not Thea Lundgren!

AKA: TotesNotThea
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Jun 21, 2017
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One of the reasons for the delay is that Notty learned a new animation technique and decided to scrap all the animations she did in November and December; the new animations are much smoother and of much better quality than before.

In the past three months, she refunded one month and paused another two months; while this isn't ideal for anyone waiting for the update, it does show Notty's strong belief that backers get value for money. I suspect that if the update isn't out by the end of the month, she may pause again.
 
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NeimadFR

NeimadFR

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Jul 1, 2017
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allove said:
So it is thus claimed, how many developers string folks along with "yeah, working working" and? I mean, she isn't at the level of some, where they are still charging every month, but nothing is still nothing. 8 months of nothing if I am counting right?
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Having played test builds and seen animations I can confidently say that she has been working.
 
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allove

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Discord is patreon only. Not sure I am willing to jump on this fan train *quite* yet. Tell you what, she releases anytime in the next 30 days, and I'll pledge min $5.

Do you guys REALLY think its that odd to be skeptical of developers? I mean seriously look at all the crap that gets pulled and the FANS of the developers are rarely an honest or unbiased source.
 
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Kirel

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Mar 18, 2018
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allove said:
Discord is patreon only. Not sure I am willing to jump on this fan train *quite* yet. Tell you what, she releases anytime in the next 30 days, and I'll pledge min $5.

Do you guys REALLY think its that odd to be skeptical of developers? I mean seriously look at all the crap that gets pulled and the FANS of the developers are rarely an honest or unbiased source.
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Depends on the developer. Maybe I'm just lucky, but the devs I support (including Notty) are very open and honest about what they're working on, and my experience with them has been very positive. Being plugged into their communities via Discord or forums or whatever medium they use to communicate with their supporters is a very different experience compared to hanging out on F95 waiting for new stuff to get posted on the thread of the game you're interested in.
 
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John Bon Clay

John Bon Clay

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Jul 14, 2020
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I get the mistrust people have on devs. I have my moments too sometimes, unfortunately. But a dev that refunds and pauses payments doesn't sound like a scammer to me. Besides Nottravis is cool as fuck! Come on!

Edit: I just had a moment just now, seeing ICSTOR's Milfy City finally got the Abandoned tag, sue me :)
 
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Ninjasquirrel

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Sep 9, 2018
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I don't think anyone has any issue with waiting, paying for the game or whatever else.

Mostly I think some are just annoyed with the estimates. And as someone pointed out, estimates are just estimates. Indeed they are, but they are based on information. I mean I assume there's a reason the estimate is late this month/early next instead of 5 minutes from now or some time in november. But ofc, the creator is in her full right to say it's out in 5 minutes from now, or in november, she doesn't owe us - or atleast not me - anything. I'm simply assuming the estimates are honest and not random dates, though I have wondered about why it's always late month/early next month. It's kinda like when I'm late for work and I call in, I'm always telling them I might be 10 minutes over, most of the time I'm actually 20 over, I know this, but I keep saying 10.

To use an analogy I think is very fitting. As hinted, I'm chronically late.
A good mate put me on the spot one day when I was my usual one hour late when I'm visiting him.
He said something like "you know you're always late, so why do you keep saying you'll be here at a certain time when you by experience have no reason to believe you will be? It's bloody disrespectful"
I had to aknowledge his point. Since then I've stopped giving times I have no reason to believe I will keep, instead I'm just giving him a "I'll be there at the latest XX:XX", which works for both of us. Ofc if I even failed to show up at the latest time announced he would really have a reason to be annoyed with me, but so far so good.

So my point is that I know by experience I'm always late to time agreed upon, and knowing that, the way I see it I'm basically lying to people if say I will be somewhere when I know I most likely won't be.
The other explanation to lying I can see is if I would have been so lacking of self awareness that my thoughts are "I've been late to meet my friend every time, and every time I've believed I would be on time. But that's zero reason to believe I'm gonna be late next time, so I can just keep saying I'll be there at time agreed upon."

Even if I had the best reasons to be an hour late, continuously finding myself in situations where I saved lives, I would still be n hour late.

Reminds me of the quote credited to Albert Einstein: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result.

Hopefully my analogy will make sense.
 
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moskyx

moskyx

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Jun 17, 2019
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imnotoverhere said:
That was a pretty weak attempt to make it look like I don't understand basic english. On that note.... do you understand what "estimate" means? Because I suspect I would have a very short career if this process occurred:

  • I reported to a client that I'd have a project ready at the end of this month or early next month,
  • Then when they asked about it that month, but l tell them there were delays but it's going to look amazing.... probably late this month or early next month.
  • Then I repeat that cycle 6 or 7 times
Now to clarify, I've only seen a couple posts from Notty giving estimates (such as the Feb estimate). Most of these are coming from certain members of her fan club.



Once again, I don't mind that the process is taking a long time. I'm not paying so it's not my concern when it does get released. I am just saying that every time someone asks when the release date is, certain members of her fan club come out to tell everyone that the game is likely getting released at the end of this month or next month. It's clear that these fans do not have the insight or dev knowledge that they think they have. These estimates are unreliable and don't do anyone any good. It would be more useful, to just say, "Nobody is really sure. Notty's previous release dates seems to suggest that it might be in X time frame but this is taking longer than expected so we really can't know for certain when it will be released".
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Those "fans" are actually betatesters of the game. So they do know how the game is coming along and give estimates based on their own work and Notty's comments in her official channels. What they can't do is anticipate Notty's sudden changes of mind that make her remake large chunks of already done work. Anyway, so much discussion for a pointless issue
 
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4.10 star(s) 64 Votes