Others Completed Future Fragments [v1.0.1] [HentaiWriter]

[Severthe]

Look, there's plenty to criticize about HW and their very small team but context does matter. They lack an ability to properly estimate anything and that should be rightly talked about as concernable or problematic. I'm just not a fan of the "criticism" I've seen lampooned here that feels more like easy dunks and snarky, entitled nonsense than actual critique.

Yeah, the way a lot of the people in this thread go on you'd think HW had personally hacked into their Steam account and deleted all their games or something. There's some really childish behaviour from many on this forum who are now gloating over the delays and deliberately trying to provoke HW with troll messages and spreading false info and speculation.

What's more is this is coming from people most of whom will likely never spend a cent on the game and are just impatiently waiting to pirate it. If FF is such a scam, where's the outrage from all the patrons requesting refunds from HW (as he's offered)? You don't hear it, cause nearly all the people whinging here and crying "another delay! shame!" are just waiting for what they consider a free game.

There was an old saying on the web about software along the lines of: if you're getting it for free, be grateful and don't hassle the devs. Shame that so many people feel so entitled these days.

 

[TJ412]

I'm looking forwards to it, whenever that happens to be. I get feeling misled and blue-balls'd over missed deadlines, but for most people here, their only investment is emotional - and by now it seems to have become more about getting vindication on all the negative things they've had to say, than the game its self.

The thing is that people with responsibilities, jobs, and the spare income to put towards a patreon - especially those who are in or have experience in software development or project management themselves - and who are financially invested in the product, are going to be much more understanding and forgiving when it comes to delays. If they weren't, they wouldn't continue funding. Things come up - unforseen delays happen at the last minute, team members' schedules are interrupted, you find that one thing that can "easily" be improved or polished, or any number of reasons something can be delayed by months, weeks, days. You can be spiteful, petty and entitled about it all you like, it's not going to make the game come out any faster, and it's only going to make the person it's directed towards that much less receptive to whatever else you might have to say.

When the game comes out, I will pirate it, and I'll be grateful that I can. I'll be grateful that HW isn't going out of their way to waste their time squashing links. And I'm grateful that they engaged with this forum at all, in spite of all the spite.

 

[Noble 6]

I'm just not a fan of the "criticism" I've seen lampooned here that feels more like easy dunks and snarky, entitled nonsense than actual critique.

There were critique posts and reviews.
They were deleted at the request of the developer.
It got so bad that the moderators made a separate thread to make fun of him for doing that.

 

[Nijinda Futatama]

Yeah, the way a lot of the people in this thread go on you'd think HW had personally hacked into their Steam account and deleted all their games or something. There's some really childish behaviour from many on this forum who are now gloating over the delays and deliberately trying to provoke HW with troll messages and spreading false info and speculation.

What's more is this is coming from people most of whom will likely never spend a cent on the game and are just impatiently waiting to pirate it. If FF is such a scam, where's the outrage from all the patrons requesting refunds from HW (as he's offered)? You don't hear it, cause nearly all the people whinging here and crying "another delay! shame!" are just waiting for what they consider a free game.

There was an old saying on the web about software along the lines of: if you're getting it for free, be grateful and don't hassle the devs. Shame that so many people feel so entitled these days.

This place breeds entitlement. It's not just this thread, its every thread the moment there is any kind of problem or slow down with development or even changes to character designs or fetish content. Conspiracy theories, scam accusations, and plenty of fake news immediately come out. Not to mention people immediately trying to cancel the game... on a pirate site.

This game may deserve the criticism, sure. But you are spot on about the entitled snobs that gather at this site and spout off nonsense.

 

[HardcoreCuddler]

Look, there's plenty to criticize about HW and their very small team but context does matter. They lack an ability to properly estimate anything and that should be rightly talked about as concernable or problematic. I'm just not a fan of the "criticism" I've seen lampooned here that feels more like easy dunks and snarky, entitled nonsense than actual critique.

Pretty much...thanks for having common sense compared to some others around here. Some of the criticism around here has been plain false, other criticism made wrong assumptions, and most of them were very subjective or needlessly predictive.

Critique what? We have nothing to critique save for missed release dates and the occasional personal message, that's the major issue. I'd love to critique the new fire demo, believe me, but a month has come and gone and I'm still waiting for the mythical '24 hours' to arrive.

That's literaly the whole point. We've nothing to critique yet people have been spamming this freaking thread like mad.
This is why the other thread was created ffs - people just wouldn't shut the hell up no matter what the mods did, even though the game stopped getting updates. People were just clicking this thread to say "omg it's been ONE MORE DAY since last I've complained that this game isn't out yet" like mf, we get it, go touch some fucking grass and move on...

 

[silver24240]

Any chance of positive reception at this point has been destroyed, to the extent that I don't even think a free release at christmas 2023 will fix it for most posters.

