VN Ren'Py Abandoned The City of Promise [Ch.1 Remake Bugfix] [TGO Entertainment]

[juan palote]

Things require time for being made properly

i'm trying to send the dev as much feedback as i can...i sent some opinions i found here in his DM-box...when he'll read them? i don't know, i don't know his timezone, as far as i know he may be sleeping XD

Again, i dont want to be overly negative with the Dev which is clearly learning, but in order to change, you need to stop going in the wrong direction.

Last update went even further down the rabbit hole instead of trying to get out. MC keeps being Beta, as much as before. The only prospect we have is changing mistresses, from Susan/Samantha to Hacker/Informant.

And the minigame gameplay situation keep going in the same direction.

So sure, changes need time, but they also need to start steering the wheels, otherwise we will keep going in the same direction.

 

[Demoness_Kiss]

Again, i dont want to be overly negative with the Dev which is clearly learning, but in order to change, you need to stop going in the wrong direction.

Last update went even further down the rabbit hole instead of trying to get out. MC keeps being Beta, as much as before. The only prospect we have is changing mistresses, from Susan/Samantha to Hacker/Informant.

And the minigame gameplay situation keep going in the same direction.

So sure, changes need time, but they also need to start steering the wheels, otherwise we will keep going in the same direction.

About the minigames, you would prefer a classic sandbox?XD where you must do things for hours?in exchange for one sex scenes?XD

also i believe that his attitude(i refuse to call it beta, because so far it feels more like "confused guy still figuring out some stuff" <- aside for his reactions to the drugging and the cheap excuses from family) will change once he hits the Ceremony...

 

[juan palote]

About the minigames, you would prefer a classic sandbox?XD where you must do things for hours?in exchange for one sex scenes?XD

also i believe that his attitude(i refuse to call it beta, because so far it feels more like "confused guy still figuring out some stuff" <- aside for his reactions to the drugging and the cheap excuses from family) will change once he hits the Ceremony...

Honestly, i think an autosolve like the pole one for those that dont want to deal with them would be enough. With sandbox i would just instantly leave of course.

About the personality, he isnt confused, he is literally just following orders. The whole game, he did nothing other than follow someone's orders and accepting everything like a sheep. You can get anything more Beta than that.

 

[clowns234]

Honestly, i think an autosolve like the pole one for those that dont want to deal with them would be enough. With sandbox i would just instantly leave of course.

About the personality, he isnt confused, he is literally just following orders. The whole game, he did nothing other than follow someone's orders and accepting everything like a sheep. You can get anything more Beta than that.

I've known a lot of kids who blindly follow what their parents (or other people in authority) tell them. I don't find a 'barely 18' kid acting like this that out of the ordinary.
I still believe the MC will be the hero in the end.

 

[juan palote]

I've known a lot of kids who blindly follow what their parents (or other people in authority) tell them. I don't find a 'barely 18' kid acting like this that out of the ordinary.
I still believe the MC will be the hero in the end.

Yes, i know they exist, they have beta personalities. I dont think its good as an MC of a story though and those people that blindly follow what others do very rarely overcome that to be in positions of leadership (which you would kind of need to be the hero of a story like the one we have)

 

[Sarkasmus]

About the minigames, you would prefer a classic sandbox?XD where you must do things for hours?in exchange for one sex scenes?XD

also i believe that his attitude(i refuse to call it beta, because so far it feels more like "confused guy still figuring out some stuff" <- aside for his reactions to the drugging and the cheap excuses from family) will change once he hits the Ceremony...

Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing.
Look at the posts made. How ANGRY people get after playing. Look at how NTR pisses most players off. Players react to what happens to their MCs, as they would want to react if it happened to them.

So I didn't mind the minigames that much...as for being minigames. The problem is their purpose and most of all: Context.
The games with Susan are about learning about her, getting closer to her and then create a bond with her. Problem was, I didn't WANT to get closer to her since I still felt betrayed and was still waiting for some form of proper apology to make it up to ME. They don't deserve that yet.
What we get instead is MC making them do what they wanted from the very beginning: Theach him how to properly please them. The MC may have forgiven her quickly, since he is just an inexperienced teenager who only has those two people in his life. But I'm not... I would rather leave the house.
And that made the Minigames with the other three just so much worse.
With them, it wasn't even about getting closer to them anymore (if I wanted or not). It was just a collection of tedious tasks with no relation to their emotions. Do that task right, and at the end you get your treat for being a good boy. But I didn't WANT to do these tasks for them either, since I was STILL feeling betrayed and STILL waiting for my apology. And the longer I played, the more of their lies got exposed which is NEVER acknowledged. And all the love and affection I have to give them is never returned by them.

