xhib

Newbie
Feb 1, 2019
42
184
I found...something. Maybe. I don't know. You know the green-haired researcher that the MC impersonated in order to infiltrate HERO for Tiffany? Her name is Julie. "Well watch it douchebag! I'm a very important person you know!" she said at the time and I didn't think much more of her.

You know Christie's idiot friend who tried to bully Ella in St Artorius Middle School with green paint? The one who got to see what Ella really is. Her name was Julie. Christie says that Julie was livid when she started hanging out with Ella in both versions, but there's an additional line if you devour Christie (you monster): "We became close friends of after that, having a lot of fun, usually at Julie's expense..." The only difference I can see between what Christie tells you and the more "direct" method.

It's probably someone else. Not many people graduated that year, but there are only three named characters in that flashback and WW didn't have to give Julie a name.

Then in Dead End 37, while "Origin" is running wild, we hear a random "Julie! Watch out!" Assuming it's the green-haired girl and not a third Julie, what was she doing in the Battle of the Diamonds? Wasn't she a researcher?

I know that doesn't amount to much, but I keep wondering: how did Xanthe know what Ella's powers were like at Level 1?

Probably nothing, but possibly something. Thought I'd share.
 

necromater

Well-Known Member
Aug 21, 2018
1,917
7,317
I found...something. Maybe. I don't know. You know the green-haired researcher that the MC impersonated in order to infiltrate HERO for Tiffany? Her name is Julie. "Well watch it douchebag! I'm a very important person you know!" she said at the time and I didn't think much more of her.

You know Christie's idiot friend who tried to bully Ella in St Artorius Middle School with green paint? The one who got to see what Ella really is. Her name was Julie. Christie says that Julie was livid when she started hanging out with Ella in both versions, but there's an additional line if you devour Christie (you monster): "We became close friends of after that, having a lot of fun, usually at Julie's expense..." The only difference I can see between what Christie tells you and the more "direct" method.

It's probably someone else. Not many people graduated that year, but there are only three named characters in that flashback and WW didn't have to give Julie a name.

Then in Dead End 37, while "Origin" is running wild, we hear a random "Julie! Watch out!" Assuming it's the green-haired girl and not a third Julie, what was she doing in the Battle of the Diamonds? Wasn't she a researcher?

I know that doesn't amount to much, but I keep wondering: how did Xanthe know what Ella's powers were like at Level 1?

Probably nothing, but possibly something. Thought I'd share.
Now that's 5 dimensional thinking or maybe i'm just drunk WOW first the child groomer on the grimdank got me like shittttttt wtf? But now this got me like wut? Maybe julie is the name of W.W Bully thats why he names 3 characters like that maybe W.W is a she and her name is ella that would explain why the cunt has more plot armor than a wuxia MC XD
 

ItzSyther

Well-Known Member
Dec 3, 2018
1,650
8,644
I found...something. Maybe. I don't know. You know the green-haired researcher that the MC impersonated in order to infiltrate HERO for Tiffany? Her name is Julie. "Well watch it douchebag! I'm a very important person you know!" she said at the time and I didn't think much more of her.

You know Christie's idiot friend who tried to bully Ella in St Artorius Middle School with green paint? The one who got to see what Ella really is. Her name was Julie. Christie says that Julie was livid when she started hanging out with Ella in both versions, but there's an additional line if you devour Christie (you monster): "We became close friends of after that, having a lot of fun, usually at Julie's expense..." The only difference I can see between what Christie tells you and the more "direct" method.

It's probably someone else. Not many people graduated that year, but there are only three named characters in that flashback and WW didn't have to give Julie a name.

Then in Dead End 37, while "Origin" is running wild, we hear a random "Julie! Watch out!" Assuming it's the green-haired girl and not a third Julie, what was she doing in the Battle of the Diamonds? Wasn't she a researcher?

I know that doesn't amount to much, but I keep wondering: how did Xanthe know what Ella's powers were like at Level 1?

Probably nothing, but possibly something. Thought I'd share.
You onto something there mah boi. Now she's just some ol minor character (for now) but if I remember right unlike most minor characters we see (be they male or female) she has a face that isn't obscured by a shadow of some sort. Why give her a more detailed face than usual for a minor character if not to bring her back later on. Now that's just goin off the face thing, could be wrong and weird just wanted to put more effort into a one off character.
 

vogelbeest

Engaged Member
Jan 9, 2021
2,007
2,867
I know that doesn't amount to much, but I keep wondering: how did Xanthe know what Ella's powers were like at Level 1?