And that's what makes it all the more painful, because from the demos I've played there really is a fun platformer there buried behind all the delays and whatnot. If not for the dev schedule being constantly pushed back this could have been one of the most positively received h-games in recent memory, but because it keeps getting delayed the frustration just compounds on itself

 

[Xeline]

I honestly think HWs ambition (despite have a tiny as fuck team) is probably my biggest hangup with development and I've only followed this game for almost two years. I've told them this to their face.

Having reasonable expectations and aspirations is important.

 

[lraas]

Almost a month ago I joked about the fire level demo not being released in 2023 and it's looking more and more to become reality. I hope to eat my words in the next few weeks but currently the way things seem to be going it mighty doesnt look like the fire level demo or the game itself will see a release this year or ever

 

[HardcoreCuddler]

I honestly think HWs ambition (despite have a tiny as fuck team) is probably my biggest hangup with development and I've only followed this game for almost two years. I've told them this to their face.

Having reasonable expectations and aspirations is important.

I really think that a platformer with some interesting mechanics, voiced dialogue, different story paths and sex is perfectly reasonable.
It's a lot of content to put in place, sure, but the most groundbreaking stuff (relative to the rest of the game) are the weird combat mechanics.
It's not THAT ambitious, but what they seem to be going STRONG for is quality, which I can't condemn AT ALL. I'd rather have this game release in fucking 2025 than be another generic game from F95 that I don't even think to pay for. I just hope it works out for them financially.

Perhaps you should take your own 'advice' and give this thread an unwatch for a bit then if it gets to you so much, since you seem to be one of the more prevalent posters with each reply being the internet equivalent of an aneurism whenever people launch into another round of 'complain about missed promises'. You're a member of HW's discord anyway I imagine, which is where the real update information is posted, so you won't lose much.

FF at the moment is in a similar situation to other games like Pure Onyx and Fallen Doll, lack of updates/shitty progress has tainted it so much that if something is added (even potentially on time) you'll still find complaints coming in left and right. It also doesn't help that HW in particular actively tries to manipulate discussion to such an extent that even f95zone moderators soured on having to do all the cleanup. They love that shit.

Any chance of positive reception at this point has been destroyed, to the extent that I don't even think a free release at christmas 2023 will fix it for most posters.

I won't take a break from this thread, because I check it to see if the game released, though you make a good point that I should just look in the discord instead of looking at all the crap going around here. But you know, I thought these threads were mainly for fans, players and supporters of the games, not for the haters. My bad for the misunderstanding.

 

[sirretinee]

I thought these threads were mainly for fans, players and supporters of the games, not for the haters. My bad for the misunderstanding.

The two groups aren't mutually exclusive, though it's pretty disingenuous to label anybody not in the first groups as a hater.
There are plenty of us who were supporters (or still are) who've grown to be upset with the dev cycle and dev's behavior in this (and other site's) thread(s). We can still like the game- still think the game itself is great, but also be unhappy with the swamp of bullshit it's mired in. Not everybody who has something even slightly negative to say wants to see the dev burn, or whatever.

 

[D4n0w4r]

I'm just tired of seeing this cycle occur again and again in this industry. It's not a bad thing to keep your scope small in order to make deliveries in a timely manner.

 

[Noble 6]

I really think that a platformer with some interesting mechanics, voiced dialogue, different story paths and sex is perfectly reasonable.

It's not "9 years" reasonable.
Even AAA games only take like 3 years, same with contemporary h-platformer games.

but the most groundbreaking stuff (relative to the rest of the game) are the weird combat mechanics.

There's nothing "groundbreaking" about the combat. It's just a slower Megaman, in terms of gameplay. You jump, you shoot, you charge an elemental attack, and you have a dash button.
If anything, it's a Megaman Z game but without wall-sliding. You even have your Cyber Elves in the form of random equipment items.

You might have had a fraction of a point if you were talking about the dialogue choices and affinity stuff, since that's rare in platformers. But it's also not unheard of nor groundbreaking.

But you know, I thought these threads were mainly for fans, players and supporters of the games, not for the haters. My bad for the misunderstanding.

No. Since the internet started, there's been flaming threads making fun of things like the N64 vs PS1 rivalry.
A thread about a videogame isn't for dicksucking the game. It's for discussing the game, the good and the bad.
And look at that, the game hasn't changed gameplay-wise since ~2018 when it added equipment, and it also still isn't out yet!

 

[Bulbanych]

I wouldn't class people like this as haters, I'd class them in the supporters category. Hell, I AM in that position as well, and I don't think ANYONE here is happy about everything that's happening to the game.

My god I'm so fucking tired of people comparing this to other games. Other games don't have dev teams of THREE FUCKING PEOPLE you imbecile...