I'm feeling betrayed and was physically hurt by them, yet for some rason, I still have to care for their wellbeing.
If THEY feel hurt (e.g. if you choose on of them three times in a row) they will guilt-trip me and leave the house!

And what does MC get in return? What's his reward?
After doing everything they wanted and satisfying on their terms while keeping all of their kinks in mind... we get a blowjob. But did they ask if that's even what MC wants? Did they care if he liked it the way they did it? And at the end, he got to finish however way they felt comfortable with. You know... men have feelings to. Would have been nice, if they somehow considered HIS wishes for once. Especially after they just made him (us) jump through loops to get what THEY wanted.
But for me, it's too late. I hate them all with a passion. If the dev doesn't put a redemption-ark into the first chapter, nothing that will come afterwards could justify their behavior retroactively.

 

[Demoness_Kiss]

Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing.
Look at the posts made. How ANGRY people get after playing. Look at how NTR pisses most players off. Players react to what happens to their MCs, as they would want to react if it happened to them.

So I didn't mind the minigames that much...as for being minigames. The problem is their purpose and most of all: Context.
The games with Susan are about learning about her, getting closer to her and then create a bond with her. Problem was, I didn't WANT to get closer to her since I still felt betrayed and was still waiting for some form of proper apology to make it up to ME. They don't deserve that yet.
What we get instead is MC making them do what they wanted from the very beginning: Theach him how to properly please them. The MC may have forgiven her quickly, since he is just an inexperienced teenager who only has those two people in his life. But I'm not... I would rather leave the house.
And that made the Minigames with the other three just so much worse.
With them, it wasn't even about getting closer to them anymore (if I wanted or not). It was just a collection of tedious tasks with no relation to their emotions. Do that task right, and at the end you get your treat for being a good boy. But I didn't WANT to do these tasks for them either, since I was STILL feeling betrayed and STILL waiting for my apology. And the longer I played, the more of their lies got exposed which is NEVER acknowledged. And all the love and affection I have to give them is never returned by them.

I'm feeling betrayed and was physically hurt by them, yet for some rason, I still have to care for their wellbeing.
If THEY feel hurt (e.g. if you choose on of them three times in a row) they will guilt-trip me and leave the house!

And what does MC get in return? What's his reward?
After doing everything they wanted and satisfying on their terms while keeping all of their kinks in mind... we get a blowjob. But did they ask if that's even what MC wants? Did they care if he liked it the way they did it? And at the end, he got to finish however way they felt comfortable with. You know... men have feelings to. Would have been nice, if they somehow considered HIS wishes for once. Especially after they just made him (us) jump through loops to get what THEY wanted.
But for me, it's too late. I hate them all with a passion. If the dev doesn't put a redemption-ark into the first chapter, nothing that will come afterwards could justify their behavior retroactively.

dude, you're writing so many valid points that i'm clogging the dev's dm-box and spamming thinking face emojis like crazy XD seriously, i've nothing to add XD

 

[joch1812]

Android sir?

 

[TGO Entertainment]

I just want to take a few minutes before I bury myself in the game. I definitely appreciate everyone's constructive and helpful comments. I know I need to do a better job of making the characters more sympathetic -to make them earn their redemption better- while at the same time improving the MC's reactions to the characters. I need to do better for all the fans and everyone that has stuck around. I'm going to dedicate a lot of time to cracking this code for the next update.

 

[clowns234]

Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing.
Look at the posts made. How ANGRY people get after playing. Look at how NTR pisses most players off. Players react to what happens to their MCs, as they would want to react if it happened to them.

