Ren'Py Completed Milfy City [v1.0e] [ICSTOR]

[goobdoob]

... that's not the point he's making.

Professionally run projects will be much more transparent about potential release dates, about the progress they're making, etc. They'll release a date, even if it's in the relatively distant future and then people can track as deadlines along that path are met or missed.

The whole "It'll be done when it's done and we have no idea when that is" mentality suggests (to some people) that nobody actually knows what's going on, that there's no clear focus, no goals set, no milestones to work towards. That organization is lacking.

Now speaking for this particular project and this particular developer? Who can say, but I imagine that the general train of thought when someone says "Why are there no target dates? Why is the dev so tight-lipped about how things are going?" is this.

I'm sure there are target dates (the break notwithstanding, of course). He chooses not to share them with us, because then people will say stuff like "You promised it out in June! It's not out! You suck!"

Inherently artistic projects are harder to scope than technical projects, because you have to deal with things like artist's block in addition to technical issues like mis-estimating render times.

Plus, this is NOT a professionally run project. If I had to guess I'd say it's CMM level -1.



Yes, yes, the lowest CMM level is 1. I know.

 

[fried]

I look at it as: either the Devs work to a schedule and fit in what is possible (e.g., MrDots) or they work to a content goal and let that dictate the release schedule (e.g., ICSTOR, Luxee). Usually, it's a mix of the two but still favoring one "project management" method vs the other.

Summertime Saga has become weird because they are revisiting established parts of the game and releasing updates+fixes which don't provide new content so much as revised content, increasingly. That's OK for some things, but it really seems to be a large part of what they do now and feels like unnecessary churn and even destructive at times: if I was a patron of SS, the new content would be my focus, honestly.

 

[polycentric]

I had to guess I'd say it's CMM level -1.



Yes, yes, the lowest CMM level is 1. I know.

Or, in my domain, A-SPICE 0

 

[Joerangers]

... that's not the point he's making.

Professionally run projects will be much more transparent about potential release dates, about the progress they're making, etc. They'll release a date, even if it's in the relatively distant future and then people can track as deadlines along that path are met or missed.

The whole "It'll be done when it's done and we have no idea when that is" mentality suggests (to some people) that nobody actually knows what's going on, that there's no clear focus, no goals set, no milestones to work towards. That organization is lacking.

Now speaking for this particular project and this particular developer? Who can say, but I imagine that the general train of thought when someone says "Why are there no target dates? Why is the dev so tight-lipped about how things are going?" is this.

exactly!

 

[K18]

here's another one
View attachment 307385
more in here:

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So the woman in question is

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a canadian rapper and model.

 

[Joerangers]

I'm sure there are target dates (the break notwithstanding, of course). He chooses not to share them with us, because then people will say stuff like "You promised it out in June! It's not out! You suck!"

Inherently artistic projects are harder to scope than technical projects, because you have to deal with things like artist's block in addition to technical issues like mis-estimating render times.

Plus, this is NOT a professionally run project. If I had to guess I'd say it's CMM level -1.



Yes, yes, the lowest CMM level is 1. I know.

That's it. That's what I find important. At least we have an idea. Personally, if at my job I take 2 months of leave without any real justification, well it would say to me: "goodbye". Now, Icstor surely has good reasons. Personally, I prefer to tell myself that the end of the game will be released in 2047 and that we will finally have the family orgy ... At least, with luck, it may be released in 2046. Good, sorry, I do not want not be mean, but ... who would contradict me?

 

[sarge87]

That's it. That's what I find important. At least we have an idea. Personally, if at my job I take 2 months of leave without any real justification, well it would say to me: "goodbye". Now, Icstor surely has good reasons. Personally, I prefer to tell myself that the end of the game will be released in 2047 and that we will finally have the family orgy ... At least, with luck, it may be released in 2046. Good, sorry, I do not want not be mean, but ... who would contradict me?

Well, for starters, every person in this thread not making ludicrous exaggerations for the sake of argument.

 

[Sperrin]

People who complain about ICSTOR's release schedule should seriously get some perspective, hundreds of high profile AAA games are delayed or cancelled every year, these are projects that often have hundreds of employees and entire marketing departments working to arrive at a specific release date and even then they often fail and on the occasions the game makes the release date usually at the insistence of the publisher it's often so vapid or buggy that no one wants to play it anyway.

Expecting one dev to do what entire development studios of hundreds of employees and their publishers can't do (releasing games in the expected time) is unreasonable and stupid.

 

[polycentric]

People who complain about ICSTOR's release schedule should seriously get some perspective, hundreds of high profile AAA games are delayed or cancelled every year, these are projects that often have hundreds of employees and entire marketing departments working to arrive at a specific release date and even then they often fail and on the occasions the game makes the release date usually at the insistence of the publisher it's often so vapid or buggy that no one wants to play it anyway.

Expecting one dev to do what entire development studios of hundreds of employees and their publishers can't do (releasing games in the expected time) is unreasonable and stupid.

Many people posting in this thread, including myself, have suggested precisely the same points and have extended the comparison that you made to other entertainment products as well. And despite the logic and easily understood parallels, there's still a group of people in this thread that insist that ICSTOR is lazy, a thief or some combination of both.

I simply don't understand what it is about this game, or this genre, that compels certain people to demand that ICSTOR do what EA and Microsoft can't. It would be interesting to see what would happen if ICSTOR used the same release cadence as Hollywood or retail gaming - I'm sure someone in this thread would suggest burning them at the stake.

Maybe we should create a fund to help people find other hobbies while waiting for VN game episodes to release...

 

[Vordertur]

I'm sure there are target dates (the break notwithstanding, of course). He chooses not to share them with us, because then people will say stuff like "You promised it out in June! It's not out! You suck!"

