VN Ren'Py Abandoned Normal Trade Relations [v0.35] [Lostworks]

[Joshy92]

I haven't played this yet can anyone tell me is there potential for netorase in the future
Or is it all netorare?

 

[Drexelhand]

I haven't played this yet can anyone tell me is there potential for netorase in the future
Or is it all netorare?

There's some potential... but I haven't decided if we'll go that route yet. I guess it depends on how certain characters, who have yet to even be introduced in the game, are received.

 

[Joshy92]

There's some potential... but I haven't decided if we'll go that route yet. I guess it depends on how certain characters, who have yet to even be introduced in the game, are received.

Thank you for answering my question.
Good luck with the game
I think it's off to a really good start.

 

[estrada777]

Updated Android port. Nothing too fancy but let me know if you have any issues.

Version: 0.35

Appreciate my porting? Leave a Tip! You're supporting my efforts, paying for storage, and encouraging more ports!
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Spoiler: Usual Features

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This unofficial port/version is not released by the developer, download at your own risk.

PLEASE don't reply, or @ me, or DM me for updates. I always update my ports, YES I ALREADY KNOW ABOUT THE UPDATE.

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PLEASE don't reply, or @ me, or DM me for updates. I always update my ports, YES I ALREADY KNOW ABOUT THE UPDATE.

Size 60 MiB

Come find me on Discord:

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[Drexelhand]

Hey everyone, just a development update which can be found

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.

 

[matthww]

No actual cheating yet?

Game is in the beginning.

 

[Y5xHc]

Text box opacity option should be added

 

[Drexelhand]

Hey everybody, V0.35 has been released

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As a reminder, this is the final version which will have an immediate public release. After this, we are following the tiers, so you'll have to subscribe to get it early.

 

[grahegri]

NormalTradeRelations-0.35

Spoiler: TORRENT 615MB (Windows)

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[J0K3RXXX]

Promising.

 

[Revolving Mania]

Well, that was quite a read. I clicked on this and I was about to nope out of here when I realised the title is for the sake of the NTR acronym, but I was definitely not expecting to read a discussion about Tolstoy in here. I want to give my take on that and it's the main reason I'm posting but I'll leave that for later. First, I want to say that the dev's attempts to appease the anti-NTR crowd aren't gonna work.

First of all, one of the key themes of Anna Karenina is the contrast between passionate love and the expectations and societal norms that govern relationships. If the title doesn't make it absolutely clear to you what type of game this is, does the cover image do it? The first thing you see is NTR in the title and the more muscular and bigger-sized antagonist typical of an NTR story.

Now, the key difference between the typical NTR story and Anna Karenina is that the latter is about love and passion. Anna cheats on Levin because of her own personal dissatisfaction and a longing for passion and emotional fulfilment. It's not about a big dick, which almost all NTR boils down to and the way this is presented makes it crystal clear that it has some of that as well. I think the only way the dev can escape from that is to turn it on its head and abandon the fantasy that a big dick can turn women into mindless sluts, but I don't believe he will do that. Unlike Anna Karenina, Sex/Life is definitely like the typical NTR story and sexualises women in the same way. It kind of feels like the dev is trying to troll and make NTR haters cuck themselves by playing this game.

Back to the topic of Anna Karenina and NTR, it's funny... Anna Karenina shows two sides to the story, one for the pursuit of instant gratification and passion and another one for the pursuit of genuine happiness, much like VNs that have a NTR and "Pure Love" routes. Unfortunately, it's like someone already mentioned, one of the key things that make a VN or dating simulator enjoyable is the likeability of the LIs, which is why so many hate NTR, because how can you like someone who would so easily cheat on you? Aside from the so-called "simps," no one likes to be with someone so high-maintenance that saying or doing the wrong thing twice will lead them to cheat on you. Anna Karenina also shows the devastating consequences and the destructive power of cheating, but this is intentionally pushed aside in NTR and shows like Sex/Life.