Probably nothing, but possibly something. Thought I'd share.
Xanthe could easily have been monitoring Ella, or they knew from Zack... The importance of that information is Ella has been on HERO's radar for a long time...

As for the Julie's : it could very well be one and the same person... But it could be just coincidence...
I think we should expect the possibility the St. Arturius Massacre is just a cover-up...
Only two surviving, Ella and Christie, so we only have her eyewitness report of what happened to Ella before...

We know MC does not remember how his eyes got scarred, we know Christie tells us what she remembers, her story is the same if we devour her... A superhuman that can change or erase memories isn't that far fetched...
Ella mentions somewhere she is "sort of" orphan too...

But until we get the complete story, it's just a lot speculation, the St. Arturius Massacre, MC's eyes and mother, Zack Zaman's team and their defeat, Ella and MC being the only 2 survivors of some group and Ella watching MC all these years. In some way they're connected, we just don't know how....
 

RonaldGrand6969

Active Member
Aug 30, 2019
933
3,543
You onto something there mah boi. Now she's just some ol minor character (for now) but if I remember right unlike most minor characters we see (be they male or female) she has a face that isn't obscured by a shadow of some sort. Why give her a more detailed face than usual for a minor character if not to bring her back later on. Now that's just goin off the face thing, could be wrong and weird just wanted to put more effort into a one off character.
I think it adds detail, I respect authors a hell of a lot more for referencing little detail wayyyy back so if I ever reread I can be like: "Oh shit! You didn't have to but that's cool you didn't forget about that character!" Regardless if it's major or not.

It's like when action movies sometimes obey the laws of physics or respect injuries, it's a small thing in the grand scheme, but when it DOES appear is appreciated none the less.

Edit: Also OF COURSE out of ALLL the students that died that year the ONE person who bullied Ella initially survived. It's like if Thanos snapped away half the universe and ALLLLL of the Infinity War cast survived to go kick his ass immediately :LUL:
 

RonaldGrand6969

Active Member
Aug 30, 2019
933
3,543
Xanthe could easily have been monitoring Ella, or they knew from Zack... The importance of that information is Ella has been on HERO's radar for a long time...

As for the Julie's : it could very well be one and the same person... But it could be just coincidence...
I think we should expect the possibility the St. Arturius Massacre is just a cover-up...
Only two surviving, Ella and Christie, so we only have her eyewitness report of what happened to Ella before...

We know MC does not remember how his eyes got scarred, we know Christie tells us what she remembers, her story is the same if we devour her... A superhuman that can change or erase memories isn't that far fetched...
Ella mentions somewhere she is "sort of" orphan too...

But until we get the complete story, it's just a lot speculation, the St. Arturius Massacre, MC's eyes and mother, Zack Zaman's team and their defeat, Ella and MC being the only 2 survivors of some group and Ella watching MC all these years. In some way they're connected, we just don't know how....
1. I was wagering it was just due to influence. About the same way Dexter knows the MC's Dad. Of course they do, they are a RICH, SECRET, TOP OF THE LINE TECH company with an monopoly on SUPERPOWERS, why wouldn't they know about the Superhuman potentially involved in the slaughter of an ENTIRE Middle School Grad Ceremony or a shady guy that's poking his nose in everyone's business. Keep in mind this is the same group that made the world government bend over in less than a day.

3. Ya I'll bet Deryl's scrotum (cause I don't care about that) that upon our runaway we met up with Ella amongst HER also run away gap. I can't remember if we got the scars BEFORE or AFTER the run away. But if it's the former I wager it had something to do with how we found our Mom, and if it's the latter I wager it had something to do with Ella, maybe she did, or a monster attack, and she just wiped out memories of it. There's no telling what she could do at Lvl 4 but if at 3 like we are right now we can flood memories or even restore them without even having to touch our victims, who knows, it would explain why if we DID meet previously why we have no recollection. Just odd that she would kill us (actual beginning of our relation) if she was so invested in us (personally) at the "start" (gap) of our relationship...

