VN Ren'Py Pale Carnations [Ch.4 Up.6 Public] [Mutt & Jeff]

[DarkLords00]

Sorry man, but your argumentation here is one-sided and unfair! It might have slipped your memory, but esp. in the first part of the game you can repeatedly remind Ian of what he might throw away with his actions. Also even our hero is surprised about the video stick!
As a reminder, I still have a 6 point romance rating for them in my playthroughs. That is the result of our hero repeatedly helping both sides and talking to them about their relationship. I consider a friend trying to get his friends with their relationship in trouble to talk and solve their problems a good friend! You cannot solve their problems for them, but you can help them in many smaller ways. You might or might be not able to keep them together, that is something they decide.

Dude, the only possible way to keep that score high so far it's to blatantly lie for Killian about one of his several instances of him cheating on Mina.

You can also argue that, that ship (Mina x Killian) , completely sunk the moment she found that tape in her house since it's heavily implied by some of her comments surrrounding her mother and her breaking into tears if Edwin decides to comfort her via hug that one of the most promminent reasons she kept indulging the relationship despite Ian's misdeeds was because she didn't want her lovelife to resemble her mother.

Also, also if Mina were to fully get back together with Ian romantically after that amount of betrayal and it was portrayed as a good thing in the story (Regarldess of Ian changing or not) it would show her as a complete and utter pushover with no amount of self-love/self-respect that would contrast too much with how she is portrayed trough most if not all of her scenes. (Christsake, she has a full on memorial wall with important events of her life that fills her with happiness/pride and her meeting Ian was a footnote if we compare via photograph size )

I don't understand this sudden desire with Ian and Mina getting back together would be good for Ian's charcter where it would run contrary to him having to live with the fact that his way of life and tendencies to enjoy momentary satisfaction and pushing boundaries regardless of consequences led him to lose one of the best possible things he could've had in his life besides Edwin and Victoria.

If you guys just want to see Ian with anybody else there's always the hairstylist or his maid Alice even Hana would make more sense since she can determinally(almost) admit to Mina about finding Ian hot so if he resolves his personality issues I doubt anything could stop them from them developing into something more if Ian changes his way since there is no previous baggage and unlike Mina she probably know the most about him besides his uncle or the Turners.

If you, on the other hand prefer Mina to be with someone: there's always that guy at Hana's rockshow who was an acquaintance of her(Pete/Paul don't remember his name xD) or just any random person Mina would desire to try dating with.

 

[ffive]

If you, on the other hand prefer Mina to be with someone: there's always that guy at Hana's rockshow who was an acquaintance of her(Pete/Paul don't remember his name xD) or just any random person Mina would desire to try dating with.

Pete would be okay if he didn't look like a gremlin; i'm shallow and my suspension of disbelief only goes so far.

But it wouldn't surprise me too much if Mina met someone in that talent agency she's a part of, who could catch her interest. Having some common experiences to share and some similarity of mindsets can help quite a bit. (not to mention scoring higher in the looks departments, obv)

 

[Turret]

Dude, the only possible way to keep that score high so far it's to blatantly lie for Killian about one of his several instances of him cheating on Mina.

Sorry, but that is not true, my Edwin never lied to Mina! You do not have to. What is also overlooked here by some, since they are wanting Mina the first chance they can get, that there are choices which do not add to trashing the Ian/Mina relationship.

 

[lustforsex]

I mean, if you don't cross the line then that first item on her bucket list remains unchecked but she'll want to get that done sooner or later, too.

I actually quite agree that, realistically, there's little chance for Edwin and Mina to have a long-term relationship. The "rebound guy" effect does play a role, as does Edwin actually connecting with Mina as a person unlike Ian, but the former is going to wear off and so will sooner or later the novelty of the latter -- it's not like Mina is never going to meet other people who treat her like a thinking human being, but who won't have Edwin's various baggage and as such will be objectively better pairings.

