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I think I have everything clear? the end of the media and the news of the game as it was not and is not, and you can understand those who have already left them, as they are simply deceiving these developers
cold_arctus
Devoted Member
- Sep 25, 2018
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Sorry, but then I don't understand your initial question.
I thought it was a serious question about taxation for supporters or how tax regulations are handled for game developer by Patreon.
locopogo1
Active Member
- Mar 24, 2020
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I didn't understand why P and P has so few patrons and why the game is developing so slowly, but now I understand that with this approach he will not have patrons, and the project Lily of the valley will close.
Honesty the patrons have been through some rough patches with P and P over the past soon 3 years so they are hardened and P and P will survive this one as well.
The usual cycle that we know all too well is: develop, promise a date, delay, promise another date, delay again, finally they deliver, people love it, some complain it's too short for x months (you know the usual..), they start a new cycle.
They are roughly maintaining the core patron base who knows how this cycle work for 2 years or so. Yeah some patron come and goes, but the core roughly stays.
But your are right they are not growing their base and they will not grow it with the current approach, but they will also not close.
The usual cycle that we know all too well is: develop, promise a date, delay, promise another date, delay again, finally they deliver, people love it, some complain it's too short for x months (you know the usual..), they start a new cycle.
They are roughly maintaining the core patron base who knows how this cycle work for 2 years or so. Yeah some patron come and goes, but the core roughly stays.
But your are right they are not growing their base and they will not grow it with the current approach, but they will also not close.
penmaster
Well-Known Member
- Nov 16, 2018
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Don't you think developers do run into problems sometimes? And that's why the update gets delayed. There is another developer ran into problem with his machine, so he couldn't bring the update plus I believe he was working on another game or probably finished that.
No, we're superhumans! Except we are not! You will read about that too, after we release the update, if other P agrees to share that shit. But anyhow, who gives a fuck about that, right!???
omarsayed
Active Member
- Jan 16, 2018
- 758
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i have been supporting you guys for more than 2 years and i know problems happens and delays can happens also
the thing is you need to tell us when you have a problems so people understand but you go in complete silent mode
otherwise you have to know people love the game so much they just cant wait lol.
if you communicate more with us ..people wont b this mad knowing whats coming.
i wish you guys all the best and i hope to see lily for many updates to come..i will keep on supporting you always ....we all just hope to see more of lily thats the problem
P, you know this already, but here it goes again
There are like 3 basic categories of people here:
1. People who cares and love the game - some are patrons and some are not, but they love the game and could be potential patrons.
2. Haters who move from forum to forum to piss on everyone who do not subscribe to the idea that <developer X> is an evil scammer bla, bla.
There are many <developer X> - not just P and P.
3. And people how just flow a long download without much noise, jumping from dl page to dl page.
Category 1 do give a fuck you can be sure of that. Likely potential or existing Patrons.
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You are biased, you can see that in point 2. when you describe people who like the game as just people, but people with different opinions who dislike as "haters". There are plenty who come in update after update to say what is wrong and they can do that, because not everything has to be good about the game. That doesn't make you automatically a hater. There are plenty other reviewers for other entertainments that solely say what is wrong with something. You can care for something without having to like it.
I hope you mange to fix and polish what you where missing.
I am not a paying patreon (sadly) but you guys had one amazing idea that you 2 (and the rest if more on the team) put to life. <3
It has been one hell of a journey (in a good) for Lily's story, for both payers and non payers but most of all for you guys.
You guys have a big fan base (even though not everybody has the ability to financially support) and some haters sadly. (That are in all threads, sites etc) but deep down even they love your work.
I hope you keep updating Lily's story and give her a respected ending when you are complete with her story.
And best of luck with your secret project.
Peace!
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You again....
BlackStallion
I guess you felt you fell in category 2 and needed to respond, and I'd say your feeling is pretty accurate because on the face of it, you do fit category 2 reasonably well (but like most, you are mix of a bit of this and a bit of that). However:
- you are pretty aggressive trying to pick fights - I don't know about hate but you know that better, so you can decide where you are on that...
- move from forum to forum pissing on people - check
- constructive criticism is fine and that's fair - lots of us do (and I do a lot of that), but most of us do it respecting the forum rules, and you don't respect the forum rules, do you.
Literally from the F95zone forum rules first there lines:
"
General
https://f95zone.to/threads/general-rules-updated-2020-02-08.5589/
Black
I guess you felt you fell in category 2 and needed to respond, and I'd say your feeling is pretty accurate because on the face of it, you do fit category 2 reasonably well (but like most, you are mix of a bit of this and a bit of that). However:
- you are pretty aggressive trying to pick fights - I don't know about hate but you know that better, so you can decide where you are on that...
- move from forum to forum pissing on people - check
- constructive criticism is fine and that's fair - lots of us do (and I do a lot of that), but most of us do it respecting the forum rules, and you don't respect the forum rules, do you.
Literally from the F95zone forum rules first there lines:
"
General
- Be respectful. Opinions are fine, attacks are not
- This includes trolling, belittling, etc
https://f95zone.to/threads/general-rules-updated-2020-02-08.5589/
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And P knows this. People have been pleading with them to do better communications. It's the single biggest issue they have.i have been supporting you guys for more than 2 years and i know problems happens and delays can happens also
the thing is you need to tell us when you have a problems so people understand but you go in complete silent mode
otherwise you have to know people love the game so much they just cant wait lol.
if you communicate more with us ..people wont b this mad knowing whats coming.
i wish you guys all the best and i hope to see lily for many updates to come..i will keep on supporting you always ....we all just hope to see more of lily thats the problem
Lots can be solved by communicating frequently and honestly with patrons. it's about trust, keeping your word, i.e. "say what to do and do what you say".