4. I'm betting on:
-MC eyes: Monster attack (rather than Ella, not that it's impossible to be her, but those scars just seem very specific)
-The Massacre: Monster Attack (unless it was Ella vs another Superhuman potentially? I doubt it was JUST her killing all of them out of revenge and MISSING Julie. She seems above that and more goal oriented)
-MC Ella Connection: Month gap runaway orphanage (or she was just REALLLLLLY invested in us as a Superhuman candidate, but she's already mentioned we weren't on the top of her list. I have a feeling we are just a BACKUP for her plan in case she fails, which is why she's so adamant about training us personally rather than trying to manipulate us for a goal like Deryl or Jake, at least now; before I think we were just a vessel for maybe whatever she is summoning whether that be the Arbiter or not, but it still doesn't explain WHY she would do it, as I feel the Monsters aren't really here for our BEST INTERESTS).



Sidenote: How did Ella get SO STRONG SO FAST? If she really did get her powers amongst our matching Middle School days and it WASN'T a time travel replacement scenario; how on god's green earth did she obtain Lvl 4 in only a couple of years? I mean Bernhardt and Malik have been Lvl 5 for a while, but I don't think they've been that way for 80+ years, they are just that old, who knows when they ACTUALLY hit Lvl 5 within that range. Out of all the Superhumans we've seen, the only one with faster natural growth is us (doing it all within like 3 months? Maybe 2? To get to Lvl 3, sheesh) but Ella is on another level. The only downside is using the serum to get to 5, but from 1 to 4 in sayyy, 11 to 13 and what she's now 18 20? Not a lot of time at all consider some people spend their whole lives just trying to get to 3 alone...
 
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Xenrir

Newbie
Jun 17, 2017
18
33
Had this on my backlog, and just finished reading what there is so far - holy fuck, what a RIDE.
I just sat here for nearly 20 hours straight reading. No regrets.

I've only done a 0 Corruption run so far, and only saw a few dead ends, which I plan on hunting down during my high corruption run through, so my thoughts on the game are from that viewpoint.
I came in without knowing what to expect, and ended up getting a really interesting story with actual in-universe lore that has me asking questions about what the fuck is going on, and eagerly awaiting seeing what transpires in future updates, as well as what else I'm gonna learn from the high corruption run and dead ends.

Really curious to see where things are going after that cliffhanger, and the dev note makes me question how big that update actually was, since I assume it included the H.E.R.O mission and Deryl fight and everything after, which alone is massive. Curious to see that the MC is going to be working with Nyx, I know it's not him being assigned to a team or anything, but I'd actually expected that he'd be spending more time with Team Lucifer if anything, since he and Malik get on really well, and knows most of the team.

As for the lore stuff, the main thing that actually caught my attention is something pretty innocuous - Henri. The fact that he went from level 1 to level 5 within a week is absolute insanity, and having a piece of info like that is a really neat choice. It's either going to fade into the background as a red herring, or set something up later on - like a rapid evolution to level 5 upon reaching 4.

Though, I'm not too sure what else the MC can really gain in regards to powers at this point. Many of the other H.E.R.O members have powers so much more devastating than anything a shapeshifter can do, it feels a bit like the MC is doomed to be forever hopelessly outclassed in terms of the breadth or capability of their arsenal. A shapeshifter isn't going to be teleporting around, or teleporting people to the sun for instance, and that's not even getting into Malik and the other captains.

Still, we got to knock up a monster mommy, and as impossible as it is, I do wish we get her as part of the harem. Hell, she even gave us some lore bombs. What a nice lady.
On another note, MC being one of the only dudes that can safely fuck Lexi is hilarious. Gib Lexi route.

Hope some of the other old characters receive sprite updates like Lexi, the MC and some of them could really use one.

I eagerly await getting to kill Cole and Charlie, and hope it is magnificently brutal.

In closing:
10/10, GOTY.
 
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DrakoGhoul

Engaged Member
Jul 13, 2018
3,060
10,491
1. I was wagering it was just due to influence. About the same way Dexter knows the MC's Dad. Of course they do, they are a RICH, SECRET, TOP OF THE LINE TECH company with an monopoly on SUPERPOWERS, why wouldn't they know about the Superhuman potentially involved in the slaughter of an ENTIRE Middle School Grad Ceremony or a shady guy that's poking his nose in everyone's business. Keep in mind this is the same group that made the world government bend over in less than a day.

3. Ya I'll bet Deryl's scrotum (cause I don't care about that) that upon our runaway we met up with Ella amongst HER also run away gap. I can't remember if we got the scars BEFORE or AFTER the run away. But if it's the former I wager it had something to do with how we found our Mom, and if it's the latter I wager it had something to do with Ella, maybe she did, or a monster attack, and she just wiped out memories of it. There's no telling what she could do at Lvl 4 but if at 3 like we are right now we can flood memories or even restore them without even having to touch our victims, who knows, it would explain why if we DID meet previously why we have no recollection. Just odd that she would kill us (actual beginning of our relation) if she was so invested in us (personally) at the "start" (gap) of our relationship...

