VN Ren'Py Completed My Sister, My Roommate [v1.69] [Sumodeine]

[Rythan25]

WTF ? why did this one lose the "completed" tag ? that makes me angry *hulks out*....

EDIT - just read the post about Sumo's plans... well damn... was hoping this was the end, and he would move on... after all as I said before most of the anger is still coming from the people that were adamant about wanting a Nikki ending... getting endings for awesome Skylar, maybe Sarah and... lame gym sock Cory would make me change my rating for the game, but will do little to convince the Nikki lovers...

 

[DA22]

I don't know if I'm a fan of this development.

No, the ending was good but not perfect and Yes, I would have liked some fooling around with Nikki at the end.

But it feels to me that fans pressuring the writer to change his story....I'm not a fan of that.
I like to play the way the Dev had it in his mind. I do not mind fan criticism and I do not mind the Dev changing his mind halfway through the story.

But this feels like the dev was "forced" to change his story, due to over the top criticism on his ending.

The dev needs his fan, so I understand him buckling under pressure, but this just feels wrong to me. Imagine DrPinkCakes changing the outcome of the Fire in Acting lessons? Then it's not his story anymore.

I'm sorry I don't like this.

Well I have read Sumo's full post on Patreon and based on that, I more got the feeling that Sumo took a little distance from his own feelings and thought about some of the criticisms and came to the conclusion that some of those criticisms had more merit as he liked and he decided for that reason he needed to rework the game for his own reasons. Well at least I hope that is the case, if he would rework the game just to appease people without his heart being in it I would def advise him to move on to a new project and take the lessons he learned from this game to heart.

Now personally I would not mind a twist if he would like to keep the low self confidence Nikki theme, to maybe have Nikki come out that her trying to get Tales out of his shell was also a test for Tales to see whether he would still love her (the one she cares most of in the world) if had relations with other women.

We people with self esteem issues like to do such stupid things and it would also explain why she finally did decide to make their relation sexual when she was a bit to successful in getting Tales out of his shell, since she was afraid to lose him and base Nikki's growth and endings based on that finding out that Tales either would choose her or if chooses someone else, he still loves her just as much as he always did and find freedom in that and happily settles down with Tales, Tales and Molly, with another guy or if Tales is only man she trusts and not available with another woman (Nikki swings both ways sexually after all and she seems to have more healthy relationships with females as males overall). Up to Sumo though how he sees it and wants to change it.

 

[Rythan25]

So Suomodeine made a post on their Patreon reagarding this its fairly long so I'll link to it for people that want to read the whole thing but here is what I think is the important bit for many here.


Full post for anyone that wants to read it:

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Wait I dont get it, why would the game need a name change for Steam ? After all, its a story about a "sister" who is also a "roommate" wasnt that what certain attack dogs kept trying to hammer into us for the past two years ?

 

[DA22]

Wait I dont get it, why would the game need a name change for Steam ? After all, its a story about a "sister" who is also a "roommate" wasnt that what certain attack dogs kept trying to hammer into us for the past two years ?

Steam might like the game to hide the incest elements a bit better and not already have them in the title. I suspect Sumo made that remark based on info he has.

 

[Goblin Baily: DILF]

No... the game doesn't have it yet, but coming to a site near you... it will, there's nothing wrong with a little fan fiction.

I hope you do the same for other games people bitched about. weren't happy with the ending... I've been told that people weren't happy with Philly killing off Stella. And the housefire pushed people away from Acting lessons....
not giving them an alternative path would be a dreadfull inujustice towards people that play other games.

 

[josephfdredd]

I'm fine with Sumodeine having the occasional preach at people. As far as I'm concerned, it's his game and he's free to put whatever he wants in it. Just click through it if you don't care to read it.

Now that said, I did notice at least one scene I didn't see-- there's a picture of Skylar (Flower Girl) in what might be some kind of club? Also is there a scene where Taylor gets with Sarah if he hasn't become Molly's boyfriend?

 

[DA22]

I'm fine with Sumodeine having the occasional preach at people. As far as I'm concerned, it's his game and he's free to put whatever he wants in it. Just click through it if you don't care to read it.

Now that said, I did notice at least one scene I didn't see-- there's a picture of Skylar (Flower Girl) in what might be some kind of club? Also is there a scene where Taylor gets with Sarah if he hasn't become Molly's boyfriend?

Not an ending but yeah he can have a one time fling with Sarah if he is not with Molly at a certain time. Never could bring myself to say yes to Molly path and then cheating on her though, so no idea what happens then.

 

[wurg]

I hope you do the same for other games people bitched about. weren't happy with the ending... I've been told that people weren't happy with Philly killing off Stella. And the housefire pushed people away from Acting lessons....
not giving them an alternative path would be a dreadfull inujustice towards people that play other games.

