10xRecoil

Member
Aug 28, 2020
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193
I disagree, when you financially support someone and nothing comes of it that means you wasted your money. Get burned enough and the development community loses out on the support of people who would be generous if they could trust that they'd see a return on their "investment".
Bud, your reasoning is flawed, not baseless but flawed.
The mistake the dev made here is that he/she should have provided an explanation to his/her patrons before disappearing. But I don't have one fucking idea about what happened, so it is futile to comment on that. Accept it or not, deleting a Patreon page is the most bizarre way of abandoning a game.

Moreover, did you not enjoy the movie "Dune" even if it's unfinished? How about all the TV series?
I get that the last season of GoT was crap, but before that it was something.

Look what is fair to you is fair to you, I am not here to convince you otherwise. I may have read your intentions wrong but you're using words like "wasting money" and "nothing comes out of it" is an exaggeration and it feels like you are pushing your ideas on others.
 

MrFriendly

Officially Dead Inside
Donor
Feb 23, 2020
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Bud, your reasoning is flawed, not baseless but flawed.
The mistake the dev made here is that he/she should have provided an explanation to his/her patrons before disappearing. But I don't have one fucking idea about what happened, so it is futile to comment on that. Accept it or not, deleting a Patreon page is the most bizarre way of abandoning a game.

Moreover, did you not enjoy the movie "Dune" even if it's unfinished? How about all the TV series?
I get that the last season of GoT was crap, but before that it was something.

Look what is fair to you is fair to you, I am not here to convince you otherwise. I may have read your intentions wrong but you're using words like "wasting money" and "nothing comes out of it" is an exaggeration and it feels like you are pushing your ideas on others.
You amuse me... I don't watch tv shows nor did I watch the new Dune movie (I watched the David Lynch version and I read the book, didn't like either, and I didn't read the sequels). Very few tv shows have an overarching storyline instead going with episodic stories which finish in an hour or two.

You may think it isn't a waste of money to support a developer. That's fine, it is a matter of opinion after all. As for "pushing my ideas on others" at no point did I tell anyone what they should say, do, or feel. Nor did I tell them what they did say, do, or feel is wrong. At all times I tried to merely state my opinion, what you "feel" about me pushing my ideas on others doesn't matter.
 

StingerWolf

Well-Known Member
Sep 5, 2017
1,356
1,906
Honestly think that developers try to do too much with their first games. They either make renders that take a lot of time to model and render or they have too many characters or they have too many branches to their story. I really think that developers should start small and then grow bigger with each subsequent release as they get more comfortable with what they are doing. I also think they need to write out at least an outline of where the story is going to go before they attempt any of it. There are a lot of developers that I follow on here that, if I'm honest, I don't think will finish their games. Just because I think that they are biting off more than they can chew. I hope I am wrong about all of them but history is not on my side when it comes to developers completing their projects.



I believe Double Homework was finished too. Now the dev team has moved on to another game.
It was, but not by the dev. His colleagues/co-workers finished it.
 
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Psykoman1978

Active Member
Mar 21, 2022
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People still hope/believe another/new Dev will working on Lexi again but we know it will never happen even than it will be different then before
 

botc76

The Crawling Chaos, Bringer of Strange Joy
Donor
Oct 23, 2016
4,475
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Bud, your reasoning is flawed, not baseless but flawed.
The mistake the dev made here is that he/she should have provided an explanation to his/her patrons before disappearing. But I don't have one fucking idea about what happened, so it is futile to comment on that. Accept it or not, deleting a Patreon page is the most bizarre way of abandoning a game.

Moreover, did you not enjoy the movie "Dune" even if it's unfinished? How about all the TV series?
I get that the last season of GoT was crap, but before that it was something.

Look what is fair to you is fair to you, I am not here to convince you otherwise. I may have read your intentions wrong but you're using words like "wasting money" and "nothing comes out of it" is an exaggeration and it feels like you are pushing your ideas on others.
More like he is giving his opinion, just like you are doing right now.
It's a matter of personal definition, what is a waste and what isn't.

To be honest, I agree with him that it is in many ways a waste and not just of money, but also of time and effort.
It's not like you get nothing for it, but any story-focused creative project, that ends up unfinished leaves out what for many, including me, is at least one of if not THE most important part. A well done ending.

Sure, if George R.R. Martin never finishes the final books, I will still have those I have already read, but that doesn't change that I would never get to see the actual ending he intended. Which seems even more important since the TV show sucked balls in the end.
I can't speak for everybody, but I think if I start paying money for a story, I expect a complete story, not a part of it.
In most cases, if I'd known the story wouldn't get an ending, I would never have started paying for it.
Whether it's a game, a novel or a comicbook, not finishing it always sucks and people have a right to see it as a waste of their money and energy and time.
 

