VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch. 4 Up 4 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[RC-1138 Boss]

Interesting to have the choices, even if i didn't changed much of what Edwin said before the update.

 

[OsirianObsidian]

i'll only start the new update literally after posting this reply, so take my words with a grain of salt, but

while your theory sounds highly interesting, i'm still more convinced that the whole 'mina is not doing the bucket list with ian but now with mc' is more playing into that ultimate nice guy fantasy that a girl will only do the real naughty stuff with you if she 'feels safe' with you and 'trusts you fully because you don't cheat' (behind her back)

would love to see your idea being whats really going on though lol

Trust is definitely important but then, how has the MC built up trust with Mina when he's literally going behind his friends back with her? Why would you decide to trust someone who betrays their best friend like that? I mean, Killian was pretty obvious with his cheating on Mina and when the MC asks why he left the sex video around for Mina to find, Killian can't explain why he did it. Personally I think he did it because he has a self-sabotaging personality - whenever something is going good for him he can't help but fuck it up by pushing it just that little bit too far.

I'll give you another reason why I reckon Mina's plan was to always cuck Killian - she says that her mother is not very 'sex-positive' and views getting an education for a girl as a means to marrying into a 'well-to-do' family. Meaning that Mina has been brought up to be a very 'tradwife' type of girl. She even says that her mother would love the fact that she and Killian were together - her mother was Mrs. Eiko Adams, then Mrs. Eiko Scott, then Mrs. Eiko Umeda-Wright. I'm guessing her maiden name was Eiko Umeda. This shows what kind of woman Mina's mother is - Mina says that they 'butt heads sometimes over what's traditional' and that she has a 'generous heart' that 'maybe a little too generous when it comes to the men' - implying that Mina's mother is a bit of a doormat.

Mina, however, doesn't view herself as a trophy to be won or a doormat to be stepped on. Her upbringing has made her very repressed sexually to the point where she's actively into things like foniphilia (if you say that using women as an object is the MCs fantasy during the game on his birthday, it's the only choice where she smiles and gets flustered).

Ask yourself what would be a bigger fuck you to her mother's opinion on what a woman should be than to reject the guy who her mother would consider to be a great catch by cucking him with his best friend who is studying to be a doctor, who Mina considers to be a great catch?

I just think Mina is more manipulative and smarter than most people give her credit for.

 

[Aeon_RHS]

I think I worded my reply unprecisely. i don't deny that your theory could be right. i was one of the few here who early on called mina out for the manipulative cold hearted behaviour she exhibited when throwing herself at mc from the very beginning at the cafe scene.

i just think its unlikely that TD will write her future role like that. even though that would be more fun than calling a LI an annoying cunt in the badik thread. lol

would certainly be surprised positively.

but i have to admit i'm a bit confused about it too. because i have little doubt TD can write some twist like that well, just like the club feels more and more threatening after abels visit. but i still can't imagine that mina is not there to indulge the inner nice guy of people a bit. that she trusts mc now more than ian is of course the typical porn game logic, like so often the mc comes and treats a girl so much better than her asshole boyfriend and now shes head over heels into him. even though that would be kinda insulting towards TDs writing quality.

one thing that would maybe go a bit against your theory is that mina seemed genuinly bothered by ians behaviour in the party club early in the game, when he was flirting with the violet hair chick. i think it as also said that this was a usual occurrence by felicia. not sure if she really cared that much if she was mostly waiting to cuck ian.

another possibility is that she just did usual leveling up monkey branching, when she realized that the guy she cant make fall in love (ian) admires mc like a god. so instead of further trying to get the love of ian she just tried to get the man who is above ian, the mc.
basically the absolute classic


maybe actually your theory and my theory don't even contradict each other that much. she could have been the evil manipulative cucking girl to ian - at least that idea could have formed after meeting mc - while still being the good naughty girl reward for mc's nice guy behaviour, and being good to him since her cucking thing is now off the bucket list (oh no, i think she said ian was not boyfriend enough for that to count!?) and she will now begin a nympho depraved relationship with mc.

again, have not played her new scene in the update yet. and clearly would find it funny to see your theory being whats really going on with mina lol

In well depicted characters there is often a gap between what they say (how they see themselves, or want to be seen) and the things that drive them underneath the surface persona. Mina's public persona is at odds at times with her internal values, responses and desires - things that are likely to influence her without her even understanding it herself.