4. I'm betting on:
-MC eyes: Monster attack (rather than Ella, not that it's impossible to be her, but those scars just seem very specific)
-The Massacre: Monster Attack (unless it was Ella vs another Superhuman potentially? I doubt it was JUST her killing all of them out of revenge and MISSING Julie. She seems above that and more goal oriented)
-MC Ella Connection: Month gap runaway orphanage (or she was just REALLLLLLY invested in us as a Superhuman candidate, but she's already mentioned we weren't on the top of her list. I have a feeling we are just a BACKUP for her plan in case she fails, which is why she's so adamant about training us personally rather than trying to manipulate us for a goal like Deryl or Jake, at least now; before I think we were just a vessel for maybe whatever she is summoning whether that be the Arbiter or not, but it still doesn't explain WHY she would do it, as I feel the Monsters aren't really here for our BEST INTERESTS).



Sidenote: How did Ella get SO STRONG SO FAST? If she really did get her powers amongst our matching Middle School days and it WASN'T a time travel replacement scenario; how on god's green earth did she obtain Lvl 4 in only a couple of years? I mean Bernhardt and Malik have been Lvl 5 for a while, but I don't think they've been that way for 80+ years, they are just that old, who knows when they ACTUALLY hit Lvl 5 within that range. Out of all the Superhumans we've seen, the only one with faster natural growth is us (doing it all within like 3 months? Maybe 2? To get to Lvl 3, sheesh) but Ella is on another level. The only downside is using the serum to get to 5, but from 1 to 4 in sayyy, 11 to 13 and what she's now 18 20? Not a lot of time at all consider some people spend their whole lives just trying to get to 3 alone...
Is it really that surprising though? We know that those who survive the infection at younger ages are typically the most gifted and she's a spawn of the 3rd Apostle. Ella was turned at 14 and probably reached her 3rd Evolution by 15, if she progressed similarly to the MC. So some time passed that in the 6 years leading up to the start of the game she's reached level 4 and remained there. She's 21 currently, maybe about to be 22. When laid out like that, it's impressive but not shocking with what we know.

She's also not exactly unique in that aspect, besides surviving the infection at a young age. Lexi, for example, was turned around the same time at 23 and became level 4 at an unknown amount of time before becoming level 5 at 28, currently. Both got infected 5 to 6 years ago(Ella 14 and Lexi 23) and both reached level 4, to now level 5, in that span of time(Ella 21 and Lexi 28 now).

The current ridiculous person is actually Henri, honestly. He skipped all the way to his 5th Evolution in a week on accident from level 1(?). We don't exactly know the time table from when he got infected to that event happening but we do know he reached it naturally and has been at it for some decades like Malik and Bernhardt.

All that said, MC's growth is still fast. It's been almost a year worth of time in game and he's already reached his 3rd level, though he did it "Artificially". With this update, we also learned that the 5th Evolution is extremely hard to reach naturally. Which would explain why everyone seems to get stuck at their 4th, and it keeps them there for years. Even Captains from HERO were stuck there until Xanthe developed the serum. That means people like Nyx, Zack and Lucius were level 4 for decades. Ella would've likely shared the same fate as well, if she didn't steal the serum.

So, while what Ella and the MC did was impressive, they're not the sole people progressing fast and it seems reasonable, in verse, when looking at characters like Lexi and so on.
 

RonaldGrand6969

Active Member
Aug 30, 2019
933
3,543
Is it really that surprising though? We know that those who survive the infection at younger ages are typically the most gifted and she's a spawn of the 3rd Apostle. Ella was turned at 14 and probably reached her 3rd Evolution by 15, if she progressed similarly to the MC. So some time passed that in the 6 years leading up to the start of the game she's reached level 4 and remained there. She's 21 currently, maybe about to be 22. When laid out like that, it's impressive but not shocking with what we know.

She's also not exactly unique in that aspect, besides surviving the infection at a young age. Lexi, for example, was turned around the same time at 23 and became level 4 at an unknown amount of time before becoming level 5 at 28, currently. Both got infected 5 to 6 years ago(Ella 14 and Lexi 23) and both reached level 4, to now level 5, in that span of time(Ella 21 and Lexi 28 now).