Anyway, I think this medium is not good for this type of story if the dev is to be believed about his objective. Of course, it is good if your target audience is cucks and those who enjoy the humiliation, but it's not the same to read about someone's story and to step into the shoes of someone, to make decisions for them and literally look at the world through their eyes during first-person perspective moments. There are many techniques devs use to help you immerse yourself as the main character which are simply impossible in other mediums and the main reason why I can read NTR just fine in books, comics or even shows and feel nothing at all. In a visual novel, you are supposed to see and experience the consequences to your actions, which makes that much more personal.

 

[shadowprophet99]

I want to write something that's deeper, more complex, more tragic. I think that somebody who only likes Harem games might like this game...

I believe this is a fundamental misunderstanding of NTR-haters and their psychology.

We find tragedy and negative emotions to be directly counterintuitive to our goals when playing these games. We don't want tragic.

I'm not one of those people that complains when a game isn't made for them, I want everyone to have games they like. However, in the same way that I can't stand people saying things like "Hey, I know you don't like zombie movies, but watch THIS one", I also think you need to understand that you are incorrect. If your game is going to have unavoidable NTR (the kind where the protagonist sees other men fucking girls he's interested in), then you should accept and internalize that you aren't making a game that harem-game lovers are going to have any interest in, and they'll likely be mad if you somehow manage to convince them this game is different... because going by the metric they actually care about, it isn't.

 

[bluerubber]

Spoiler: NTR is a made up term by the way

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[bluerubber]

I believe this is a fundamental misunderstanding of NTR-haters and their psychology.

We find tragedy and negative emotions to be directly counterintuitive to our goals when playing these games. We don't want tragic.

I'm not one of those people that complains when a game isn't made for them, I want everyone to have games they like. However, in the same way that I can't stand people saying things like "Hey, I know you don't like zombie movies, but watch THIS one", I also think you need to understand that you are incorrect. If your game is going to have unavoidable NTR (the kind where the protagonist sees other men fucking girls he's interested in), then you should accept and internalize that you aren't making a game that harem-game lovers are going to have any interest in, and they'll likely be mad if you somehow manage to convince them this game is different... because going by the metric they actually care about, it isn't.

I've tried explaining similar logics to others in the past on either side of the fence. It's only good for collecting facepalms.

 

[BeastMaster59]

Very good game, even though the update is very small as the Dev stated, I like how the story is being told, I believe if the updates get a little bigger, this will become a pretty good game.

 

[m4pII]

With each update, I dislike the main character more and more.

"She was so upset when found out that her ex is dating her friend. Judging by her reaction, it is obvious that she is still emotionally attached to him and has feelings.
Well, ok, I know their relationships were wild"

such a nice guy

 

[Drexelhand]

Hope wifey gets some fat black cock

Maybe she will.

 

[Kukipett]

Two guys enter in a bar, they barely talk then go to the game, a girl comes back from work, calls a number, it's her previous lover who dates her friend, she is upset and drinks, the guy comes back from the game and sees her drunk and put her in bed. That's all folks, see you don't even need to play it.
This is nothingness at it's best, when someone wants to make you believe that his story is meaningfull but in fact he has not much to say and just stitch nice sentences together but you don't get what's going on because nothing is going on!

 

[Drexelhand]

Well, that was quite a read. I clicked on this and I was about to nope out of here when I realised the title is for the sake of the NTR acronym, but I was definitely not expecting to read a discussion about Tolstoy in here. I want to give my take on that and it's the main reason I'm posting but I'll leave that for later. First, I want to say that the dev's attempts to appease the anti-NTR crowd aren't gonna work.

I want to be clear about this. I'm not trying to appease anybody. I have a game in mind and I aim to build it. Just because I'm being polite with anti-ntr people doesn't mean I'm appeasing to them. I being polite because I see no reason not to be that with anybody.

First of all, one of the key themes of Anna Karenina is the contrast between passionate love and the expectations and societal norms that govern relationships. If the title doesn't make it absolutely clear to you what type of game this is, does the cover image do it? The first thing you see is NTR in the title and the more muscular and bigger-sized antagonist typical of an NTR story.

