- Thread starter Hitman955
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- Dec 30, 2017
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Agreed.
IMO D should get to sometimes decide for herself with whom she has sex.
F has pretty much been directing D to having other sexual partners and has indicated he isn't mad when she notices other people and has even agreed to D having a sexual liaison with Ryan. Basically they have an open relationship.
So if D desires to have sex with another person and let's F know she is both acting as a mature partner in their relationship and is being more honest than F has been. D wouldn't be cheating or sneaking around behind his back, she loves and respects F too much to do that to him. She is actually the better person.
- Dec 30, 2017
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- Oct 13, 2016
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a lot of chapters I find it dull. for me a erotic game is about pushing the boundaries, to be surprised, to focus on the eroticism and emotions of the characters. sure, not all erotic games need to be like that, but a visual novel is for me that, a visual erotic novel with options to have different routes. so its not a game or a simulation but a multi choice novel.
I cant feel the emotional closeness between F&D, its superficial, where a lot of times the Mc is egoistic that from time to time act like he need to be mature and understanding, but later show his true colors when he act like a young boy or detached.
D is naive and sometimes stupid, and not always I find it attractive that she is like a child but annoying when shes no reacting like a 18 years old should.
in my mind, a father that gets close to his daughter like that (I try to not moralize here) would not want to be with another woman, and it would make more sense that he focus on her "sexual training", I mean, theres a lot a couple can do.
toys, bdsm, voyeurism, private photoshots/video, fisting, erotic massage, g-spot, facials and deepthroat and so on. also, we have the "mind and emotions", to talk dirty, share fantasies, push each other with suggestions, well, a lot can be done that dont need to introduce the same boring sex scene with another pixel-model.
I cant feel the emotional closeness between F&D, its superficial, where a lot of times the Mc is egoistic that from time to time act like he need to be mature and understanding, but later show his true colors when he act like a young boy or detached.
D is naive and sometimes stupid, and not always I find it attractive that she is like a child but annoying when shes no reacting like a 18 years old should.
in my mind, a father that gets close to his daughter like that (I try to not moralize here) would not want to be with another woman, and it would make more sense that he focus on her "sexual training", I mean, theres a lot a couple can do.
toys, bdsm, voyeurism, private photoshots/video, fisting, erotic massage, g-spot, facials and deepthroat and so on. also, we have the "mind and emotions", to talk dirty, share fantasies, push each other with suggestions, well, a lot can be done that dont need to introduce the same boring sex scene with another pixel-model.
You don't criticize a high fantasy novel because it has swords and scorcery. Anyone expecting a realistic, equal relationship where D gets to make her own choices is barking up the wrong tree. That's not what this game is or ever has been. This is a sterotypical male fantasy porn story, where the mc gets everything he wants with no consequences. That's the entire reason it exists, so that mc can have his cake and eat her friend's pie too.
Mc fucks his long lost daughter, her friends (except Jennifer! WHY?
), his friends, random strangers, all within a few weeks of their reunion, and they're all okay with it, by design. It's completely saccharine, empty calories, junk food. Parental Love and WMV are very much in the same vein.
For the record I think there is room for sharing in this story, I just don't think it will ever be portrayed as anything other than the fulfillment of mc's wishes. Because that's really all DMD is, wish fulfillment power fantasy.
There are other games that set the goal of telling a compelling story and portraying realistic characters, even his other game Melody leans more in that direction, but DMD aint it. So if people don't like it because of those choices, totally fair. But the game should be judged based on what it hopes to accomplish. I think in that regard it mostly achieves its goals.
Mc fucks his long lost daughter, her friends (except Jennifer! WHY?
), his friends, random strangers, all within a few weeks of their reunion, and they're all okay with it, by design. It's completely saccharine, empty calories, junk food. Parental Love and WMV are very much in the same vein.For the record I think there is room for sharing in this story, I just don't think it will ever be portrayed as anything other than the fulfillment of mc's wishes. Because that's really all DMD is, wish fulfillment power fantasy.
There are other games that set the goal of telling a compelling story and portraying realistic characters, even his other game Melody leans more in that direction, but DMD aint it. So if people don't like it because of those choices, totally fair. But the game should be judged based on what it hopes to accomplish. I think in that regard it mostly achieves its goals.
D has already fooled around with Elena (and, perhaps reaching a bit, Olivia) behind F's back and only came clean once she had a nightmare about marrying Elena instead of F. Sure, F ends up being cool with it, but it's not as if she's never been sneaky.