10xRecoil

Member
Aug 28, 2020
115
193
You amuse me... I don't watch tv shows nor did I watch the new Dune movie (I watched the David Lynch version and I read the book, didn't like either, and I didn't read the sequels). Very few tv shows have an overarching storyline instead going with episodic stories which finish in an hour or two.

You may think it isn't a waste of money to support a developer. That's fine, it is a matter of opinion after all. As for "pushing my ideas on others" at no point did I tell anyone what they should say, do, or feel. Nor did I tell them what they did say, do, or feel is wrong. At all times I tried to merely state my opinion, what you "feel" about me pushing my ideas on others doesn't matter.
Is that so? then guess we'll be dragging your ass (and balls included) through the pieces of broken glass to predict if a game will get completed tag or not. You better start honing that sixth sense thing you have.;)

Better days for everyone. Cheers!:coffee:
 

10xRecoil

Member
Aug 28, 2020
115
193
To be honest, I agree with him that it is in many ways a waste and not just of money, but also of time and effort.
It's not like you get nothing for it, but any story-focused creative project, that ends up unfinished leaves out what for many, including me, is at least one of if not THE most important part. A well done ending.
It's fair and understandable that you're solely concerned with the end result and if it will fit your standard, but my God, it's a stressful way of living. I do not need that anxiety in my life.
 

Dabigoh

Member
Mar 1, 2020
175
2,158
A.O.A Academy wasn't the best VN/Game out there, but it was one of my favorites. I am saddened to see it abandoned.

I think it hurts more because TLG was so close to finishing the next chapter and I was very excited to read what happens next. Add in the fact that he disappeared without a word and the frustration grows.

I'd like to think that he had good reasons for what he did, I just wish someone would relay those reasons to us. Even if his reasons were not-so-good, I'd feel better just knowing.

Sure, life will go on and I'll get over it eventually. It's just really sad to see it end like this. Still crossing my fingers that he decides to release the last chapter if possible. (I have this fear that his system crashed causing him to lose all of his work and he rage quit as a response)

Don't get me wrong, I'm sad but I'm not angry. I'm one of the many moochers on this site that leaches these games for free so I'm not out any money. That said, if I had the money to spend on Patreon subscriptions this project would have been one of the first that I'd have subscribed to.
 

LionHeart 95

Member
Aug 30, 2020
449
951
Gentlemen, if you have supported a developer, you haven't done a bad thing.
In fact, you all should be proud and to hell with the narrative that the dev should be supported only if he completes a game. The journey is what matters and sometimes it comes to an abrupt end. We move.
I agree with your thought here, but I don't want to move on sometimes!!!

Question, do you feel or have the opinion that the Patron pays for the work completed thus far, or for the Dev to continue the work yet to be completed?

Take in mind a patron usually only contributes to a developer after playing at least one episode of a game. and as for me, contributions are for continuing the work. and good Devs stop Collections when work is paused for a time.
When patrons contribute to a game we are aware that life exist, but many feel that we are paying for them to work on the game we so love that we provide money and even defend its status as we wait for the next release. and once completed we review the next game(s) coming from dev to continue.

it is true though I have contributed to many games that have not continued of those My favorite game was C-Plan it demise was sad, its called life as you said.
 

The Wicked One

Active Member
Jul 8, 2017
715
2,389
I get you. But, you DID spend money on an incomplete story and you enjoyed what you played. True story. But, now, you regret it. I get it. It's like getting real pussy, loving it and the next day you have crabs. Now you regret getting that pussy. Regret is fine, bro. But, you still loved that pussy. :devilish:
I KIND of see where you're going with your analogies. One of the analogs I can think of, in terms of incomplete stories, is comics. For a while, because unfortunate circumstances, I thought Berserk wasn't going to continue. Thankfully, that is a story supported by millions of fans, and created by a pretty big team. But even if it wasn't "complete", I would've still enjoyed what I had read. But comics get cancelled all the time.
Unfortunately, most of these VNs are created by a singular dude, or a skeleton crew, and at the mercy (for better or worse) of multiple variables.
 
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Smarmint

Well-Known Member
Mar 23, 2019
1,218
4,844
Gentlemen, if you have supported a developer, you haven't done a bad thing.
In fact, you all should be proud and to hell with the narrative that the dev should be supported only if he completes a game. The journey is what matters and sometimes it comes to an abrupt end. We move.
I disagree, when you financially support someone and nothing comes of it that means you wasted your money. Get burned enough and the development community loses out on the support of people who would be generous if they could trust that they'd see a return on their "investment".
I have supported quite a few games here on Patreon, and I am always quite disappointed when they are unceremoniously abandoned. It has made me think twice about supporting games I like. I still do it, but less than before, and I am more quick to pull support once the dev transitions from a release every 1-3 months, to one release every 9-12 months (many, many devs).