And I have addressed the big cock thing particularly in this latest update. It's certainly a topic which I will go into more. But that said, just because I'm taking inspiration from Anna Karenina doesn't mean I aim to replicate it. Just as Tolstoy taking inspiration from Pushkin doesn't mean he tried to replicate him.

Now, the key difference between the typical NTR story and Anna Karenina is that the latter is about love and passion. Anna cheats on Levin because of her own personal dissatisfaction and a longing for passion and emotional fulfilment. It's not about a big dick, which almost all NTR boils down to and the way this is presented makes it crystal clear that it has some of that as well. I think the only way the dev can escape from that is to turn it on its head and abandon the fantasy that a big dick can turn women into mindless sluts, but I don't believe he will do that. Unlike Anna Karenina, Sex/Life is definitely like the typical NTR story and sexualises women in the same way. It kind of feels like the dev is trying to troll and make NTR haters cuck themselves by playing this game.

First, Anna never cheated on Levin. She cheats on Karenin. And I've shown in this latest update, that the protagonist's wife didn't enjoy the sex with her ex-boyfriend because he had a big cock, that was one of the points that made her not like it.

As for Sex/Life, that show actually anti-ntr'd since she never cheated in it.

Back to the topic of Anna Karenina and NTR, it's funny... Anna Karenina shows two sides to the story, one for the pursuit of instant gratification and passion and another one for the pursuit of genuine happiness, much like VNs that have a NTR and "Pure Love" routes. Unfortunately, it's like someone already mentioned, one of the key things that make a VN or dating simulator enjoyable is the likeability of the LIs, which is why so many hate NTR, because how can you like someone who would so easily cheat on you? Aside from the so-called "simps," no one likes to be with someone so high-maintenance that saying or doing the wrong thing twice will lead them to cheat on you. Anna Karenina also shows the devastating consequences and the destructive power of cheating, but this is intentionally pushed aside in NTR and shows like Sex/Life.

And that is something which I aim to show in this. I do want to make this more than just "ohmigod look at his fucking cock hehehehe". I love those kind of games, but I don't think I could write them. Even if the most I accomplish is a facsimile of something deeper, it is what I am trying to do.

Anyway, I think this medium is not good for this type of story if the dev is to be believed about his objective. Of course, it is good if your target audience is cucks and those who enjoy the humiliation, but it's not the same to read about someone's story and to step into the shoes of someone, to make decisions for them and literally look at the world through their eyes during first-person perspective moments. There are many techniques devs use to help you immerse yourself as the main character which are simply impossible in other mediums and the main reason why I can read NTR just fine in books, comics or even shows and feel nothing at all. In a visual novel, you are supposed to see and experience the consequences to your actions, which makes that much more personal.

I think that you have to try my game yourself and then tell me what you feel because it's funny, the criticism you're presenting is what I aim to address with it. Where we are with this completed third release is what I think can be seen as a demo, nothing has been truly fleshed out yet, but the ideas have been constructed, you can start to visualize the themes and I think that maybe you'll find that what you're criticizing this game for not being might just end up being what it is. If you do try it, I sincerely hope you like it.

 

[Drexelhand]

I believe this is a fundamental misunderstanding of NTR-haters and their psychology.

We find tragedy and negative emotions to be directly counterintuitive to our goals when playing these games. We don't want tragic.

I'm not one of those people that complains when a game isn't made for them, I want everyone to have games they like. However, in the same way that I can't stand people saying things like "Hey, I know you don't like zombie movies, but watch THIS one", I also think you need to understand that you are incorrect. If your game is going to have unavoidable NTR (the kind where the protagonist sees other men fucking girls he's interested in), then you should accept and internalize that you aren't making a game that harem-game lovers are going to have any interest in, and they'll likely be mad if you somehow manage to convince them this game is different... because going by the metric they actually care about, it isn't.

Perhaps I'm misunderstanding people, but I see nothing wrong in talking with them and fleshing those misunderstandings out.