I supposed it could be nitpicked, but I figured covering up every weak point in the messages would be ridiculous. That way, Edwin simply wouldn't give Mina a reason to... simple as that. Or if Mina decides to do to Edwin what Ian did to her, in which case I won't leave the club and will make sure she becomes the next Carnation

I agree. Even if you reject Mina the first time, the second time at the park she'll be more responsible about reciprocating your advances. I interpret the certain affection check to ensure she doesn't reject you as meaning that this time she doesn't see you as a rebound guy, and if you don't meet that check, she'll just call you a nerd with no hobbies

 

[lustforsex]

It feels like we're slowly but surely approaching the territory of Ian not being raised by his parents, not knowing the meaning of unconditional love, and Chuck's philosophy, which he imposed on him, clearly didn't help either. This certainly doesn't excuse his behavior toward Mina, but it also plays a significant role in who he became and we have a chance to show him that this is not the only way.

Going down such a rabbit hole on a fucking porn forum is certainly an interesting phenomenon. I've had enough for now

 

[slightchance]

Pete would be okay if he didn't look like a gremlin; i'm shallow and my suspension of disbelief only goes so far.

Pete looks fairly average to me. He won't have any trouble finding someone like Mina. In fact he reminds me of one lanky ass gremlin with a five head who scored one of the hotties back in the days. Dude was simply easy to be around and quite charming. That's enough for some people.

 

[DarkLords00]

Sorry, but that is not true, my Edwin never lied to Mina! You do not have to. What is also overlooked here by some, since they are wanting Mina the first chance they can get, that there are choices which do not add to trashing the Ian/Mina relationship.

That statement is completely false, it is actually impossble for Edwin not to lie to Mina, if you think it makes Edwin a better friend to cover better for Ian's misdeeds that's up to you as a person but don't try to gaslight me with false information please.

Regardless of how you play the game the choice I was talking about is as follow:

Spoiler: Regardless what you choose Edwin will lie...

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Spoiler: If you choose the first option...

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Spoiler: If you choose the second option...

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[shazamanone]

full save anyone?

 

[Turret]

That statement is completely false, it is actually impossble for Edwin not to lie to Mina, if you think it makes Edwin a better friend to cover better for Ian's misdeeds that's up to you as a person but don't try to gaslight me with false information please.

Regardless of how you play the game the choice I was talking about is as follow:

Spoiler: Regardless what you choose Edwin will lie...

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Spoiler: If you choose the first option...

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Spoiler: If you choose the second option...

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The first option is NOT a lie. A lie is intentionally telling someone something that the speaker knows to be false. Edwin omits knowledge he has, but he doe not lie.

 

[Discrepancy]

The first option is NOT a lie. A lie is intentionally telling someone something that the speaker knows to be false. Edwin omits knowledge he has, but he doe not lie.

Come on! An half-truth is still a lie, or at least we can't be truly honest to Mina, the truth will be a third option: Tell mina the truth say Ian is cheating on her. I would probably chose the half truth though, but that is still lying om my book

 

[Turret]

I think this is purely fan fiction, sorry Turret Abel and Sophia are testing a rape drug or whatever you want to call it on living humans. Whatever they doing on the basement of the club could be pretty nefarious and worse than anything Chuck or August ever done in the club, maybe not Kathleen hehe.
Your love for Sophia is great, I like her too, but she looks brainwashed on the last update and maybe she's not evil but Abel for sure is. Well at least that's how I saw things there, I might be completely wrong too

Hi!
No problem, our discussion lives from the various standpoints we have. My look at it is not simply fanfiction, I ´ll show you why I think so below. As an aside, with the game advancing further and further it becomes clearer that Sophia/Abel are shaped to be a middle path to go on. They certainly are not something akin to Kath and Chuck, opposing them, but also have few qualms to do what they consider necessary. Sophia (we know not much about Abel so far) is one of the few bright lights in the club, but she has a couple of black schlieren on her.