This is more important than to work more and harder. It's more important to communicate realistic deadlines and then meet or deliver early on them.... - exceptions management
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- Apr 23, 2019
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wow! this attitude, it's incredible! dude, either you guys are the unluckiest developpers on earth, either you are lying again and again. Sorry, but here you have so much support, most of the guys here had you back. in the last 3 days more people start talking more critically (but with humor) about your delays and you appear here and again talk trash, say nothing, and give zero transparency. People like me, that are upset on how you deliver your content are a minority here, usually keep in silence by enthusiastic guys who no matter what are prepare to give you an excuse. So at least for these guys (although i am not sharing their view) be nice and transparent. TALK TO THE PEOPLE AND STOP LYING!
- Apr 23, 2019
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you are one of the people I can't stand in this world, wanting all of them, whatever the quality and the respect of others.
for those like me who have supported him for a long time now we know that he is no more late than usual, if you have browsed F95zone you will find games where the Developments and where even the game developer does not communicate on his advanced of the game or the release of it. (go yell over there)
I close the site before continuing to read completely false and completely stupid posts in non-constructive comments.
Agreeing with ibizadalton!
Most other things I could add has been said many, many times before so i'm not repeating it here again.
BUT a few additional things: Just because they do not share and communicate a lot here , doesn't mean they are not sharing more info with Patrons. They do!
Another thing, the more aggressive, destructive, demeaning and vile this forum goes:
1. the less likely are patrons to share broadly that info or anything else for that matter here
2. the less likely it is that P and P will show up again - they'll just get attacked very time, so why should they?
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Pogo123
Engaged Member
- Mar 25, 2019
- 3,827
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puh this discussion is getting out of hand since days... if it already happened many times the past 3 years, as some mentioned, i wonder why nothing changed in one way or another.
i personally gave PnP 15 bucks a few months ago. Money i didnt really had, but since i played everything of years of work i wanted to show appreciation in a bit more than words (and that they don't give up) i also talked with them and they were pretty nice and quite busy already back then. and later i had to cancel support completely, cause of money issues, like latex224 always mentiones, also. :/ still one of my fav porn games and will always be in my top 3. idk why some guys talk it down so much i mean yeah the animations are a bit stiff in comparison to new games or games with bigger support (and the limiations of positions still bugs me) BUT it still aged well, the all around package is great (very understandable and smooth gameplay, great char :3, solide fetishes and nice story) many games lack these things more or less. even many newer ones. so get the stick out of your butt please guys who complain like that.
that they can't communicate well... well it seems even LotV veterans like Gr8Dumper agree to this. which doesn't mean that they already have to be liars maybe its really hard to them to communicate (maybe its a mentality thing? maybe really just the lack of english? guess we will never know) but at least they try to communicate here.
i saw devs who just disappear never seen again (humbling experience), devs who can't communicate at all and really try to milk as much as possible (MilfCity) and games which have an update ever half year or later with even less content than LotV where you have to wait years for actual sex and personal fetishes.
ofc it bothers me also it gets delayed and delayed all over again... but it still can be FAR worse. so calm your tits a bit, my "conspiracy theorists".
ibizadalton here have some coffee to lighten up your mood. (and i think the smiley on discord was a "yeah i know who you are" kinda thing )
i personally gave PnP 15 bucks a few months ago. Money i didnt really had, but since i played everything of years of work i wanted to show appreciation in a bit more than words (and that they don't give up) i also talked with them and they were pretty nice and quite busy already back then. and later i had to cancel support completely, cause of money issues, like latex224 always mentiones, also. :/ still one of my fav porn games and will always be in my top 3. idk why some guys talk it down so much i mean yeah the animations are a bit stiff in comparison to new games or games with bigger support (and the limiations of positions still bugs me) BUT it still aged well, the all around package is great (very understandable and smooth gameplay, great char :3, solide fetishes and nice story) many games lack these things more or less. even many newer ones. so get the stick out of your butt please guys who complain like that.
that they can't communicate well... well it seems even LotV veterans like Gr8Dumper agree to this. which doesn't mean that they already have to be liars maybe its really hard to them to communicate (maybe its a mentality thing? maybe really just the lack of english? guess we will never know) but at least they try to communicate here.
i saw devs who just disappear never seen again (humbling experience), devs who can't communicate at all and really try to milk as much as possible (MilfCity) and games which have an update ever half year or later with even less content than LotV where you have to wait years for actual sex and personal fetishes.
ofc it bothers me also it gets delayed and delayed all over again... but it still can be FAR worse. so calm your tits a bit, my "conspiracy theorists".
ibizadalton here have some coffee to lighten up your mood.
(and i think the smiley on discord was a "yeah i know who you are" kinda thing )
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"even veterans like" me
The communication, yes this is something i have discussed with P and P extensively in 1 on 1 messages over the years, even offered to help with that.
Honestly, they truth is that they are not comfortable in English at all. I actually think P is pretty good but he does not think so. Therefore they are very uncomfortable engaging in a dialog in English with lots of back and forth. and especially when there is shit being thrown around (like here)...
This is also why they have a dedicated translator to translate the game text so it's well done.
So since I know a bit more about them than most, I can honestly say it's mostly a language barrier why they do not engage the community in back and forth dialog. It's not that they do not want it's just not working for them. It would be like me trying to engage in a French speaking forum...
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