VN Ren'Py Mythos: Book One [v5.0.1 Hotfix] [Nine of Swords]

4.80 star(s) 63 Votes

ClockworkGnome

Active Member
Sep 18, 2021
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In the future, I may not even have gender choices, now that I think I have enough of an audience that likes the story...
I'll always be an advocate of allowing players to choose their avatar in a narrative-heavy game with choices. If nothing else it allows the player to play as the character and immerse themselves better if they identify with the person they're playing as. I think it definitely helps the player to see themselves as the main character rather than just watching "someone else's story" play out. And I know at least in my case, I tend to enjoy placing myself in the shoes of main character who isn't "me", because it encourages me to decide in my head what their personality would be and then RP out their reactions, and not just "pick the choice I would if it was me". So getting to choose gender (and potentially even being able to choose appearance via character creator options) is always a huge plus for me. The more I get to shape the main character's persona (gender, preferences, "career", backtory history, etc.), the more invested I am in their story.

(Half the reason I kind of dislike Fallout 3 and 4 is because I feel like I'm playing the same story every time. Half the reason why I've played Fallout: New Vegas more than a dozen times is because it kind of feels like my Courier is a radically different person every time, based on how I build them and what backstory I craft for them in my head.)

That being said, I definitely understand that it makes more work for a Ren'Py dev to effectively have to create double the scenes (or even triple for the occasional trans/futa game). And deciding the gender/preferences/backstory of a main character ahead of time allows the writer to work in nuance that they might otherwise have trouble implementing (say, the average JRPG versus the average Bethesda RPG). So there are certainly advantages for a dev to limit who the MC is (and disadvantages to flexibility).

I'd never condemn a dev (especially here) for simply saying "this is who the main character is", but I definitely get more out of a game if the dev basically allows me to decide who the main character is. So I do think there is value in giving players the option.

It's sort of why I often say things like "my Kylie does this" or "my Kylie thinks this" when discussing the game - because I have a strong idea in my head who she is in my version of the game (and I'm very aware that other people are almost certainly playing her differently). Being able to decide for myself "Yeah, she's still totally hung up on her old relationship" or "She's the kind of person who holds grudges" makes me way more invested in the character and the story. And deciding that she IS a she (or a he, or a they) is itself a major choice in crafting that persona.


plus it'd give opportunities to switch MCs, like giving people a chance to play established characters.
That can happen regardless. In this game, we're basically playing as "Nelson", of indiscriminate gender (and likely different first names since players can change their name - mine is actually Serra (short for Seraphina)). She (or he) has a history and a job we can't change, but there's a lot of room to fill in the blanks for a lot of facets of their life and personality.

In a hypothetical Book Two game, we could just as easily be playing a main character of indiscriminate gender whose first name we can pick and who we can fill in details in our head for, but still have them be a different main character of indiscriminate gender. They'll just be called "[charname variable] Sinclair" or something, and look different (since you're doing the renders for them). They'll also likely have different backstories, different friends, different jobs, and different powers. The two MCs could even theoretically meet, if you're willing to deal with the hassles of continuity. If you're sufficiently twisted, you could even make one MC a potential love interest for another (and players can essentially go fuck themselves).

It's sort of like how the Dragon Age games allow you to create your own character at the start (gender, race, name, stats, skillset, and so on), but all three are distinctly different people. Even if you give them all the same name and try to make them look as identical as possible (especially if you're trying to make them copies of your real self), the story treats them as different people (and canonically gives them different last names). And if you're a lore-obsessed weirdo like me, you do at least one run where they're all related (which is technically possible if you play Circle Mage, Hawke, and a human Mage - the first two are automatically and canonically second cousins - the third is a Trevelyan but could easily be related to the Amells via noble intermarriage).

I definitely don't think giving players the option to choose aspects of their character at the start somehow means the main character has to be the same one in every game. The only real factor there is if you decide, for instance, that you want Aiden Drest to be the main character of the next game for very specific story reasons, so allowing the player to choose their gender or name would completely screw things up.
 

ClockworkGnome

Active Member
Sep 18, 2021
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As a guy, I started playing as "Kyle". I decided, after reading some of Nine's comments early on, to try out the "Kylie" route. To be honest, I enjoy the "Kylie" route more. It makes more sense somehow.
I tend to like playing as female in most games as-is when I'm given a choice, but I definitely feel like the story of Mythos (and Bad Memories, incidentally) works much better if the MC is a female instead of a male.