We should not forget that so far the game never shied away from showing consequences of events happening, e.g. Jacob putting Oliver into coma. Until now there has been no pics showing what happens in the cellar, while we have info on some other "delicate" happenings. There is someone kept prisoner in there, that´s for sure, but I doubt that Sophia does much to him/her. The advances of her "Viagra+" are far too quick even for a genius like her (remember Abel and Sophia are in the club not much longer than our hero is) to be made in that cellar with one "lab person".
It is far more likely that the newer versions are coming from Abel and Sophia´s black labs, with additional research info gained from the use in the club with older versions. It is complete BS to believe they research the drug at the club when they have black labs available. Abel and Sophia are shown as two geniuses, she even outshining him. There is no way in hell that they would be so dumb as to research an illegal medicine/drug in a location not really secret and under control from others. This could potentially ruin Abel and his firm´s sterling reputation, so a no go. The "research of super-viagra" in that cellar is most likely a scam, a stage play to seem similar deviant as many of the other VIP members.
You might remember our discussion on personality imprints, grafts and special training, worthy of secret services and stuff. I theorise Sophia (and Abel to a lesser degree) has several done on her to be able to function undercover in the den of depravity the club is. I think they underestimated what these imprints can and cannot do and what they will do to them over the long run.

What in this discussion on Abel/Sophia is also frequently lost, whatever the exact parameters of their relationship are, Sophia is his chosen successor. Given Abel´s age, he will retire within the next few years and Sophia will become leader of a medical empire. His corporation is depicted in the game as one of the truly major players in medical production and research.

Spoiler

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[Discrepancy]

Hi!
No problem, our discussion lives from the various standpoints we have. My look at it is not simply fanfiction, I ´ll show you why I think so below. As an aside, with the game advancing further and further it becomes clearer that Sophia/Abel are shaped to be a middle path to go on. They certainly are not something akin to Kath and Chuck, opposing them, but also have few qualms to do what they consider necessary. Sophia (we know not much about Abel so far) is one of the few bright lights in the club, but she has a couple of black schlieren on her.

We should not forget that so far the game never shied away from showing consequences of events happening, e.g. Jacob putting Oliver into coma. Until now there has been no pics showing what happens in the cellar, while we have info on some other "delicate" happenings. There is someone kept prisoner in there, that´s for sure, but I doubt that Sophia does much to him/her. The advances of her "Viagra+" are far too quick even for a genius like her (remember Abel and Sophia are in the club not much longer than our hero is) to be made in that cellar with one "lab person".
It is far more likely that the newer versions are coming from Abel and Sophia´s black labs, with additional research info gained from the use in the club with older versions. It is complete BS to believe they research the drug at the club when they have black labs available. Abel and Sophia are shown as two geniuses, she even outshining him. There is no way in hell that they would be so dumb as to research an illegal medicine/drug in a location not really secret and under control from others. This could potentially ruin Abel and his firm´s sterling reputation, so a no go. The "research of super-viagra" in that cellar is most likely a scam, a stage play to seem similar deviant as many of the other VIP members.
You might remember our discussion on personality imprints, grafts and special training, worthy of secret services and stuff. I theorise Sophia (and Abel to a lesser degree) has several done on her to be able to function undercover in the den of depravity the club is. I think they underestimated what these imprints can and cannot do and what they will do to them over the long run.

What in this discussion on Abel/Sophia is also frequently lost, whatever the exact parameters of their relationship are, Sophia is his chosen successor. Given Abel´s age, he will retire within the next few years and Sophia will become leader of a medical empire. His corporation is depicted in the game as one of the truly major players in medical production and research.

Spoiler

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I'm a bit confused here, you think Sophia and Abel did the "viagra+" but just not in the cellar, but on their secret labs? If so how that makes them less "evil" or not?

 

[Turret]

Come on! An half-truth is still a lie, or at least we can't be truly honest to Mina, the truth will be a third option: Tell mina the truth say Ian is cheating on her. I would probably chose the half truth though, but that is still lying om my book

If a half-truth is seen as a lie or not, is very much situation-, context- and location-dependent. I personally would not be overly happy to have to go for the half-truth, but it is better than flat-out lying. Also would let Ian know (which you can to a degree in-game) what I think about having to go for a half-truth for him.

 

[shazamanone]

full save anyone?

 

[HeyZen_]

Hello everyone, I played this game a long time ago and I remember a trio with the MC's friend, I would like to ask if there can be another trio with him at some other time?

 

[FRVN]

Hello everyone, I played this game a long time ago and I remember a trio with the MC's friend, I would like to ask if there can be another trio with him at some other time?