Her drive to show up her mother and also indulge her own deep inclinations can manifest as her feeling much 'safer' with Edwin faster than a relationship like theirs would normally progress. Combine that with her loneliness and upbringing and it's easy to see why she quickly latched on to Edwin. She could be manipulative without even realizing she's doing it on purpose, especially since Mina is conflict averse.

 

[Djoki996]

I'm not finished yet (still in week 1) so, not sure if this is proven true or false later on but

Spoiler: Darius

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[Sir. Cockalot]

Finally played the update. Broke my heart to tell Mina rip bozo.

 

[infomercial]

Why is the pixeldrain file bigger than the others?

 

[Zephea]

Why is the pixeldrain file bigger than the others?

Some sites use 1000 bytes for a 'k', others use 1024... you get used to it after awhile. Sites like Mega and Pixeldrain generally virus-scan the files, there should not be any problems with them. :>)

 

[RC-1138 Boss]

I'm not finished yet (still in week 1) so, not sure if this is proven true or false later on but

Spoiler: Darius

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Just a feeling that i have after a conversation between Edwin and Chuck.

Darius is sporting a pair of concrete shoes somewhere in the middle of the ocean atlantic (or pacific, not sure exactly where the story takes place)

 

[Turret]

Just a feeling that i have after a conversation between Edwin and Chuck.

Darius is sporting a pair of concrete shoes somewhere in the middle of the ocean atlantic (or pacific, not sure exactly where the story takes place)

Well, I think Darius and his girl made it out, but barely. Since it was the first time it happened. But the two should stay away from Moorehead Hills if they know what is good for them. A return would surely mean the "perfect fit concrete footwear" with a frontrow view of the Atlantic you mentioned. Alternately Warren or August would solve the problem equally terminal.
It is possible that Darius is dead, but I think not. But what is sure, the club leadership will not tolerate a repeat of his stunt by anyone.

 

[cumsumnida]

Just wanted to say holy shit - Hana's design is ridiculously amazing.

She's a japanese, big titty goth with pigtails, tattoos and piercings. And I mean her tits are ridiculously awesome tits and her outfits are neon signs for those hangers.

So is Veronica's design (buff, totally shredded amazonian with big natural (?) tits) and the general plot scenario.

It should feel absurd, but it doesn't because the writing is so good and the characters and their interactions seem quite grounded in spite of their designs.

 

[Turret]

A couple thoughts about the revised "doctors visit" I am sure Edwin will one day think back and will shake his head about it.


I theorise that Abel let it slip unconciously what his plan is and how Edwin might fit in, at least in one subpath of the game. While Abel and Sophia have their own dark spots, they want a "revolution" in PC, ousting the current leadership and setting in their own. Abel mentioned the problems and "shakeups" that can happen, which is a sure sign that he and Sophia might be the "shakeup", if they think it is needed. Abel and Sophia want to test their more "dubious" inventions in peace. Morals might interest them only in abstract, but they are not as sadistic or cruel as who leads PC now.
As I mentioned in one post, I think one subpath is Abel and Sophia are investigating who can stay and who wil be "asked" to leave the club. It might be that the new leadership will be the MC, Hana and maybe Killian, with Sophia as Abel´s right hand and future heir in the mix.
On a more neutral or slightly dark, but still positive path (since both are not as bad as the current leaders of PC) Abel and Sophia want the Club for their medical Empire and experiments they cannot conduct in the open. Abel even mentioned it one time to Kath, that the stuff they test in the Club was meant to be shelved or used as an energy drink by the firm, but that he and sophia think there is a lot more medical potential in it than just that. I am sure Kath listened to this through her own prism, that the drugs would help Club business (which it does), but the doctors meant other uses too and more.

On a more lighter path I theorise Abel and Sophia are in league with the law. Because how would the police infiltrate such a protected club, they have the local politics and police on their side? Deep cover would be a problem for most officers for several reasons.
So helping Abel and Sophia might be a way out of the club or also a way to stay with PC, but under different circumstances.

 

[Riverburn]

there is something about Pale Carnations that I can't look past, and... I did a search on this thread, and no one seemed to have mentioned it before. So I'm curious, is it just me, or does this feel like a very Japanese sorta cast placed in a very American environment?