In some games it doesn't really seem to matter overmuch which gender you're playing as (or each one has its own unique spin), but in those two cases it definitely feels as if the story just clicks more with a female lead. But at the same time, it's nice that male players who don't feel comfortable as female characters can still play the story as a male and get their own experience.
 

Nine of Swords

Keeping the Legends Alive
Game Developer
Dec 17, 2017
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That can happen regardless. In this game, we're basically playing as "Nelson", of indiscriminate gender (and likely different first names since players can change their name - mine is actually Serra (short for Seraphina)). She (or he) has a history and a job we can't change, but there's a lot of room to fill in the blanks for a lot of facets of their life and personality.

In a hypothetical Book Two game, we could just as easily be playing a main character of indiscriminate gender whose first name we can pick and who we can fill in details in our head for, but still have them be a different main character of indiscriminate gender. They'll just be called "[charname variable] Sinclair" or something, and look different (since you're doing the renders for them). They'll also likely have different backstories, different friends, different jobs, and different powers. The two MCs could even theoretically meet, if you're willing to deal with the hassles of continuity. If you're sufficiently twisted, you could even make one MC a potential love interest for another (and players can essentially go fuck themselves).
Oh, maybe I wasn't clear - when I said "play as an established character" I meant the ability to play as a character you meet in Book One; for example maybe Book Two has Tara as the MC, or it's a prequel and you play as Edda Norwood. Jodi was the MC of the novel, so I'd love to have her be an MC at some point.

Just ideas I'm batting around. I have way too many.
 
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bacienvu88

Well-Known Member
Aug 3, 2021
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Oh, maybe I wasn't clear - when I said "play as an established character" I meant the ability to play as a character you meet in Book One; for example maybe Book Two has Tara as the MC, or it's a prequel and you play as Edda Norwood. Jodi was the MC of the novel, so I'd love to have her be an MC at some point.

Just ideas I'm batting around. I have way too many.
I think it is great to see the same universe from different perspectives. See for example tlaero & mortze's Elsaverse where you play as a different character every game but have significant intersections with events from the other games.
 

Hullahopp

Active Member
Dec 26, 2018
543
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As far as more sex-focused adult games go, I was pretty put off by a lot of the female MC games.
Me too. The few female protagonist games that I sometimes download, I usually delete after 10 minutes. Fantasy crime doesn't exist, but there are often things that happen in those games that make me want to pour disinfectant in my eyes.
This story is written so that any of the characters could be male or female and it wouldn't really matter. The story carries.
Agreed! The outside grabs you, the inside keeps you.
I definitely feel like the story of Mythos works much better if the MC is a female instead of a male.
Yes. This is probably why the male MC has a slightly feminine look.
 

Nine of Swords

Keeping the Legends Alive
Game Developer
Dec 17, 2017
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Yes. This is probably why the male MC has a slightly feminine look.
This actually wasn't... completely intentional. I just didn't wanna have the typical "musclebound Adonis who also happens to be a huge nerd" male MC, so I looked through Daz models until I found a guy who could realistically be a former theatre kid and gamer boy.

I suppose not being male or into men myself had some influence on how I made the male MC without me realizing it.
 

Hullahopp

Active Member
Dec 26, 2018
543
1,089
This actually wasn't... completely intentional. I just didn't wanna have the typical "musclebound Adonis who also happens to be a huge nerd" male MC, so I looked through Daz models until I found a guy who could realistically be a former theatre kid and gamer boy.

I suppose not being male or into men myself had some influence on how I made the male MC without me realizing it.
This look really suits the character better. Many developers believe that the player wants to see an idealized version of themselves. That makes sense in a power fantasy, but this is not that game.
I don't like men either. Wow, how much we have in common! ;)
I'm a man, but I play your game as a woman, because it's an interesting experience to identify with a kind, sensitive soul... Okay, because I don't want to see a penis. I'm fine with my own.
Of course, the subconscious often influences one's decisions. When I first met Skeeter, I thought she was a cold-headed witch. After twelve years, I dare say I was right. But I would die for her without thinking. (Unfortunately, she knows that too.)
 

