Ren'Py Completed Toro 7 [Ep. 7] [Tora Productions]

[Tlaero]

Every single story ever told has infinite scope to expand into. You're welcome to your opinion that not dragging this on forever shows a lack of vision. My contrary view is that its the stories that drag on forever that lack vision.

Both and neither of us is right. Soap Operas have been going on forever and are extremely popular. And many of the most lasting and memorable stories ever told were tight standalone affairs that had no sequels.

We didn't get bored, and we're not so vapid that we accidentally wrote a story that you liked but ran out of ideas. We set out to tell a story, and we stopped when that story was told.

Tlaero

 

[Tlaero]

Is it really what people want or is it what the producers think that's what people want and so it's less risky to invest in?

They make their decisions based on data, and they've got a lot of data. They know precisely how well Fast X did compared to the 10 new IPs that bombed in the box office.

Or, consider Firefly. There's a reason that it failed when the, what 5th Star Trek series? ran for years. And that reason had nothing to do with how good Firefly was (it was incredible, and I'll die on that hill). It had everything to do with the fact that a lot more people watched Star Trek than Firefly.

Back in the 80's the only way we could get Science Fiction movies was to have Arnold Schwarzenegger in them. That was because people would go see an Arnold movie regardless of what it was, so the producers had the latitude to do something new.

An organism's resistance to change (new things) is called "Homeostasis" and it's more than human nature. It's considered one of the criteria for classifying something as alive. It's the reason our ancestors didn't all die off when they found a new set of red berries (that happened to be poisonous). And it's the reason sequels and reboots of berries that are known to not be poisonous will always do better than new IPs.

Tlaero

 

[Tlaero]

For many in my generation the association with that quote is mostly April 4/5, 1994 and the endless media interviews that followed.

No complaints here, and I hope it didn't come off as such - just wished it would have gone on a bit longer because I was enjoying it. As for the rest, I started blindly with Elsaverse Transitions and realized there was an overarching narrative that I was jumping into the middle of, then went back to a pack of 4 ported-from-html titles (Dreaming, Redemption, Finding, Saving). Is this the order you would suggest:

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or like Star Wars is there a sequence you would suggest other than release order?

RIP Kurt. :-(

Don't worry, you came across fine.

Yeah, start with the Omnibus: https://f95zone.to/threads/elsaverse-omnibus-vol-1-tora-productions.90315/ and either go down the left side or go left to right. The left side are the games and the things to the right are extras that add flavor. The games expect that you played them in order, but they do NOT expect that you did all of the short stories. That said, there's good stuff in those stories.

(In other words, "What Moskys said.")

Tlaero

 

[Rk420]

Every single story ever told has infinite scope to expand into. You're welcome to your opinion that not dragging this on forever shows a lack of vision. My contrary view is that its the stories that drag on forever that lack vision.

Both and neither of us is right. Soap Operas have been going on forever and are extremely popular. And many of the most lasting and memorable stories ever told were tight standalone affairs that had no sequels.

We didn't get bored, and we're not so vapid that we accidentally wrote a story that you liked but ran out of ideas. We set out to tell a story, and we stopped when that story was told.

Tlaero

I actually enjoyed the ending of the game, you did a fine job in my opinion. This is the most intense game of this type that I have ever played till date Felt like being in a sci-fi movie with a heart-in-mouth ending. I myself am not a fan of continuously extending a story with no end in sight. I have to say though that I played all 7 episodes in one go.

 

[turbojoe]

Soap Operas have been going on forever

Ok ok - I don´t think all the fans here of your marvellous game complaining the abrupt ending do expect an endless serial, but especially in my opinion to await 2 or 3 more seasons (7 episodes each) would have been nice.
As some more here posted the initiated story has definitely the potential for it.

Anyway I respect your decision and thank you very much for this outstanding adventure, I really enjoyed it

 

[Tulrek]

Ok ok - I don´t think all the fans here of your marvellous game complaining the abrupt ending do expect an endless serial, but especially in my opinion to await 2 or 3 more seasons (7 episodes each) would have been nice.
As some more here posted the initiated story has definitely the potential for it.