- Nov 11, 2017
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If that was the intention of this game, then the buildup of the relationship would likely have been far shorter, as enablement points in D's life would have been entirely unnecessary (e.g., self-defense, leaving her mother, growing her career) and we wouldn't need quite so many optional paths for both she and the MC to sleep with other people (even though she is rarely in control). Sorry, I don't buy that this is just another Milfy City.
That's where I think you're mistaken. DMD is supposed to fullfill the player's fantasies/wishes, not MC's wishes. And if the player's fantasy is that D wants herself to try to have sex with another person, and not MC wanting her to have sex with this person, then her doing as she wishes perfectly has its place in that game. Both aren't exactly the same kink.
Anyway the discussion is pointless since what is supposed to be in the game will be decided by MrDots in the end.
(But I agree with you that the point of Dmd isn't to be realistic, though I already had this discussion in this topic).
- Apr 4, 2017
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- Dec 30, 2017
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The MrDots team does sometimes listen to valid constructive criticism, and try to add fan wants to the story.
DMD is evolving as it continues, some new situations are added and some (like bestiality) are removed or reduced.
IMO I think DMD has become about the journey not just the fulfillment of sex fetishes.
DMD is evolving as it continues, some new situations are added and some (like bestiality) are removed or reduced.
IMO I think DMD has become about the journey not just the fulfillment of sex fetishes.
- Dec 30, 2017
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Just because it builds a very elaborate fantasy doesn't change the nature of the fantasy. I think it's just terribly bloated because it became so popular, and/or mrdots has a problem with brevity. You even pointed out how D is like a naive fucktoy, totally unrealistic, and that's an entirely valid observation. That's not a new thing, she always was that way (except in .01 she was more sassy and adult, but that was quickly revised by .03 or .04). Along with how mc behaves like a horny teenager, it's probably the most common criticism you'll see in this thread. I'm just saying that D behaving like a naive loli fuckdoll and having no agency is a feature not a bug.
Whereas Melody is a much more focused and concise narrative, I think he is just sort of winging it with DMD, as it's his first story and he never expected it to take off the way it did. He's trying to provide his most diehard supporters with more of what they really want in order to fund the creation of his newer works. Which is why it just keeps on going. He even said as much recently on his site:
"I never intended DMD to last this long when I first began. We’ve had some obstacles in the past as most of you already know, and our plans have changed several times during those four years – some of those changes that we made were due to things that were out of our control.
But it’s due to your love and continued interest in this story that we keep making updates."
A lot of that is about patreon almost killing it, but it's also about how it grew organically as he discovered where he wanted the story to go while writing it and in response to the continued support of his fans. Which is to say, what DMD is about was intentional and hasn't changed much, but the depth and breadth of the narrative was not his original intention and has changed throughout the process of creating it.
Agreed. Which is basically what I meant by saying "what mc wishes" instead of "what I wish". Meaning what mc wants is the same as what mrdots wants the character to be. I think he tries to tailor that to players' wishes but ultimately it's his vision, or his interpretation of what a player who enjoys that type of fantasy would want to do with D if they were the mc. If we go by the first 3 chapters, D making her own decisions is not in the cards, either because his supporters have expressed they don't want that, or simply because that's not the story he's telling. Who knows maybe he'll change his ideas about that in chapter 4. I don't think that's very likely though.
Isn't the game called "Dating my Daughter"? It isn't "Daughter's story" or "D's Adventures in Adultland", of course the game is all about the father and the way he handles the relationship with his daughter (and all his other escapades). The daughter is an extremely sheltered kid with the mind and behavior of pre-teen, one that feels extremely grateful/indebted to the father for "rescuing her" from the prison her mother confined her in for most of her life.
It would actually be baffling if she suddenly starts sneaking around his back or even considering taking other partners without getting his OK first due to her childish mindset (she even has a wedding nightmare after just fooling around with Elena ffs, she will not suddenly mature just because she had sex a few times). The father however holds all the cards here and can do whatever he wants behind her back as long as she does not find out, and goad D in whatever direction he wants as his mindset has no restrictions like the daughter's (unless you are on the D only path of course).
It would actually be baffling if she suddenly starts sneaking around his back or even considering taking other partners without getting his OK first due to her childish mindset (she even has a wedding nightmare after just fooling around with Elena ffs, she will not suddenly mature just because she had sex a few times). The father however holds all the cards here and can do whatever he wants behind her back as long as she does not find out, and goad D in whatever direction he wants as his mindset has no restrictions like the daughter's (unless you are on the D only path of course).
- Nov 11, 2017
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This seems a rather inconsistent analysis of MrDots' otherwise consistent storytelling style.
While they are certainly adding in more ideas and responding to the fans as they go along (e.g., Season 4 plans), they had also telegraphed the grand strokes some time ago. Wasting episodes with bloat for no reason other than fan service is the opposite of their creative style: as Jeff has clearly mentioned, elements in their stories exist to build upon and not as mere filler because they ran out of ideas. The story is always being served, essentially.