I've watched my fair share of anime, read manga's, and even played those old school AVN (Xchange... aah, memories). A lot of those Japanese tropes seem to come back here: large bossoms, slightly exagerated emotional expressions, The Cutesy character (Mina with lots of pink), the badass one (Hanna with lots of blacks), unusual hair colours, women have large eyes and so on.

all male characters also kinda look Japanese and Asian. It doesn't bother me, it just made me curious. I was initially wondering if this was a Japanese game being translated (but it's not, that much I understood), or simply a choice of 3D characters.

That being said, I really appreciate the depths of all characters who on surface can strike as stereotypical and then quickly are fleshed out.

 

[Biscardone]

there is something about Pale Carnations that I can't look past, and... I did a search on this thread, and no one seemed to have mentioned it before. So I'm curious, is it just me, or does this feel like a very Japanese sorta cast placed in a very American environment?

It may not be all there is to it, but I think this is mostly due to the choice of HoneySelect as a graphics engine, that tends to skew the aesthetics to be anime-adjacent. And to the author's tastes in bust size. I'm not complaining, by the way...

 

[ZaynX]

Compressed version of latest update?

 

[Zephea]

Compressed version of latest update?

The Update has a link on the OP, there is a compressed version of it on that link. The Compressed version of the whole game is 2 pages back at: https://f95zone.to/threads/pale-carnations-ch-4-update-2-public-mutt-jeff.50281/post-10555668

You just have search a bit to find them. :>)

 

[Turret]

yeah, seemed a bit from the very introduction of abel as if he has his very own agenda with the club

but

i'm a bit concerned how you paint the rather 'consensual hardcore pimping'-path as the dark one, and the 'non-consensual auschwitz style medical experiments in the catacombs of the club'-path as the lighter one lol

Well, ifI am right on some of the agendas and backgrounds of Abel and Sophia, then these two play a role as scientists who do not see the stop point to get into PC. Unlike some of the "consensual pimping"(hardly so), it is interesting that we never saw something about this experiments beside one scene and even that more implied than anything else. It seems Sophia is mostly alone with the test subject. In addition, she tests the stuff they make onto herself as well.As for "consensual hardcore pimping" that is one of the big problems Hana has with PC, because for most working there it is anything but consensual. A change in leadership to a better Edwin, Hana, maybe Ian and Sophia would be a major upgrade. I doubt that the medical experiments in the basement (currently one) would continue (see spoilered text why I think so)and Sophia would keep testing in the clubs secrecy, but more openly and with consenting "subjects". At least on a neutral or slightly dark path.

 

[Turret]

while we didnt see the girl pleading to be let go in the catacombs it was kinda telling. aside from sophia doing it to mc just casually for a bit of chaos.

i still think there was not a single piece of information that any of the prostitutes/carnations is at the club for something else than their free will? or did i forget something?

You forgot quite a bit about what happens in the club. The majority of the house girls is there "consensual" as far as having few to no alternatives is "free will", which means not really. Kath mentiioned it how she abuses the problems of both future housegirls and several Carnations to bring them in. Not a few are in PC because the likes of Otto and other friends of August "convince" them to work there. Kat and Chuck (when he let´s his inner demons free) get off on being sadistic and cruel to nearly everyone.
I am sure, if just a bit of what Abel told Edwin about the club leadership is true, the body count of PC, be it directly or indirectly, is probably rather substantial. That is in comparison worse than the experiments Sophia does, which might have embarassing outcomes for some of the recipients, but are not as deadly. She tests their concoctions herself too, I doubt she risks keeling over forever carelessly. Her experiments might be one of the few things keeping the "test patient" in the basement alive, because without Abel and Sophia interested in test subjects, however aquired, I am sure Kath (via Warren) or one the other two would have "offed" the person in the basement already.
Abel and Sophia might not be angels, but they are not as close to the moral event horizon as the current club leadership is. I think that is imprinted by the fact that Sophia states that Chuck is scary. If a person as cold, calculating and amoral as Sophia Lundgren says something like this, you better listen.