Anyway I respect your decision and thank you very much for this outstanding adventure, I really enjoyed it

 

[jI11jaCksjAkk]

You can always check the wiki

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OK, that is super helpful. Thanks! I think I googled "tora productions" and that didn't come up near the top of the returns so I had not seen it.

It's also fun to start from the beginning again and pick up on all the clues

Well, there weren't any Lost-style red-herrings, so it seemed pretty obvious to me that everything the MC encounted was relevant without needing multiple replays. Chekhov's gun and all that. It would be neat to play a complex narrative that did have a bunch of extra "clues" that turn out to be unrelated. Just like IRL in a murder investigation not every detail turns out to be related to the murder itself, so a big part of a real case is the investigator determining which "clues" are relevant and which are not. Unfortunately few games are that in depth [HINT, HINT Tlaero ].

all good things come to end but all bad things continue forever.

Kevin Feige on line 1 with his legal team, cxx...

Firefly was (it was incredible, and I'll die on that hill).

Well don't do that. It was great, and the only Whedon content I bury my head in the sand and allow myself to watch in 2023.

And now I will just sit back and await the inevitable angry posts about why there isn't a tag for "homeostasis" if you're going to include homeosexual content, you monster!

 

[Regularus]

Just completed Toro 7 and immensely enjoyed it.
Storytelling , writing and characters were just top notch, the atmosphere was very well helped by the visuals.

I wish there would have been a few more episodes though as Toro 7 was so good it was sad when i reached the end (it felt a bit abrupt as if there was more planned actually), i just wanted more story with those characters
All in all, Toro 7 is a fantastic AVN , and truly one of the best i read.

 

[moskyx]

So... the MC got to the station. Learned there was a murder, got to 'solve' it, then learned about what the company has done to the murderer, learned about what the company has done to him/her self, saved the crew a couple of times, helped the director to make peace with her past by reuniting her with a lost friend and ignited the revolutionary spark in her. Plus (maybe) found love and some steamy sex in the process too. All in all, I think it has been a pretty packed week in MC's life... that has expanded for 18+ months of our real lives (since the game's first drafts). There are for sure more stories to be told (like the MC actually learning the whats, the hows, and the whys their ADN was modified, or the Toro stations' uprising against the company) but a) those stories would need way more in-game time to be told, as there's very little our protagonists can do about all of that from their current location, and b) those stories would need way more time in our real lives to be planned and told, which means that other stories already on dev's mind would need to wait for years. That seems like a creative cage to me.

Some of you were asking for maybe 3 seasons, so let's say 4-5 more years - just to complete one bigger game many of you won't probably be playing anymore due to real-life situations. Tora Productions created the whole Elsaverse contained in the Omnibus (5 different games plus a bunch of side stories), and even more, in about that time span. Maybe we'll get the chance to come back to this Toro universe later on and explore it from a different pov, maybe not. But 'short' and straight-to-the-point games are their trademark. It's just the way they work.

 

[Eticketjedi]

Well, there weren't any Lost-style red-herrings, so it seemed pretty obvious to me that everything the MC encounted was relevant without needing multiple replays. Chekhov's gun and all that. It would be neat to play a complex narrative that did have a bunch of extra "clues" that turn out to be unrelated. Just like IRL in a murder investigation not every detail turns out to be related to the murder itself, so a big part of a real case is the investigator determining which "clues" are relevant and which are not. Unfortunately few games are that in depth [HINT, HINT Tlaero ].

Yes, everything paid off, but there were callbacks to one-liners and 20 second scenes early on in the game. You don't often see that. In my case it was months between when I started and finished the game so I had forgotten a lot of those little bits.

As far as clues and figuring out a murder and wading through the investigation and false leads, I would recommend Mythos, the game in my sig. It checks all of those boxes pretty well. There's only a couple of updates left as well.

 

[constantine]

I don't have any issue with this being a stand-alone project, and respect not wanting to drag the story out, but the feeling of abruptness to the end is a feeling I share.