DMD had already taken off before Melody was brought up practically overnight and in response to Patreon's ban of the former game - it wasn't the other way around. Again, we know the general endgame for DMD: it's just that the path to get there has been altered due to timing from funding and development delays (due to parallelism), circumstance (the Patreon ban and parallelism) and some rethink from community interaction (e.g., bestiality) plus the opportunity that Melody provided to continue elaborating on details of the DMD story. Acting as if DMD has been generated in a half-assed manner seems a grossly off-beat base of any argument you could possibly offer here.
Instead, it's more a simple matter: MrDots' team decided that their definition of NTR can't exist in a highly specialized manner of viewing the universe, which allows for the MC to cheat and D to only act under his controls. So, D's additional freedom to swing/swap on her own - even with prior MC general consent - can never occur, because they act as if that falls under NTR (again, even if prior consent was offered). This also blocks her ability to be enabled for cheating to the same level as the MC. Sure, you are playing as the MC, but we have also been provided D as someone equally as important to this story overall - treating her like a Stepford Wife (in symbolic form) is certainly an interesting option to offer in the game, but it's either that or vanilla (i.e., fully dedicated path). So, the prior history between them seems rather misleading if you are on a non-dedicated path.
Analyzing that point in DMD's context ... for a significant portion of the story, our MC's stated goal - despite his lusting - was to free D from her mother's virtual prison. They then grew to talk about everything from living together (now in progress) to marriage (now openly proposed) to a family (still open), among other things. As D's freedom to express herself has grown, she has naturally let her sexual side fly in ways that her repression likely helped to launch after the openness she found with the MC. And now, after all this development ... the MC calls the shots for her life, under the guise of a loving fiance. Because he still wields the power multiplier of being her father. A beneficent cad.
Of course some people will look at this and naturally call foul, given the history we've seen thus far. This manipulation by the MC applies mostly to the non-dedicated D paths, of course: everything from a single liaison to a full harem. For, in the dedicated path, we can at least limit the MC to the same experience range as D (to an extent); however, in no path can D continue to grow into her potential that has been clearly offered.
I actually play both the dedicated and full-out paths for each installment, which makes the differences in their abilities to choose even more stark in the playing experience. Truly, given that MC is a manipulative son-of-a-bitch for the non-dedicated paths, they should have considered altering his dialogue far more than simply showing concern for juggling competing affair schedules: this character should be portrayed as the selfish ogre that he is, helping to rescue his daughter from one controlled situation and grooming her for another. I feel this is a failing in the portrayal of the MC in DMD, frankly: we as players can see what is happening, but the MC's disposition in both types of paths is otherwise quite similar, as if he's oblivious to his controlling manner (or is simply a psychopath) - this creates much dissonance in the story with D as the other protagonist, I feel.
Therefore, a practical option would be to grant the other protagonist - that they took endless episodes to build up - with the ability to shake up the story and meet his level of craft and/or duplicity: give her a life beyond a happy cuckoo (which would make the non-dedicated paths FAR more interesting.) It's not as if MrDots hasn't done this in parallel work with Melody and shown it can be effective, even if you are ostensibly playing as the MC in that game. Indeed, I often hear a consistent refrain of how the story now feels on cruise control: while I don't feel that's true, I would wager part of that is because the lack of friction in the main storyline (even for non-dedicated path) outside of the modelling competition is rather low. There's only so far you can go with entertainment value when a MC is successfully juggling schedules for their sexual affairs and cheating on their fiance (constantly) as the primary style of personal relationships to explore.
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- Oct 13, 2016
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New Kid, your logic is faulty, if this should be taken literally, it should only be father and daughter, and nobody else.
not sure how u can use that as argument and in the same time give the father opportunities to do what the fuck he wants.
initially the story was about corruption, bestiality and who knows what more, but money talks and pushed the dev to change.
so, even here, we can argue that the title initially was not to be taken literally, and that the story could go in any direction.
for me, this "push" made the game worse, if MrDots was to make this game into whatever he wanted, Im sure we would have a much better game with a more consistent Mc and hotter scenes and more variety. this "borefication" is your fault.
not sure how u can use that as argument and in the same time give the father opportunities to do what the fuck he wants.
initially the story was about corruption, bestiality and who knows what more, but money talks and pushed the dev to change.
so, even here, we can argue that the title initially was not to be taken literally, and that the story could go in any direction.
for me, this "push" made the game worse, if MrDots was to make this game into whatever he wanted, Im sure we would have a much better game with a more consistent Mc and hotter scenes and more variety. this "borefication" is your fault.