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I've taken over a year to build 2 half-assed mobile apps and server that barely work together using a few hours a day, with basicaly no features, just as a project, so 9 years is in fact reasonable considering the team size, team composition and scope of the game.
If you disagree, I don't care, I won't read your reply just like I didn't read the rest of this one, because this subject is nothing but subjectivity hell and arguing about it is pointless.

The guy really wrote all that, just to say "I didn't read your post, and won't read your replies".

 

[Mhiggey]

People really like to talk about the whole nine years thing, but what I'd be interested in at the end is the financial breakdown of the project. How much money came in over that 9 years, what it was spent on, and how much was brought in from the actual sales of the game. Is there an identifiable point in development where the cost of the features added surpassed the amount of earnings I wonder.

 

[Xeline]

My god I'm so fucking tired of people comparing this to other games. Other games don't have dev teams of THREE FUCKING PEOPLE you imbecile...

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I agree that this is an important contextual point that nobody really thinks about. Most dev teams have more than three people. Most people in this thread who have called HW a scam artist, liar, etc. have no idea how game development works.

On the flip side,

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was only one dude and it went from being an estimated three months development time (lol) to over three years. Bit smaller in scope than Future Fragments but its my comparison point often on this point. So I can see why people think HW has overestimated or packed too many elements into their platformer which have made development slow down to a crawl.

The guy really wrote all that, just to say "I didn't read your post, and won't read your replies".

More like "if you don't understand that three people can only accomplish so much in a certain frame of time and how game development works, you're an idiot, so don't bother replying". Which is true.

 

[Mhiggey]

I agree that this is an important contextual point that nobody really thinks about.

Probably because going 'it only has three people working on it' is a pretty shitty attempt at defence when talking about a 2D hentai platformer game. That size of team (or often smaller) is the norm for games in the genre, and plenty of those games didn't take nine years and a few hundred thousand dollars worth of crowdfunding to release on time. Lone Jap devs (granted they are pretty dedicated at times) can turn out comparable games in three to four years with perhaps one artist outsourced.

And please, because I can already see it coming, no Future Fragments is not extremely complex gameplay wise to the point that the dev time is justified. Hell, dev themselves have said that they massively fucked up the development process and bit off more than they could chew, but continued on as if everything was fine anyway. The big difference it brings to the table is the voice acting and the... lore cutscenes/databanks.

More like "if you don't understand that three people can only accomplish so much in a certain frame of time and how game development works, you're an idiot, so don't bother replying". Which is true.

They are still taking money for this, every month passed is another month of income without needing to release a game for sale. If HW is to be believed, then the project has consumed so much money that they had to take out loans in order to continue development despite the income they are making from crowdfunding. For a 2D, sidescroller porn platformer.

They have failed to meet multiple release targets and they have failed to stick to their budget. Their 'PR guy' has pissed off multiple forums, publicly batted for both Eromancer and Divine Arms in a professional capacity, and lied about steam policy to cover their arse. They can't even organise a release of the (still MIA by a month the way) fire level demo, which is the first level of the game and a stage I played all the way back in 2018 before massive lore databanks and cutscenes were even a major thing. It also has to be noted that this future demo release is of the 'unpolished' demo, with the 'polished' demo coming 'soon after' it.

To accuse people in this thread of not understanding game development time frames or basic project management practices while holding up Future Fragments as your shining example of a counterpoint is frankly ridiculous. When a finished product is released for sale, functional and relatively bug free, then we can talk about how great the platforming is or how worth it the story cutscenes are.

Until then shit will be heaped on every promised released date skipped, and the salt will flow at every tired excuse repeated over and over. It is what it is.

EDIT:

Sorry, just had to pop this in to make it clear the calibre of bullshit HW is peddling.



"Prease understandu, small indie dev team" my hairy arse with those claims. Taken from the steam forums if people don't believe that this is a real claim from HW.

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[burgerman69]

More like "if you don't understand that three people can only accomplish so much in a certain frame of time and how game development works, you're an idiot, so don't bother replying". Which is true.

That's the majority of indie games. Just because you suck at coding doesn't mean you can blanket apply your standards to everyone especially when there's more than enough real world examples showing otherwise. You have games like terraria(less than a year), undertale(less than 3 years), the binding of isaac(months), banished(less than 3 years by a single guy),stardew valley and bright memory being developed by 3 or less people. I mean bright memory was developed over a couple of years by a single dev in his part time and that one actually does look like and play like a triple A game. The small dev team taking nearly a decade to make a 2d platformer doesn't fly when they've already missed practically every single deadline they themselves announced.

 

[Bulbanych]

When FF finally releases:

 

[Xeline]

Well, those circles are certainly more efficient and perceptive of their own capacities as a dev team. You can't argue with that.

 

[D4n0w4r]

The japanese continue to flex on the western h-industry as usual.