That's the only one with the MC and his friend so far, the only other 3-way in the game at the moment is the MC with 2 girls (Felicia and Mina)

 

[Discrepancy]

Hello everyone, I played this game a long time ago and I remember a trio with the MC's friend, I would like to ask if there can be another trio with him at some other time?

MC can have a threesome with Ian and Rose, MC can have a threesome with Mina and Felicia, there's an almost threesome with MC, Ian and Felicia too.
I assume that was your question

 

[HeyZen_]

Oh great, my left hand is ready , thank you all

 

[Turret]

I'm a bit confused here, you think Sophia and Abel did the "viagra+" but just not in the cellar, but on their secret labs? If so how that makes them less "evil" or not?

Sophia´s invention is not a complete secret and known inside their firm. It is just that "Viagra+" should be made into a pure energy drink instead of a sex medicine. Abel and Sophia play up the angle of them being dissatisfied with the direction the firm wants to take with the new invention. Most development on the drug is done in normal labs, some "special spin" done by Sophia in the black labs - maybe. It is also probable that nearly all development is done in the normal labs, because it is unlikely a major medical developer would not see the use and profit a new type of Viagra could generate. Especially as potent as Sophia´s concoction is.
Sophia is using info gained by their own research and from the uses in the Club. This very fast advance of the drug development, no matter how capable Sophia is, is only possible if there is substantial background research happening. It is possible to get breakthroughs in a mini lab/hell´s kitchen, but it is simply fantasy to think it would be quick advance!

While that might be done partly in black labs for the special versions, a lot or research for it will come from normal places. As mentioned before, that does not make Abel and Sophia glowingly white, they have some black stains on them. I think that is something dawning on at least Sophia, how far they have gone to bring down Chuck and Kath.
I estimate once toppling Chuck and Kath is achieved, a new, better Viagra will be announced to be developed by Abel and Sophia´s firm. Maybe with also announcing Sophia replacing retiring Abel. A new Viagra invented by her would nicely cement her position as new CEO.

Spoiler

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[ename144]

Renaming the MC is one of the most important feature of an AVN, so I lean more on the 99% are renaming them. Some people prefer saying the default name instead of MC in discussions though, even if they renamed.

I almost never use the default name in an AVN, though that's more reflexive habit than it is a need for a specific name. I usually just make up a name that seems appropriate based on what I know starting the game. But renaming the MC becomes very handy if I like the game enough to keep multiple save paths, since that helps keep them separate; in that case, I usually make up a name appropriate to whatever the path is aiming for.

After the last throuple experience Edwin had with Ian, that nearly crippled their friendship after but one week, i'm sure the second time will be a charm. Something something insanity.

I prefer to think of it as degree of difficulty. I'm an elite player, I can pull it off!

I think this is purely fan fiction, sorry Turret Abel and Sophia are testing a rape drug or whatever you want to call it on living humans. Whatever they doing on the basement of the club could be pretty nefarious and worse than anything Chuck or August ever done in the club, maybe not Kathleen hehe.
Your love for Sophia is great, I like her too, but she looks brainwashed on the last update and maybe she's not evil but Abel for sure is. Well at least that's how I saw things there, I might be completely wrong too

Strictly speaking, Abel has made clear in the cut scenes that his project can be much more than a rape drug. Of course, the fact that he's perfectly happy to let it be used as a rape drug does sour me on whatever "greater good" he's actually aiming for.

Jokes aside, the fact that a threesome with Mina and Felicia can only happen if you cross the line seems more like a "fuckboy" route, rather than an attempt to create some kind of serious relationship. And starting a serious relationship as a rebound guy isn't the best idea, although it would be complicated for a porn game. Who knows, maybe TD will surprise us here too, because if it doesn't have any consequences in the end, waiting for Mina and Ian to "officially" break up will be pointless. You'll lose scenes with Mina, the opportunity for a threesome with Felicia or her gaining a self-confidence point and maybe something else.

Most important of all, you lose the opportunity for Mina gloat if she successfully seduces the MC after he rejected Felicia! It's the ultimate sacrifice!