Isn't she interested about Ryan or even, to some point, about Martin ? It doesn't seem to be specifically MC's wish, but her own interest. Of course she wouldn't do anything behind his back, but that's another thing.
There is only so much freedom that we can have. It is still a narrative and MrDots is the one guiding the narrative. To make the game so every single possible direction a story can go would be a massive undertaking. You can even complain that there was no option for F to not want to see his daughter right at the start of the game once you open that can of worms.
Except D is already making her own decisions. We the player have been given direct control over her decisions at various points in the story, just on a smaller level than MC. The relationship with Elena was D's choice. The MC had absolutely no input in that decision. Some of D's choices in the game have actually been born out of things the MC didn't intend. She only got the idea of modelling after Richard mentioned it and her photo won a competition. Starting on the path to being a model was her decision and MC supported her in that though he made sure it was done safely. The MC has never once suggested she become a lifeguard but D has expressed an interest in pursuing that thanks to Olivia. That will probably be dropped going forward when she becomes a famous model though, but that was her decision to at least start.
I don't think they half assed it. I'm sure they're very organized and at this point they have a good idea about where the story is going and what they want to include to get it there. I'm just pointing out that what the game is now, the sheer volume of the story, wasn't in their plans at the start. The reason I brought up Melody is because that game was developed differently. They seemed to have a better idea of it's plotting and the motivations of the characters before they created it. Which is why it seems much more evenly paced and believable than DMD. Partly because DMD was first, but also probably largely a function of an incestual romance requiring shallow, unbelievable characters for it to exist in the first place. If DMD was real, it would be horrifying, and by extension if the game and it's characters were portrayed realistically, it would be an entirely different story.
Again, that's by design. D is not a fully realized believable character, as you and so many others have pointed out. She is an extension of the fantasy. I'm not disagreeing with you. You're right, based on everything that's happened to D there is plenty of room for growth outside the unhealthy relationship with her father.
My argument is not about what the story should be, or could be, but what it is, that it's always been that way, and that it doesn't show any signs of ever being anything other than a simple stereotypical wish fulfillment power fantasy. His control over her choices and progression is the fantasy. That's why there's petals around her portrait in game. It's the slow corruption of a naive loli fuckdoll, but all through the lens of the MC's wishes, and from his pov.
- Nov 11, 2017
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Well, this is where I've documented my stark disagreement: D has long been portrayed as an imprisoned princess in need of a prince to set her free. And that happened in a monumental fashion, wherein she not only recognized the opportunity before her but solidified that moment of leaving the prison in one of the peak emotional episodes of this game (almost rivalled by her loss of virginity, which was something of an extension of that moment, IMHO.)
The buildup to her moment of freedom came with impressive displays of conscientious thoughts by the MC on her behalf - mostly in how to enable her self-determination, but mixed with growing desire to be with her.
Again, the MC's narrative changed little between the exclusive and non-exclusive paths: in each case, he continues to think similarly. But, in the latter path he's fully lept beyond her and has grown to treat their relationship like merely another matter to schedule and balance with his others (based upon your choices for side-relationships). Unlike other games where I feel this has been done successfully - including Melody - there is little recognition of how deep his control/manipulation has become by Chapter 3 or what its consequences could be, as he's still acting as if it's Chapter 2 with D and no consequences will ever be realized. The fantasy of a princess in thrall was broken, yet now she's back in another tower. Now it's no longer fun, just a game of situations to manage because we know D will overlook anything that may come about in the end: she's been groomed too well.
Yet the dynamics have shifted markedly in the non-exclusive path through Chapter 3: sharing is only about D being shared, rather than anything else. It's a power play and the MC has no conscience about it - again, unlike many other games which offer this sense of realization in the MC's dialogue, to at least show some impact to the player of their choices when taken (which needn't be moralistic, but at least recognized for what they happen to be.)
This was not sold as a psychological control game to my knowledge and although I'm fine with MrDots making the game he desires, never have I seen the marketing go in that direction. I can be flexible on changes over time, especially given all the circumstances of its tumultuous fight to simply exist, but the flower petals were often discussed as being "corruption" in the form of breaking down her sexual/relationship boundaries that she previously had as a locked-up princess, not turning her into merely a managed plaything for the MC's benefit. I realize the end effect could look very similar in terms of her practices that come into form, but the reasons for those actions should matter if the story was to remain consistent in purpose. Otherwise, MrDots should at least consider hinting that this is actually a sleeper psychological entrapment/break game at its core with an incredibly long grooming stage. To this date, their Dev team hasn't spoken in those types of themes, from what I can recall.
- Mar 16, 2018
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