I get that it helps to support devs, hell almost none of the games here would exist if people didn't throw the dice and support games after the first release, in hopes the dev will continue.

However, I can understand a dev working for a couple of months, and deciding its more work than he thought, or he isn't getting enough money for his time, and decide to abandon it (Reincarnotica).

What really bothers me, though, is when devs start slow walking their games to drag it out forever, once they hit the few thousand a month range. Some devs release consistently, even though they have wide support, and just make their next game when they are done (the devs I listed in my previous post). Others, we all know who they are, decide why work when they can get almost the same income for doing next to nothing, and just keep up with the endless "dog ate my homework" excuses. Obviously there are exceptions when a dev is truly struck with a serious illness, though nobody can know if he is being truthful, but most of the time it happens suspiciously once they hit a critical mass of support where they can just stop and the supporters keep funding for years afterward.

Maybe I am old fashioned, but I think once a dev builds a following and collects a sizable monthly income from a large group of fans, he owes it to his fans and supporters to provide steady releases at a reasonable 1-3 month schedule, maybe a bit more in the unusual cases where the releases are very sophisticated and substantial (Philly or DPC). It may not be in Patreon's contract (it isn't), but devs should strive to be ethical when receiving payment, and have personal integrity and at least release something at regular intervals. Despite what is in the official Patreon fine print, those that donate support the dev in the expectation that the game they support will eventually be completed, at a reasonable schedule.

And then we have cases like AOA Academy, where TLG just drops off the Earth from one day to the next, a la Chainzero with Connected, and many others from my previous list . Sure, it could be something extreme like sudden disabling illness or death, but who are we kidding. It is a 95% chance the dev just said "Screw my Fans", and took the money and run. If someone dies or becomes critically ill, the last thing on the minds of their loved ones is "I better hurry up and close their Patreon account the same day, and quit their Discord. Why would they stop the money flowing? It certainly wouldn't be top priority, even if they had the all the dev's login info, which is also not a given.

Nobody is forced to complete their games, but if a dev is going to quit you owe the fans some kind of reasonable explanation, from the heart. Even if it is just, "It has taken a lot of thought, but the game took a lot more time than I expected, and it didn't get the financial support I had hoped to get to pay for my time and assets needed, so I am going to rethink my career as a part-time game developer and pause or stop work on my game. Thanks to all my fans for the support, it meant a lot to me, and I'm sorry it turned out like this."

As a fan, I would be disappointed, but understand. However, unfortunately, very few devs are stand-up-guys and do this. They rather just ghost all their fans rather than take a few minutes to give an honest explanation, and that is very disappointing as a fan and sometimes supporter to see devs treat their audience like this.
 
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Skeltom

Engaged Member
Oct 9, 2017
2,631
3,166
I have supported quite a few games here on Patreon, and I am always quite disappointed when they are unceremoniously abandoned. It has made me think twice about supporting games I like. I still do it, but less than before, and I am more quick to pull support once the dev transitions from a release every 1-3 months, to one release every 9-12 months (many, many devs).

I get that it helps to support devs, hell almost none of the games here would exist if people didn't throw the dice and support games after the first release, in hopes the dev will continue.

However, I can understand a dev working for a couple of months, and deciding its more work than he thought, or he isn't getting enough money for his time, and decide to abandon it (Reincarnotica).

What really bothers me, though, is when devs start slow walking their games to drag it out forever, once they hit the few thousand a month range. Some devs release consistently, even though they have wide support, and just make their next game when they are done (the devs I listed in my previous post). Others, we all know who they are, decide why work when they can get almost the same income for doing next to nothing, and just keep up with the endless "dog ate my homework" excuses. Obviously there are exceptions when a dev is truly struck with a serious illness, though nobody can know if he is being truthful, but most of the time it happens suspiciously once they hit a critical mass of support where they can just stop and the supporters keep funding for years afterward.

Maybe I am old fashioned, but I think once a dev builds a following and collects a sizable monthly income from a large group of fans, he owes it to his fans and supporters to provide steady releases at a reasonable 1-3 month schedule, maybe a bit more in the unusual cases where the releases are very sophisticated and substantial (Philly or DPC). It may not be in Patreon's contract (it isn't), but devs should strive to be ethical when receiving payment, and have personal integrity and at least release something at regular intervals. Despite what is in the official Patreon fine print, those that donate support the dev in the expectation that the game they support will eventually be completed, at a reasonable schedule.

And then we have cases like AOA Academy, where TLG just drops off the Earth from one day to the next, a la Chainzero with Connected, and many others from my previous list . Sure, it could be something extreme like sudden disabling illness or death, but who are we kidding. It is a 95% chance the dev just said "Screw my Fans", and took the money and run. If someone dies or becomes critically ill, the last thing on the minds of their loved ones is "I better hurry up and close their Patreon account the same day, and quit their Discord. Why would they stop the money flowing? It certainly wouldn't be top priority, even if they had the all the dev's login info, which is also not a given.