So I didn't mind the minigames that much...as for being minigames. The problem is their purpose and most of all: Context.
The games with Susan are about learning about her, getting closer to her and then create a bond with her. Problem was, I didn't WANT to get closer to her since I still felt betrayed and was still waiting for some form of proper apology to make it up to ME. They don't deserve that yet.
What we get instead is MC making them do what they wanted from the very beginning: Theach him how to properly please them. The MC may have forgiven her quickly, since he is just an inexperienced teenager who only has those two people in his life. But I'm not... I would rather leave the house.
And that made the Minigames with the other three just so much worse.
With them, it wasn't even about getting closer to them anymore (if I wanted or not). It was just a collection of tedious tasks with no relation to their emotions. Do that task right, and at the end you get your treat for being a good boy. But I didn't WANT to do these tasks for them either, since I was STILL feeling betrayed and STILL waiting for my apology. And the longer I played, the more of their lies got exposed which is NEVER acknowledged. And all the love and affection I have to give them is never returned by them.

I'm feeling betrayed and was physically hurt by them, yet for some rason, I still have to care for their wellbeing.
If THEY feel hurt (e.g. if you choose on of them three times in a row) they will guilt-trip me and leave the house!

And what does MC get in return? What's his reward?
After doing everything they wanted and satisfying on their terms while keeping all of their kinks in mind... we get a blowjob. But did they ask if that's even what MC wants? Did they care if he liked it the way they did it? And at the end, he got to finish however way they felt comfortable with. You know... men have feelings to. Would have been nice, if they somehow considered HIS wishes for once. Especially after they just made him (us) jump through loops to get what THEY wanted.
But for me, it's too late. I hate them all with a passion. If the dev doesn't put a redemption-ark into the first chapter, nothing that will come afterwards could justify their behavior retroactively.

"Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing."
I did not realize how true this is for some people until joining this site. Good or bad, for some these games are more than just entertainment.

BTW - I do have 'cringe' moments in games and I have yelled at the screen because the MC was being such an idiot, but I've done the same thing watching a TV show or a movie.

 

[Arassei]

So I didn't mind the minigames that much...as for being minigames. The problem is their purpose and most of all: Context.

I honestly think that the minigames are useless. I was clearly not in the mood to play them. None of them.
Susan said you have the final choice (when you choose her clothes) but no, you have no choice at all, if you pick something she doesn't like, she's just sent you to Sam. Why ? And why, now that you know the truth about them, she suddently doesn't want to dress like the slut she is in her own house ?
Also, when you choose the swimsuit, you can't choose one too " open " because of " women with child " but, children are not confined in their house, with the tunnel just for home-school ??
In the end, I just clicked randomsly and if she was dissappointed, I just rolled back and choose another clothe, and continued the story.
Even the choices where the mom checks if you listened everything and all... For that scene, the questions are useless, too... like " How many time I used the drug on you ? " (What, you want to piss me off again ?) or "Out of the following people, who I have slept with " (Seriously, bitch?) or even " Who are the women in your life right now ? " (like, the MC doesn't know his classmates, teachers and family)

Why the dev bothered to make minigames ?
Just let the player choose with who he wants to " learn " (pff!) and just make scene where the characters talk and do things. No need for minigames.

 

[ropershy]

"Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing."
I did not realize how true this is for some people until joining this site. Good or bad, for some these games are more than just entertainment.

BTW - I do have 'cringe' moments in games and I have yelled at the screen because the MC was being such an idiot, but I've done the same thing watching a TV show or a movie.

Way I see it these games allow us to relive Teen/young adult years and do the things we dreamed of doing. The hot teacher or neighbor. Without the consequences of those actions. So in a sense we become that MC. That is why so many of us take it so personal when the MC becomes such a beta male pansy!

 

[Sarkasmus]

"Honestly, I still think devs simply underestimate just how strongly players tend to empathize with the MCs they are playing."
I did not realize how true this is for some people until joining this site. Good or bad, for some these games are more than just entertainment.

BTW - I do have 'cringe' moments in games and I have yelled at the screen because the MC was being such an idiot, but I've done the same thing watching a TV show or a movie.

Here's my take on that:

There are hundreds of devs on here thinking, they can just make a game without giving a shit about the story (because it's porn, who cares about story, right?) and patrons will just magically flock to them. But there is a shit-ton of those devs who already failed with that.
Because people DO care about story in their NOVELS. If I wanted porn, I'd just hop over to pornhub and watch one of the thousands of Animation-loop-compilations they have on there. Or any other of the millions of movies fitting my kink. But instead I play VNs I can paticipate in. Get invested in.
That's what Devs REALLY need to understand. The player is the one who makes the decisions, creating his own story. So every time you force a developement on him, that does not correlate with what the player would have wanted... it's (at the very least) disappointing for the player.