I think for me, the lack of an unwinding or denouement to the story may be why. Sure, the crisis gets resolved, but the crew isn't seen again, rather MC is just isolated. We spend so much of the story interacting with the crew, connecting with them, but at the end, the crew is absent. Yes, they've been asleep, but why not perhaps have a brief moment of them waking up and relieved or ecstatic to have survived?

For example, in the movie Independence Day, it doesn't end after the aliens are defeated, it ends when our heroes are reunited with their families. In Star Wars: a New Hope, it doesn't end after the Death Star is destroyed, it ends with our heroes re-united. We see the fruits of their accomplishment. A moment of rejoice together. Now, imagine if it ended with the Death Star blowing up, and Luke alone in his X-Wing. Would the ending feel as satisfying?

Can abrupt endings work? Yes. But I feel like it mostly works where the end is meant to be ambiguous. And in this case, the crews' survival is conclusive.

Even though I'm a bit critical about the way it ends, it's really the only part I felt lacking. Perhaps, that's why it stands out to me, since everything else I thought was well done. Thank you to the creative team.

 

[FookU2]

Every single story ever told has infinite scope to expand into. You're welcome to your opinion that not dragging this on forever shows a lack of vision. My contrary view is that its the stories that drag on forever that lack vision.

Both and neither of us is right. Soap Operas have been going on forever and are extremely popular. And many of the most lasting and memorable stories ever told were tight standalone affairs that had no sequels.

We didn't get bored, and we're not so vapid that we accidentally wrote a story that you liked but ran out of ideas. We set out to tell a story, and we stopped when that story was told.

Tlaero

Soap operas last forever because a lot of women love drama, and especially the stay-at-home moms love to just sit and watch drama then call their female relatives and friends and gossip about who shot who and then revived somehow.
Very few other shows have that kinda longevity, just because they don't cater to that drama loving crowd.
Simpsons lasted so long just because it was original material, and people just grew to love that crazy, trouble making child.
Any other shows either continue as "direct to DVD" releases, or just die out due to boredom of viewers.

A lot of your followers do appreciate that you finished the story, though. It's better than dragging it on to the point that you get burn out then add it to the pile of abandoned projects on here. I felt the story was a bit too short, but that's just my own personal taste. I was enjoying it and felt I didn't get enough scenes. I also kinda wanted to make the straight female path turn her into sort of a ho (lol), but she ended up only sleeping with 1 person per path (that I saw, anyway)

Either way, kudos to a completed tag. Kudos to sticking to what you envisioned. And kudos for standing up for your own thoughts and beliefs and not bending to cater to every needy person on the site. Because, in the end, if a dev can't enjoy what they're doing, they WILL burn out and abandon their projects.

 

[bingolebongo]

I actually enjoyed the ending of the game, you did a fine job in my opinion. This is the most intense game of this type that I have ever played till date Felt like being in a sci-fi movie with a heart-in-mouth ending. I myself am not a fan of continuously extending a story with no end in sight. I have to say though that I played all 7 episodes in one go.

Personally, I think it's perfectly fine to hold both views simultaneously:

- Did I like the ending? Yes.
- Would I have wanted to see more? Also yes.

 

[affeimzoo]

Just started playing. Game looks good and i like how they build up the detective story. With that being said can someone explain to me why the hottest chick on the station is trans?

It feels like the author of the game is trying to troll straight guys.

 

[Bloodguard]

Personally, I think it's perfectly fine to hold both views simultaneously:

- Did I like the ending? Yes.
- Would I have wanted to see more? Also yes.

Good endings are quite tricky to pull off. I always considered Breaking Bad to have the perfect ending to a near perfect show. This ending feels more like Chuck or Fringe, where they ran out of resources or energy and ended rather abruptly with little satisfaction. But any ending is almost always better than no ending.

 

[jI11jaCksjAkk]

In my case it was months between when I started and finished the game so I had forgotten a lot of those little bits.
I would recommend Mythos, the game in my sig.