I could do that, the world is full of possibilities, it only takes a little imagination for them to come to fruition. I made the mod on what the game was telling me, not what a forum post said, or what other people thought, what I saw in the game. Just like Sumo, what I see and others see are two different things. Everyone sees the world through there own eyes, and not through someone else's.

I expect some backlash from doing the mod, and that's fine, I respect others opinions, I firmly believe everyone has their own voice and is allowed to use it without fear of repercussion. I'm sorry you didn't like it, and I'll look into the other games you suggested, you never know, I might be able to come up with something for you.

 

[DA22]

I could do that, the world is full of possibilities, it only takes a little imagination for them to come to fruition. I made the mod on what the game was telling me, not what a forum post said, or what other people thought, what I saw in the game. Just like Sumo, what I see and others see are two different things. Everyone sees the world through there own eyes, and not through someone else's.

I expect some backlash from doing the mod, and that's fine, I respect others opinions, I firmly believe everyone has their own voice and is allowed to use it without fear of repercussion. I'm sorry you didn't like it, and I'll look into the other games you suggested, you never know, I might be able to come up with something for you.

Personally I think you did the Nikki endings pretty symphatetic and not to unbelievable, but others will disagree.

Personally I also would have loved it though if Sumo would have had a real twist in the endings and had made an ending where if Tales rejected Molly and based on the no Tales-Nikki ending, it would have been Nikki ending up with Molly in the end.

Edit: though that would be opening a worms can of possible future permutations and emotions between the three or four if Tales would not have ended up alone.

 

[Burt Reynolds Mustache]

I don't know if I'm a fan of this development.

No, the ending was good but not perfect and Yes, I would have liked some fooling around with Nikki at the end.

But it feels to me that fans pressuring the writer to change his story....I'm not a fan of that.
I like to play the way the Dev had it in his mind. I do not mind fan criticism and I do not mind the Dev changing his mind halfway through the story.

But this feels like the dev was "forced" to change his story, due to over the top criticism on his ending.

The dev needs his fan, so I understand him buckling under pressure, but this just feels wrong to me. Imagine DrPinkCakes changing the outcome of the Fire in Acting lessons? Then it's not his story anymore.

I'm sorry I don't like this.

Well if you read the whole post Sumo in many ways felt pressured to NOT do a Nikki ending even after he knew that things had changed while writing. This isn't a perfect scenario in either case. So long as it is what Sumo wants to do then it is still his. Stories don't happen in a vacuum. Especially ones that have the strange release structure that Patreon gives us. Most books and stories have editors and others who chime in during the production.

Sumo basically said that he likely would have done a Nikki ending of some sort had he not announced that he would NOT do one publicly and often early on. The more negative reactions he got the more he felt he COULD NOT cave in even though things had moved in that direction.

That being said... it is his call. I also don't quite agree with the customer is always right either or that successful always equals good. I think MSMR is far better than games that make a ton more than it does... and it takes a lot for someone to realize that sometimes the story you set out to tell isn't always the story you end up telling. A lot of writers never learn that lesson.

 

[Quaszog55]

So Suomodeine made a post on their Patreon reagarding this its fairly long so I'll link to it for people that want to read the whole thing but here is what I think is the important bit for many here.

Totally ignoring Nikki-
....
I like a lot about Sumo's writing but he laid out a 5 star banquet but we were served a 3 star set menu.

The Molly ending is fine. I even like it. Because it is consistent in what it tried to achieve. The fact, that it fucks your playing style over and punishes you for watching all the good renders instead of the boring shit, is even cute. Self defeating, but cute.

What is not fine, is the fact that, everyone not following the Dev diary, played a game (with a needless incest patch), that would not deliver the 'Title Girl' as a full romance option, with very little in-game reference right before the last quarter of the game, at which point the game had already locked into its ultimate fail state. Red herrings, loose ends and a bachanalium of content only made the crash so much more painful.
It becomes even worse for the people who joined much later in the production process, why would they bother reading TWO YEAR OLD Dev entries? If I ever read them, i probably forgot all of them in the mean time anyway.

So again: Why sell apples in a banana crate and then tell me at the cash registry that the store-owner quit selling bananas two years ago?
Was it so hard to change the Cover-art, Banner, Title-screen and Game Title to be more on point and put Molly's face somewhere?

If a product (game, book, movie, strip-club) cannot communicate through itself, what it wants to achieve, it fails. So this game failed and now everyone rooting for it is disappointed.
I mean, think all about the people, who would have ditched the game at 0.1x and wouldn't even have bothered to help salt-mining here, this Christmas? Na better not, with 'Sisterly Lust' and 'The Visit' also doing a (rather) hard finish, some hate might have unjustly befallen them instead.