Nobody is forced to complete their games, but if a dev is going to quit you owe the fans some kind of reasonable explanation, from the heart. Even if it is just, "It has taken a lot of thought, but the game took a lot more time than I expected, and it didn't get the financial support I had hoped to get to pay for my time and assets needed, so I am going to rethink my career as a part-time game developer and pause or stop work on my game. Thanks to all my fans for the support, it meant a lot to me, and I'm sorry it turned out like this." As a fan, I would be disappointed, but understand.
That's the thing, isn't it? Unless you are the dev or know them personally everything is speculation. But just looking at the state of many games of this type you would think that it's mandatory for a dev to have mental health issues or debilitating illnesses. So, so many of them play the mental card that it's become very hard for me to believe anyone who tries to play it.
 

MrFriendly

Officially Dead Inside
Donor
Feb 23, 2020
5,875
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That's the thing, isn't it? Unless you are the dev or know them personally everything is speculation. But just looking at the state of many games of this type you would think that it's mandatory for a dev to have mental health issues or debilitating illnesses. So, so many of them play the mental card that it's become very hard for me to believe anyone who tries to play it.
The dev excuse list basically reads:

1) Mental health issues
2) Health issues in general
3) Computer or part of it (GPU) died
4) Someone in their life is ill or died
5) Real job is taking up more time
6) SO or family that suddenly needs more time
7) The dev disappears and rumors of their death begin to circulate.

All of these can be and are serious issues, not making light of any of them - individually.
It's when you see 3-4 or more of these excuses come up as you wait for an update that it starts to feel surreal. You want to give the developer the benefit of the doubt so you think "Man, porn game developers have the worst luck", but after encountering it over and over again you become a bit cynical (or in my case a jaded grouchy asshole who lives in a garbage can).

(I know there are a lot more excuses, I just went with the 7 habits of highly effective devs).
 

Sancho1969

Message Maven
Modder
Donor
Jan 19, 2020
12,382
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The dev excuse list basically reads:

1) Mental health issues
2) Health issues in general
3) Computer or part of it (GPU) died
4) Someone in their life is ill or died
5) Real job is taking up more time
6) SO or family that suddenly needs more time
7) The dev disappears and rumors of their death begin to circulate.

All of these can be and are serious issues, not making light of any of them - individually.
It's when you see 3-4 or more of these excuses come up as you wait for an update that it starts to feel surreal. You want to give the developer the benefit of the doubt so you think "Man, porn game developers have the worst luck", but after encountering it over and over again you become a bit cynical (or in my case a jaded grouchy asshole who lives in a garbage can).

(I know there are a lot more excuses, I just went with the 7 habits of highly effective devs).
Careful.. your posts will start to be deleted too for being off topic of "the best VN ever" (I'm quoting that I'm not off topic myself :/). At the end of the day let's just hope it's not health related or some other serious issue as the release was scheduled and imminent within days... which actually makes me worried that the dev had/has some serious IRL issue at hand.
 
Nov 17, 2019
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wow, this is the first time i have seen one of these happen in real time, with a dev i was actually following. The last thing i remember reading was that Chapter 6 was out in November or something. Just amazing lol.
 
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holaje12

Active Member
Dec 17, 2018
935
4,078
And then we have cases like AOA Academy, where TLG just drops off the Earth from one day to the next, a la Chainzero with Connected, and many others from my previous list . Sure, it could be something extreme like sudden disabling illness or death, but who are we kidding. It is a 95% chance the dev just said "Screw my Fans", and took the money and run. If someone dies or becomes critically ill, the last thing on the minds of their loved ones is "I better hurry up and close their Patreon account the same day, and quit their Discord. Why would they stop the money flowing? It certainly wouldn't be top priority, even if they had the all the dev's login info, which is also not a given.
But wouldn't it be silly to get rid of the patreon if all he wanted was to screw his fans and take their money? A lot of devs are able to keep a good chunk of supporters without releasing anything or doing any work, for years even. Why close the patreon? It looks like the dev wants to get rid of the evidence of ever working on this, weird...
 

Deleted member 1571716

Conversation Conqueror
Aug 7, 2019
6,352
10,152
At least TLG didn't go above and beyond constantly with retarded excuses like: "My dog ate my USB that had all my assets and story on it." or "My grandmother passed away." (Several fucking times with this one. I mean how many grandmothers you got bud?) Oh and let's not forget the old: "I'm working on it! Here's some old renders from chapter one, that I recycled and primped her hair for everyone!"

No. TLG wasn't like any of those shitty devs who just milked their patrons for many months and one that milked for years and is STILL milking with hallucenigenic bs that means nothing.
 
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