Inherently artistic projects are harder to scope than technical projects, because you have to deal with things like artist's block in addition to technical issues like mis-estimating render times.

And that's kind of the crux of the problem.

If all of these projects were purely "labors of love," then the developers would be beholden to no one but themselves. "It's done when it's done" would be the last word and there really would be no gainsaying them.

But as is always the case when money starts changing hands, "commercialization" complicates things.

People argue this back and forth on every game that has "hiccups" in its process, and it basically boils down to this: the moment you start throwing money into the equation, then the process sort of stops being "purely artistic" and starts falling into that gray area of "commercial software development."

We can boo-hoo all we like about the evils of AAA game development and the perils of getting in bed with the likes of EA and UbiSoft and all of those others, but there's a reason why things are run the way they are. It's not really sustainable to just turn a team loose, give them an indefinite amount of money and an indefinite amount of time and hope they produce. Someone, somewhere has to crack the whip.

With no one to crack the whip on these indie developers - with no one holding the reins - it's entirely possible that nothing at all gets done. Or something does get done, but not in any "reasonable" amount of time. (Insert thousands of posts back and forth debating what constitutes "reasonable.") The point still stands that there are always hardliners who insist that even though there's now money in the equation, that shouldn't change the nature of the beast. That everyone who isn't actually working on the thing should be hands-off and should have no say in how or why things are done because of "artistic integrity" or this or that, and because "this is not a commercial product."

That may be. But again, going back to the idea that if you take X amount of people with varying amounts of motivation, give them no incentive (either negative or otherwise) to finish something and leave it entirely up to them to finish the work or not... you stand a very real chance of not getting a finished product. And while some people complain simply because they live to do nothing but complain, others just don't want to see promising projects die because of lackadaisical dev studios.

 

[Skyangel007]

Many people posting in this thread, including myself, have suggested precisely the same points and have extended the comparison that you made to other entertainment products as well. And despite the logic and easily understood parallels, there's still a group of people in this thread that insist that ICSTOR is lazy, a thief or some combination of both.

I simply don't understand what it is about this game, or this genre, that compels certain people to demand that ICSTOR do what EA and Microsoft can't. It would be interesting to see what would happen if ICSTOR used the same release cadence as Hollywood or retail gaming - I'm sure someone in this thread would suggest burning them at the stake.

Maybe we should create a fund to help people find other hobbies while waiting for VN game episodes to release...

Like I said prev and what seems to be proven by the poster a few posts above. Most whiners are ignorant new members. Kinda seems that they tried out the game, saw it was on-hold and started to bitch without properly reading why its on-hold.

 

[Nonsummerjack]

Please, I want the Link of the android version

 

[elmandor]

Please, I want the Link of the android version

Afaik there is no official android version. You can check this out if you want its unofficial
https://f95zone.to/threads/milfy-city-v0-5c-icstor.8012/page-904#post-1556518

 

[Ara-sH]

any new news from icstor?

 

[Pitrik]

any new news from icstor?

No

 

[LeopoldWilliamReynolds]

To throw my 2 cents into the mix, Icstor always takes about 2-3 months between updates, but the content in each one is usually gargantuan, which makes up for it. In the mean time people lose their shit because it doesn't seem like the update is going anywhere. It's easy to see why people who expect monthly updates get upset by this, but it's a sheer lack of information or pattern recognition. Every abandonment-complex in here gets antsy after a couple of months and starts spam asking if the game has been abandoned, then the update comes out and everyone forgets for a few weeks until the impatience grows again. With icstor's latest sabbatical it's gotten even worse because even know people know the game is on-hold until Icstor's May-June timeframe of returning, they don't wait until it's over to start questioning if he'll ever be back. Basically, if it's still May, and it is still May, don't expect much, wait for a patreon update, and relax.

 

[Joerangers]

People who complain about ICSTOR's release schedule should seriously get some perspective, hundreds of high profile AAA games are delayed or cancelled every year, these are projects that often have hundreds of employees and entire marketing departments working to arrive at a specific release date and even then they often fail and on the occasions the game makes the release date usually at the insistence of the publisher it's often so vapid or buggy that no one wants to play it anyway.

Expecting one dev to do what entire development studios of hundreds of employees and their publishers can't do (releasing games in the expected time) is unreasonable and stupid.

Sorry, I did not want to offend anyone and probably not the creator. who does a nice job. And it is quite true that I do not know anything about the use of video games. Okay, I better do not say anything. But can we understand that some fans are disappointed?

 

[tall tale]

Indeed Icstors each update equals 3-4x updates in Timestamps,FILF etc Even the half developed update he said already contains 600 or so renders is 2x other developers updates not to mention the animations. Give it some time before going all apeshit about it.

 

[TaskSpacebar]

But can we understand that some fans are disappointed?

Are there some fans that are disappointed? Yes, though as you say, ' some ' can and will be interpreted differently by everyone. Overall, there will still members on this site (this forum included) WHO do not want to provide any polite criticism about this game or any other game(s) that are brought here. They think whining and making rude comments to fellow members as well as the dev(s) of these games will automatically think their opinions are considered a higher priority than those who provide genuine feedback and make suggestions on how to improve the game further, ie. flow and pacing, when it doesn't AT ALL and just makes it harder for said devs/creators to filter out what's genuine and what I'd refer to as 'tantrums' that don't help.

OR look at it this way, BE PATIENT and updates will come, regardless if they are bugfixes, dialogue errors, or content updates (regardless of size).

 

[polycentric]

any new news from icstor?

Relative to when that was asked about six hours ago, or several times today alone?