 

[Turret]

hm, we seem to have a different frame on things

i cant even remember a single incident where kat, chuck or august tried to put a girl in bad life circumstances, so she would start working at the club. iirc that was only samson as a patron. if the carnation club offers desperate women profitable work with shit conditions and the girls freely decide to accept that - its honestly their own problem. so far iirc the club owners have not coerced or blackmailed a girl into working there. even kat just uses her fund to give desperate women a choice - like rose. shit choices, yes, but seemingly still choices the women are happy to take. without the club they seemingly would be worse off. i think kat once said something along the line of having a girl on the hook, but she said that with lucy as well, and she's just there out of greed and ego.
not like the club owners are saints, but i just cant remember them really doing something really bad with the girls. august seems to even be not amused about warrens doings, considering that the boss whore intimidated him with mentioning august. and i think abel sounded like augusts possible murders were before the club dealings.

its just a work of fiction so every clue is just TDs mind, but i feel the undrground medical experiments are kept so secret from chuck and august, because they would not sanction the cruelness of them. also not really thinking kat is into murder.

but who knows. TD decides. i definitely find cold scientific cruel testing way more creepy than for example chuck's stuff likely driven by hedonist desire

Yes, that seems to be the case.

It is simply an illusion of choice if Kath gives a future housegirl or Carnation the option of a "bad choice" and a worse "option b"! Take Rosi, she is a prime example of the false choice Kath gives others. Rosi has the choice between not taking part in the sadistic games Kath devices and just facing the "tender mercies" of "just Oliver" for her daughter and herself. That is no choice at all. And happy? How do you come to the conclusion are happy taking the poisoned chalice Kath, Chuck or August offers them?

Lucy and Felicia are exceptions from the norm, because Lucy is too stubborn to admit that another school for her kid is quite good as well. And Felicia is the biggest exception of all, since it is mentioned several times that she is the first to be in the games of her own free will. Those on Feli´s path know the real reason she is there, but she is the only one(!) who could throw in the towel and not being in a worse position afterwards.
August does not make the life of some housegirls or Carnantions miserable himself, but has few problems accepting newbies from his gangster connections. And these girls are also under duress, see the new one Otto brought. August is the only one the owners who is selfaware enough to see he is not a good person.

i feel the undrground medical experiments are kept so secret from chuck and august, because they would not sanction the cruelness of them.

Pardon me, but here you are completely on the woodway. Kath keeps the experiment a secret because it becomes clear from early on that she wants more power in the Club. It seems Abel and Sophia said they would help her gaining more power, that is the only reason Kath keeps the experiment a secret from the others! Not because of the cruelness, Kath and Chuck get off on this! And if it helps make money, August is okay with nearly everything. They would not care a bit about the experimentation done! The secrecy is because Kath tries to nurture an independent trump card in her own ppowerplay.
Abel and Sophia loath the PC owners, that is very clear. The current alliance between them and Kath is one of convenience nothing more.

i definitely find cold scientific cruel testing way more creepy than for example chuck's stuff likely driven by hedonist desire

As said, it is not certain how cruel the testing Sophia does really is! It is not shown unlike stuff the PC owners condone, like, get off of and do or let do. And I am astonished that you find Chuck less creepy, esp. since it was insinuated several times how bad he is. Doc Sophia is calculating, cool to cold, amoral, a "the endgoal sanctions the means" type and certainly dangerous when she needs to be. When such a person states she finds someone scary, you should be doubly warned!
Sophia also tests the stuff on herself and she is certainly not one who will take a lethal risk! I see a high probabilty that the person in the secret basement is only still alive, because Sophia does what she does. As said, under other circumstances Warren or the others would have killed the test subjcct already. It was mentioned several times what is the normal outcome if someone crosses the PC club the wrong way.

 

[Sorath]

What the fuck did i just play??

No-For real, this shit is too good, too good, i mean, TOO FUCKING GOOD

This game is the only one that is at the level of Being A Dik in terms of entertainmet( i played a lot )

but bro. what the fuck. i got so invested in the story, this never happen time (only 1 time , with BAD)

i played, acting lessons, depraved awakening, dreams of desire, becoming a rockstar, city of broken dreamers(close but not enough) , deliverance, leaph of faith, once in a lifetime. and probably all the VN's you are thinking about

and only beong a dik has had that effect on me of being really invested in a porn game. until now, holy fuck

and with illusion models!! WTF amazing bro AMAZING

 

[Ligma Walls]

I've been able to install the new update on android and figured out how to move all my saves across but I noticed that my gallery is now locked so I have to go back to the start to unlock all the early scenes anyway despite having my saves up to the end of ch4 up1. Does anyone know a way around this? I didn't copy across the "persistent" file as there was already one in the new renpy_saves folder. Could this be the reason?