 

[Raboobie]

Here's my take on that:

There are hundreds of devs on here thinking, they can just make a game without giving a shit about the story (because it's porn, who cares about story, right?) and patrons will just magically flock to them. But there is a shit-ton of those devs who already failed with that.
Because people DO care about story in their NOVELS. If I wanted porn, I'd just hop over to pornhub and watch one of the thousands of Animation-loop-compilations they have on there. Or any other of the millions of movies fitting my kink. But instead I play VNs I can paticipate in. Get invested in.
That's what Devs REALLY need to understand. The player is the one who makes the decisions, creating his own story. So every time you force a developement on him, that does not correlate with what the player would have wanted... it's (at the very least) disappointing for the player.

This, so much and all of this ^^^

I get invested in the story, it's why I hate certain kinks and bitch about them.

I'd at to this that mini-games ruin the immersion and the equivalent of throwing math or puzzle problem into a novel that has to be solved. Like Gandalf arriving at the shire and unless you can solve 345-52+235*23 = you can't put in the code to turn the page and continue the story.

 

[ropershy]

This, so much and all of this ^^^

I get invested in the story, it's why I hate certain kinks and bitch about them.

I'd at to this that mini-games ruin the immersion and the equivalent of throwing math or puzzle problem into a novel that has to be solved. Like Gandalf arriving at the shire and unless you can solve 345-52+235*23 = you can't put in the code to turn the page and continue the story.

I have never understood why the Devs thought we would want to play a game within a GAME!

 

[Demoness_Kiss]

I have never understood why the Devs thought we would want to play a game within a GAME!

otherwise it would be a kinetic novel...and to feel like we earned the sex-scenes...

 

[v1900]

This, so much and all of this ^^^

I get invested in the story, it's why I hate certain kinks and bitch about them.

I'd at to this that mini-games ruin the immersion and the equivalent of throwing math or puzzle problem into a novel that has to be solved. Like Gandalf arriving at the shire and unless you can solve 345-52+235*23 = you can't put in the code to turn the page and continue the story.

I am unsure about the minigames, most are just 1 minute long (although the aunt minigame has a bug and can stall you a bit), easy and forgettable, no big problem. Now the mom's minigames are just torture, it felt like a kick to my nethers and I felt my testosterone plummet. To me it was "look at this old used body you lust after and half the town has taken it, if you want it you need to be my floor mat". I don't think her office quickies entail all the hoops she makes us jump.

Shit it just hit me, we are being trained to be the sub for the ceremony. Shit we are going to be the Arbiter's bitch. Fuck our mom is using us as the dildo version of a Trojan horse. Crap now I know why they "can't" tell us anything more when we ask. Well I am off to buy my gimp suit, see all of you in a bit.

 

[Norman Knight]

dildo version of a Trojan horse.

i'm gonna steal this phrase, thanks a lot.

 

[Sarkasmus]

Shit it just hit me, we are being trained to be the sub for the ceremony. Shit we are going to be the Arbiter's bitch. Fuck our mom is using us as the dildo version of a Trojan horse. Crap now I know why they "can't" tell us anything more when we ask. Well I am off to buy my gimp suit, see all of you in a bit.

You realized that only NOW? I thought it was quite obvious...
All the "best and well rounded education you can get before your ceremony" (as Susan said it) was nothing more than to learn what they like, and how to properly use that to give them their ultimate pleasures. They told him nothing about the outside, nothing about their society, it was just how to fuck them good.

 

[juan palote]

Shit it just hit me, we are being trained to be the sub for the ceremony. Shit we are going to be the Arbiter's bitch. Fuck our mom is using us as the dildo version of a Trojan horse. Crap now I know why they "can't" tell us anything more when we ask. Well I am off to buy my gimp suit, see all of you in a bit.

Yes, we are, and since the MC doesnt have any kind of proactiveness he just goes around doing every single thing he is told. The MC is a puppy that keeps bringing the stick back, over and over again