HogRocket

Engaged Member
Jun 8, 2020
2,351
10,940
This actually wasn't... completely intentional. I just didn't wanna have the typical "musclebound Adonis who also happens to be a huge nerd" male MC, so I looked through Daz models until I found a guy who could realistically be a former theatre kid and gamer boy.

I suppose not being male or into men myself had some influence on how I made the male MC without me realizing it.
I don't think he looks feminine at all. He looks like a "normal" guy who isn't particularly athletic, or a basement-living-gamer-couch-potato slob :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:

He looks like Kylie's twin brother (imagine that!)
 

ClockworkGnome

Active Member
Sep 18, 2021
737
1,951
Oh, maybe I wasn't clear - when I said "play as an established character" I meant the ability to play as a character you meet in Book One.
Nah, you were pretty clear. Apparently my brain just locked in on the "switch MCs" part and kind of skipped over the "established" part when I read it the first time. :)


This look really suits the character better. Many developers believe that the player wants to see an idealized version of themselves. That makes sense in a power fantasy, but this is not that game.
The funny part is, as a guy, I've never really seen big musclebound dudes as an "idealized" version of myself. Maybe because I've always been a really tall guy and spent most of my early life feeling uncomfortable with my own body and just sort of hunched over and tried to pull myself into myself all the time. I can't imagine having that mindset and wanting to be bigger.

If I ever had "beat up people who annoy me" power fantasies, it was never just "I want to have all the muscles and beat on them like the Hulk" as much as it would revolve around finesse and skill and martial arts kind of fighting. That even bleeds through in fighting games - I always pick the faster, agile characters over the heavy hitters.

My ideal fantasy self would probably be someone more like Aragon in LotR. Or maybe even something like RDJ in Iron Man.


He looks like Kylie's twin brother (imagine that!)
Funny you say that, because [SPOILER REDACTED]
I prefer the headcanon that they literally exist as alternate universe versions of the same person. Kind of like Loki meeting female Loki in the Loki tv show.

Plus, that opens up the door for an eventual "femK meets dudeK" scene in the game when a multiversal rift opens up and different realities start bleeding through. But that might just be because I kind of loved the scene in Saints Row IV when they went full meta and had you fighting the default player characters from Saints Row I and II. That sort of thing can be fun in a comedy-focused game.

And to go back to the Loki example, it also opens up the door for us to eventually meet an alligator version of K. Which is obviously the best possible version.
 

88Michele88

Bloodborn Vampire
Game Developer
Apr 22, 2018
2,891
3,030
So the ex MC's girlfriend is still alive. Did she had cheated her dead or it someone who took her place. I worried on what is that by her sadden reappearence alive like nothing was happened? I dunno. :sneaky::unsure::unsure::sneaky::unsure:
 
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Madara4057

Newbie
Mar 26, 2023
47
29
It's basically how I RPed myself into a hookup with her. I was like "Yeah, I'd probably be flirtatious with her here, but more as a joke than anything", and then she totally rolls with it and then I'm like "Yeah, okay, this is definitely happening then."

Of course, my Ky is weak-willed in general. I feel like on some level she's trying to be monogamous/loyal to Tara, but she keeps getting kind of guilt-tripped into pity sex with ancient gods or because fairies tell her it's for a magic ritual. What's a girl to do?



I'm usually just happy to find female protagonist games where the gameplay doesn't revolve around watching the main character get abused or corrupted or otherwise wind up as the town's official semen storage receptacle.

It's always awesome to find a game where the female lead is actually proactive and can make choices for herself, and remains firmly in control over her own sex life (especially if there's an option to play pure lesbian rather than getting forced into straight relationships). Basically, a female lead who gets to BE the protagonist as opposed to just being the designated victim.
For sure, in all honesty female protagonist games like that are my favorite they're just so hard to find
 
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Nine of Swords

Keeping the Legends Alive
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Dec 17, 2017
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Yep. Completely abandoned. Nine hasn't posted anything since Monday and no weekly updates since last Friday. I think the limit for "no activity" is four days :unsure:. If we don't hear anything by tomorrow the admins will mark it abandoned and erase it completely if no activity by next monday.
... I can't believe I haven't posted since Monday! :O

Weekly Update coming tomorrow, as usual!
 
4.80 star(s) 63 Votes