The current ridiculous person is actually Henri, honestly. He skipped all the way to his 5th Evolution in a week on accident from level 1(?). We don't exactly know the time table from when he got infected to that event happening but we do know he reached it naturally and has been at it for some decades like Malik and Bernhardt.

All that said, MC's growth is still fast. It's been almost a year worth of time in game and he's already reached his 3rd level, though he did it "Artificially". With this update, we also learned that the 5th Evolution is extremely hard to reach naturally. Which would explain why everyone seems to get stuck at their 4th, and it keeps them there for years. Even Captains from HERO were stuck there until Xanthe developed the serum. That means people like Nyx, Zack and Lucius were level 4 for decades. Ella would've likely shared the same fate as well, if she didn't steal the serum.

So, while what Ella and the MC did was impressive, they're not the sole people progressing fast and it seems reasonable, in verse, when looking at characters like Lexi and so on.
Fuck I gotta pay attention, I totally forgot about Henri tho that's true he must REALLY have a deep connection with his Apostle source.

I do wonder about how Evolutions ACTUALLY work though. I mean it seems like there is a multitude of factors that can play into evolving, but the only one that is "questionable" is Xanthe's serum route.



So I believe from what I remember on how one Evolves is:

1. Pushing yourself to your limits, even to the brink of death.
-Source: Ella, Teacher, Xanthe.
-Examples: Alice Lvl 2

2. Allowing a "feeling" to overtake you? At the risk of monsterfying.
-Source: Ella, Xanthe.
-Examples: Henri? Lvl 1-5, MC (Almost)

3. Consuming monster material, at the risk of being overtaken.
-Source: Xanthe, The Eye (3rd&4th Arbiter)
-Examples: MC Lvl 3

4. Having help from your source Apostle and/or Arbiter.
-Source: The Eye (3rd&4th Arbiter)
-Examples: MC Lvl 2-3, Henri? Lvl 1-5

5. (Artificial) Xanthe's Serum, at the risk of your body not handling it only it seems (RIDICULOUSLY OP), and MAYBE severing your favoritism from your source Apostle and/or Arbiter.
-Source: Xanthe, Teacher
-Examples: Lexi Lvl 5, Ella Lvl 5, Clark Lvl 5, Nicolette Lvl 5, Lisa Lvl 5, Nyx? Lvl 5, Lucius? Lvl 5, etc. (Save for Malik, Bernhardt, and Henri)

6. (Artificial?) Rebis making.
-Source: Deryl, Del, Rebis Monster
-Examples: Deryl Lvl 1-3 (Rigged and STILL incomplete)



I don't know if you can just "wake up" one day and evolve so calling the MC's Evolvtion "Artificial" I don't think would be the right term, he did it naturally at the risk of being consumed by monster material, definitely not something you can do every Saturday night.

I do wonder if that's what makes Malik, Bernhardt, and Henri so strong; due to evolving "naturally" throughout their entire process as nature intended. It does make me wonder if Lvl 5 is a SELECTIVE evolution done through only the will of the superhuman's source Apostle or even Arbiter, much like the MC's favoritism by the 3rd&4th Arbiter. They can also speak monster, which makes me wonder if they are being groomed as allies? For when they descend on the Earth, rather than vessels for the Arbiters. Something tells me Malik or even Bernhardt wouldn't be very accepting of giving up their free will to be essentially a puppet, they like having their OWN power. Even if Bernhardt's goal aligned by culling the human populace or something, Malik FOR SURE wouldn't be on board with enslaving or even annihilating the human race.

So if we do go by that theory, what made Malik, this kind hearted individual favorited by a race that wants lives weaker than them gone? Or Bernhardt, who wants the SUPERHUMAN race rather than Monster race to thrive. We know Henri's was accidental, so maybe they just liked his nature or something to do with how he would react to scenarios presented in the future by their kind.

But even below Lvl 5 people seem to get "visions" from their monster parent and even their source Apostles like Alice, but I did notice Alice wasn't contacted by the Arbiter of her source pair, then again; she WASN'T turned by her source Apostle, much less by a pair of them like we were.

We do know CORRUPTION also plays a role, which is odd because Malik doesn't strike me as the type, and I'm not sure if Bernhardt is eating monsters, he seems to despise them too. But Ella for instance casually talks to the 3rd or 4th, while the MC also has dreams speaking to them. I think the crazy part about the MC in particular though is we don't JUST dream about our parent monsters, rather about monsters we haven't even seen before like Danica's or Oscar's.