Oooh, yeah. Didn't think about that. Only saw it for the first time when the final version was posted. As always my typing fingers (and mouth) are quicker than my brain, which often leads to me saying dumb things. Sorry. And thanks for the tip - I will check that game out.

women love drama, and especially the stay-at-home moms

Sigh. Do you even hear yourself? You know it isn't 1955 anymore,right?

It feels like the author of the game is trying to troll straight guys.

Or just the sad-sacks that are so soft mentally (and...) that the word "trans" terrifies them.

This ending feels more like Chuck

I think in that case they knew both mains pretty well after a few seasons and realized that if it went on any longer the idea that someone like Sarah would EVER be with someone like Chuck would become increasingly absurd, given what a lousy actor he is compared to what an amazing actress she is (on top of being a total smokeshow, especially at that time). Heck, even now she usually has me wanting to give Serena yet another chance.

 

[FookU2]

Sigh. Do you even hear yourself? You know it isn't 1955 anymore,right?

Literally every person I know who watches soaps is a woman...minus a male gay friend. Most women I know absolutely love to watch dramas and "chick flicks." Most men I know absolutely do NOT love to watch dramas. They prefer actions, comedies, sports or horrors. I say "most" because there are those who break the mold. I say "prefer" and "love" because sure, more women are getting into watching sports now. But, they still love their dramas and chick flicks. But, that is something that isn't dated. What I typed isn't misogynistic nor dated. It is simply stats.

I invite you to a quick google search I did, that took all of 5 minutes. Soaps are slowly being replaced with reality TV, but reality TV is still drama. The majority of daytime TV is watched by women, 18-49. There are some other interesting stats, if you care to read it.

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[jI11jaCksjAkk]

Literally every person I know who watches soaps is a woman What I typed isn't misogynistic nor dated.

It is both misogynistic and dated. You stated an absolute that "women love drama," which is so oversimplified it says more about the person saying it than the subject of the conversation. You did not say "some" or "many or "most," you lumped all women - every single one of them - together as if they were not individuals with their own varying tastes.

And your use of the term stay-at-home-mons is less egregious but it is clearly outdated. Since you seem to love stats so much, why don't you look up the demographics of stay-at-home-moms. You will find that in 2023 there are virtually no SAHM anymore other than almost exclusively wealthy, white women because the economics of single-income homes are no longer feasible for the vast majority of working-class families. So your sweeping generalisms make even less sense since in reality they only apply to a small subgrouping of "women" in the first place.

But the lack of logic in your post is made even more glaring when you say something telling like "every person I know who watches soaps is a woman" as evidence that your generalization must be true. Clearly you do not understand that the entire world is made up many different people most of which are not exaxtly like the ones you know personally.

These 5 humans that I know like apples ≠ ALL humans like apples.​

This is basic elementary school logic. And using anecdotes as support for statistics shows a fundamental lack of understanding of statistics in the first place.

Or instead of all that I suppose I could just use your rationale and say that I know three women who can't stand soap operas. Therefore, all women hate soap operas. Q.E.D.

 

[Tlaero]

Just started playing. Game looks good and i like how they build up the detective story. With that being said can someone explain to me why the hottest chick on the station is trans?

It feels like the author of the game is trying to troll straight guys.

The reaction to Aisha really surprised me. Since I treated a trans person as a human being, I expected a lot of hatred from the, "There are only two genders!" and "You're indoctrinating our children!" types. I'm very pleased to have gotten none of that.

On the other hand, I was less pleased with all of people who see "trans" as a kink instead of an identity.

She's certainly attractive, though. Especially when she smiles. Mortze did a fantastic job with her.

Tlaero

 

[Talmadge]

Completed? Really? I just noticed, after finishing my first play through, that it's already over. Please, Tlaero. Tell me that there will be a part 2 coming? I gotta know how they bring down the Company! Great game. Personally not into the trans content, for personal reasons. But not a dick about it, people can be what they want to be. Just don't expect people to bow down to you. And your character does not do that. So great game. Like I say, can't wait to see if there's going to be a part 2 or some kind of continuation.