I dunno, just thought I'd throw it all out there, lemme know if I missed anything.
 
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DrakoGhoul

Engaged Member
Jul 13, 2018
3,060
10,491
Fuck I gotta pay attention, I totally forgot about Henri tho that's true he must REALLY have a deep connection with his Apostle source.

I do wonder about how Evolutions ACTUALLY work though. I mean it seems like there is a multitude of factors that can play into evolving, but the only one that is "questionable" is Xanthe's serum route.



So I believe from what I remember on how one Evolves is:

1. Pushing yourself to your limits, even to the brink of death.
-Source: Ella, Teacher, Xanthe.
-Examples: Alice Lvl 2

2. Allowing a "feeling" to overtake you? At the risk of monsterfying.
-Source: Ella, Xanthe.
-Examples: Henri? Lvl 1-5, MC (Almost)

3. Consuming monster material, at the risk of being overtaken.
-Source: Xanthe, The Eye (3rd&4th Arbiter)
-Examples: MC Lvl 3

4. Having help from your source Apostle and/or Arbiter.
-Source: The Eye (3rd&4th Arbiter)
-Examples: MC Lvl 2-3, Henri? Lvl 1-5

5. (Artificial) Xanthe's Serum, at the risk of your body not handling it only it seems (RIDICULOUSLY OP), and MAYBE severing your favoritism from your source Apostle and/or Arbiter.
-Source: Xanthe, Teacher
-Examples: Lexi Lvl 5, Ella Lvl 5, Clark Lvl 5, Nicolette Lvl 5, Lisa Lvl 5, Nyx? Lvl 5, Lucius? Lvl 5, etc. (Save for Malik, Bernhardt, and Henri)

6. (Artificial?) Rebis making.
-Source: Deryl, Del, Rebis Monster
-Examples: Deryl Lvl 1-3 (Rigged and STILL incomplete)



I don't know if you can just "wake up" one day and evolve so calling the MC's Evolvtion "Artificial" I don't think would be the right term, he did it naturally at the risk of being consumed by monster material, definitely not something you can do every Saturday night.

I do wonder if that's what makes Malik, Bernhardt, and Henri so strong; due to evolving "naturally" throughout their entire process as nature intended. It does make me wonder if Lvl 5 is a SELECTIVE evolution done through only the will of the superhuman's source Apostle or even Arbiter, much like the MC's favoritism by the 3rd&4th Arbiter. They can also speak monster, which makes me wonder if they are being groomed as allies? For when they descend on the Earth, rather than vessels for the Arbiters. Something tells me Malik or even Bernhardt wouldn't be very accepting of giving up their free will to be essentially a puppet, they like having their OWN power. Even if Bernhardt's goal aligned by culling the human populace or something, Malik FOR SURE wouldn't be on board with enslaving or even annihilating the human race.

So if we do go by that theory, what made Malik, this kind hearted individual favorited by a race that wants lives weaker than them gone? Or Bernhardt, who wants the SUPERHUMAN race rather than Monster race to thrive. We know Henri's was accidental, so maybe they just liked his nature or something to do with how he would react to scenarios presented in the future by their kind.

But even below Lvl 5 people seem to get "visions" from their monster parent and even their source Apostles like Alice, but I did notice Alice wasn't contacted by the Arbiter of her source pair, then again; she WASN'T turned by her source Apostle, much less by a pair of them like we were.

We do know CORRUPTION also plays a role, which is odd because Malik doesn't strike me as the type, and I'm not sure if Bernhardt is eating monsters, he seems to despise them too. But Ella for instance casually talks to the 3rd or 4th, while the MC also has dreams speaking to them. I think the crazy part about the MC in particular though is we don't JUST dream about our parent monsters, rather about monsters we haven't even seen before like Danica's or Oscar's.

I dunno, just thought I'd throw it all out there, lemme know if I missed anything.
I didn't call MC's evolution artificial, Xanthe did. That's why I put "artificially" because that's what Xanthe believes.

For me personally, I think the MC evolved naturally and the reason why is because of the Origin itself. I'm of the belief that the Origin used the surrounding monster energy to wake up fully and pulled the MC to his realm. After they had their little talk, he triggered the evolution itself for the MC. We already know he has the power to push him beyond Level 5 by being reborn, so a jump to level 3 from level 2 seems like minuscule task by him in comparison.

Only problem with my thoughts here is the different lingering monster energy that remained inside of the MC. It was still left over after he evolved so that puts a hole im my conclusion. Maybe it was used as a cover but meh. It most likely was just the monster material that triggered it and I'm just thinking of any reason for my MC to still be a purist with Evolution.
 

bloodaxis

Member
Sep 1, 2017
226
398
I didn't call MC's evolution artificial, Xanthe did. That's why I put "artificially" because that's what Xanthe believes.

For me personally, I think the MC evolved naturally and the reason why is because of the Origin itself. I'm of the belief that the Origin used the surrounding monster energy to wake up fully and pulled the MC to his realm. After they had their little talk, he triggered the evolution itself for the MC. We already know he has the power to push him beyond Level 5 by being reborn, so a jump to level 3 from level 2 seems like minuscule task by him in comparison.

Only problem with my thoughts here is the different lingering monster energy that remained inside of the MC. It was still left over after he evolved so that puts a hole im my conclusion. Maybe it was used as a cover but meh. It most likely was just the monster material that triggered it and I'm just thinking of any reason for my MC to still be a purist with Evolution.
I wasn't happy with his evolution being called artificial either so I just headcanoned it as our arbiter using the material available to facilitate it, rather than us just haphazardly evolving, similar to what you're thinking. I'll similarly be annoyed a bit if the mc ever ends up using one of those serums, it just feels like those serums don't evolve you in a way that conforms with the apostles/arbiters plans because you take the challenge and ordeal out of the equation. Mostly pure headcanon on my part but will be interesting to see what's actually going to be happening nonetheless.
 

RonaldGrand6969

Active Member
Aug 30, 2019
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I wasn't happy with his evolution being called artificial either so I just headcanoned it as our arbiter using the material available to facilitate it, rather than us just haphazardly evolving, similar to what you're thinking. I'll similarly be annoyed a bit if the mc ever ends up using one of those serums, it just feels like those serums don't evolve you in a way that conforms with the apostles/arbiters plans because you take the challenge and ordeal out of the equation. Mostly pure headcanon on my part but will be interesting to see what's actually going to be happening nonetheless.
I mean Xanthe's word isn't divine mandate just because he's smart. If pushing yourself to the absolute brink of death is the only "legit" way to evolve, everyone has failed MISERABLY save for Alice, but even then was contacted by her source Apostle. So if everyone has a small vision during their evolution process then the Arbiter "interfering" and acknowledging our effort is still legit. Consider we were practically near death upon even entering Deryl and eating him, I'm pretty sure it's even said that we were essentially dead and "reborn" (not in the literal sense) but our Evolution kind of healed us about the same way Deryl "evolved" when merging his bodies to fight us head on again. You could argue the same thing happened with Klaus, but it's like everyone expects to be put into a position like Valravn every other week and just evolve, but it doesn't work like that.

I say Xanthe's Serum is the only artificial way to evolve because it is LITERALLY by definition ARTIFICIAL, man made, a product. Rather than just getting a "promotion" from a literal god like entity that is deeply connected with your superpower and "nature". If that isn't natural, I don't know what is.
 
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Blizzard99

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Feb 11, 2021
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I dunno why we are considering MC's evolution as artificial. Sure, he didn't go by the traditional approach of killing monsters and devouring them one by one. But, Deryl had done half of the work for him. He defeated (sorta) a monster-chimera in the form of Deryl and devoured the monster cells to achieve his evolution. Perhaps, he might've failed in the evolution if he was a regular superhuman like Jake rather than the being the heir of the Arbiter and all that. But, that is just a part of MC's main character energy.
 

vogelbeest

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Jan 9, 2021
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1. Pushing yourself to your limits, even to the brink of death.
-Source: Ella, Teacher, Xanthe.
-Examples: Alice Lvl 2
MC's evolutions seem to be much like that too... even the time he suppressed evolving fits...
But the time he was cut in half, he didn't evolve and neither did he after the fight with Kenny, while both times he was out for a week due to exhaustion. And after his last evolution he was as fit as the energiser bunny....

From that perspective it could be Xanthe was somewhat correct in assuming MC's last evolution was artificial. But it seems logical it's probably more like a catalyst then the reason for happening. MC's memory powers were in overdrive, even after the first part of the fight with Deryl was over, he kept reading memories and processing them, even if just mostly subconscious...

Deryl has been in that combined many monster form(s) state for a long time. His blood was similar to Xanthe's serum all that time too, yet he did not evolve until after he lost the fight. He was resurrected by Rebis, it wasn't even a standard evolution. Monsterfication might be a factor, but i wonder how his blood is now he rejoined with the Deryl proxy..



she WASN'T turned by her source Apostle, much less by a pair of them like we were.
It seems most of the Apostles don't operate together, the 3th and 4th do, but it's mostly the Body doing the infections...
 
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ItzSyther

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Dec 3, 2018
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3. Consuming monster material, at the risk of being overtaken.
-Source: Xanthe, The Eye (3rd&4th Arbiter)
-Examples: MC Lvl 3
Would another example be the MC would evolving again via a bad end by him eating monsterified Kenny and being under the control of the same thing that had Kenny (Oil Mommy or whatever it was)...but that was probably just him falling into monsterification rather than evolving I think I recall him mentioning a feeling when eating Kenny so this might fall under option 2 rather than 3 even if it was a case of evolution.
 
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necromater

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Aug 21, 2018
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LOL so we get monster cooties XD and then the Thing like virus reforms our body so now we know; the original dies so the Superhuman versión takes it's place that's kind of a let down but it makes sense we kind of take the MC place now that's Schrödinger's Cat like shit .
 
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devilsdetails

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Jun 18, 2018
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I don't think anything in the game has really said that artificial (forced) evolutions are any better or worse than a natural one. So whether or not you evolve that way seems to have no bearing on the final product. The only exception seems to be the final Level 5 evolution. Clark says that you need to "seek it out" and meet particular requirements before it can happen and it carries a high risk of monsterification. The formula just takes that risk away. It's possible that Bernhard, Malik, and Henri are considered the most powerful/dangerous because of both their raw stats AND the versatility of approach their powers give them against most situations.
Just hypothetically: Bernhard's massive range, speed, and AOE could mean that he matches up very well against all/most of the other heavies at HERO in general. Coupled with his decades of experience and the fine control of his powers he has he'd just generally be a nightmare to take on. Might have nothing to do with him being a natural evo vs the others' artificially induced ones.
 

ItzSyther

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Dec 3, 2018
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I don't think anything in the game has really said that artificial (forced) evolutions are any better or worse than a natural one. So whether or not you evolve that way seems to have no bearing on the final product. The only exception seems to be the final Level 5 evolution. Clark says that you need to "seek it out" and meet particular requirements before it can happen and it carries a high risk of monsterification. The formula just takes that risk away. It's possible that Bernhard, Malik, and Henri are considered the most powerful/dangerous because of both their raw stats AND the versatility of approach their powers give them against most situations.
Just hypothetically: Bernhard's massive range, speed, and AOE could mean that he matches up very well against all/most of the other heavies at HERO in general. Coupled with his decades of experience and the fine control of his powers he has he'd just generally be a nightmare to take on. Might have nothing to do with him being a natural evo vs the others' artificially induced ones.
The only time we see an issue or rather, a negative with forced evolution is with the lower quality serum. Do correct me if I'm wrong but Xanthe purposely gave Klaus a lower quality version of what he gave Michael and others who take it. I recall Klaus's face taking a more monster-ish look after using the serum.

I don't think he evolved from that, more or less he just got a power up but it changed his appearance a bit (mostly in his face) which makes me wonder if he did evolve would he undergo monsterification?

This scene in particular confirms Xanthe gave Klaus a lesser variant of what he usually gives (convo between Nico and him)
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Ddlc

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Jun 22, 2017
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The only time we see an issue or rather, a negative with forced evolution is with the lower quality serum. Do correct me if I'm wrong but Xanthe purposely gave Klaus a lower quality version of what he gave Michael and others who take it. I recall Klaus's face taking a more monster-ish look after using the serum.

I don't think he evolved from that, more or less he just got a power up but it changed his appearance a bit (mostly in his face) which makes me wonder if he did evolve would he undergo monsterification?
Nico confirmed that the serum Xanthe gave to Klaus was not the real thing, i also think that wasn't really an evolution but maybe a temporary monsterfication, sadly we have no means to know if the effects were permanent since Klaus died soon after.
 

ItzSyther

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Dec 3, 2018
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Nico confirmed that the serum Xanthe gave to Klaus was not the real thing, i also think that wasn't really an evolution but maybe a temporary monsterfication, sadly we have no means to know if the effects were permanent since Klaus died soon after.
Truly a damn shame we won't know if it was temporary or not. Perhaps we'll see the fake serum once more so we can get a confirmation if it's temporary or not.
 
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