 

[Burt Reynolds Mustache]

The Molly ending is fine. I even like it. Because it is consistent in what it tried to achieve. The fact, that it fucks your playing style over and punishes you for watching all the good renders instead of the boring shit, is even cute. Self defeating, but cute.

What is not fine, is the fact that, everyone not following the Dev diary, played a game (with a needless incest patch), that would not deliver the 'Title Girl' as a full romance option, with very little in-game reference right before the last quarter of the game, at which point the game had already locked into its ultimate fail state. Red herrings, loose ends and a bachanalium of content only made the crash so much more painful.
It becomes even worse for the people who joined much later in the production process, why would they bother reading TWO YEAR OLD Dev entries? If I ever read them, i probably forgot all of them in the mean time anyway.

So again: Why sell apples in a banana crate and then tell me at the cash registry that the store-owner quit selling bananas two years ago?
Was it so hard to change the Cover-art, Banner, Title-screen and Game Title to be more on point and put Molly's face somewhere?

If a product (game, book, movie, strip-club) cannot communicate through itself, what it wants to achieve, it fails. So this game failed and now everyone rooting for it is disappointed.
I mean, think all about the people, who would have ditched the game at 0.1x and wouldn't even have bothered to help salt-mining here, this Christmas? Na better not, with 'Sisterly Lust' and 'The Visit' also doing a (rather) hard finish, some hate might have unjustly befallen them instead.

I mean... I think he agrees in many ways hence why he is doing the edits and additional endings. The thing is even with Nikki nig being the main LI exactly she was the main female character. In many ways not having her be endgame is an interesting concept but even Sumo can say that it wasn't handled as well as he would have liked and that concept changed in practice. Either way expanded endings are coming along with redone early game graphics. Win win.

 

[jjoron95]

i don't know what to do to have nikki ending and molly ending

 

[Goblin Baily: DILF]

The Molly ending is fine. I even like it. Because it is consistent in what it tried to achieve. The fact, that it fucks your playing style over and punishes you for watching all the good renders instead of the boring shit, is even cute. Self defeating, but cute.

What is not fine, is the fact that, everyone not following the Dev diary, played a game (with a needless incest patch), that would not deliver the 'Title Girl' as a full romance option, with very little in-game reference right before the last quarter of the game, at which point the game had already locked into its ultimate fail state. Red herrings, loose ends and a bachanalium of content only made the crash so much more painful.
It becomes even worse for the people who joined much later in the production process, why would they bother reading TWO YEAR OLD Dev entries? If I ever read them, i probably forgot all of them in the mean time anyway.

So again: Why sell apples in a banana crate and then tell me at the cash registry that the store-owner quit selling bananas two years ago?
Was it so hard to change the Cover-art, Banner, Title-screen and Game Title to be more on point and put Molly's face somewhere?

If a product (game, book, movie, strip-club) cannot communicate through itself, what it wants to achieve, it fails. So this game failed and now everyone rooting for it is disappointed.
I mean, think all about the people, who would have ditched the game at 0.1x and wouldn't even have bothered to help salt-mining here, this Christmas? Na better not, with 'Sisterly Lust' and 'The Visit' also doing a (rather) hard finish, some hate might have unjustly befallen them instead.

Sisterly lust is where you shot your own foot.... The vast majority of people loved the ending except for those who picked the Bella dom route, and were surprised that they weren't having pregnancy on her route

 

[DrDerpington]

To be honest, I had big expectations and unfortunately it ended up as 2nd worst ending I have seen so far. (1st spot obviously goes for Acting Lessons by infernal Dr.PinkCake)

I will postpone my review, because there have been some talk about possible alternate endings by author. Lets hope he fixes this disappointment.

Molly is kinda nice, but in my oppinion author shouldnt tease audience with waifu Nikki and then screw them over. Contrary to author's belief, (biased) political talk at end doesnt make things better.

 

[WindIsHowling]

Didn't think the video was worth posting here too?? I'm really proud of that thing...

You must be registered to see the links

Huge respect for the choice you've made. Takes a lot for people on here to admit their creation isn't perfect these days. Personally I believe the main problem with the ending was the relationship between Taylor and Nikki had so much weight and seemed to end so suddenly. The characters didn't seem to be that honest with each other about how upset they were. In fact they didn't seem that upset at all. It seemed brief and out of place. Look forward to see how you improve the game in future!

 

[Quaszog55]

Either way expanded endings are coming along with redone early game graphics. Win win.

Call me a bitch now but... if Dev's passion burns for another project, I would rather see him doing THAT one instead of beating a dead horse. Nonetheless, kudos for rounding up the project at the end. My care factor was big enough to cry a river, so I want to see it end properly.

Didn't think the video was worth posting here too?? I'm really proud of that thing...

Never change, just get better.

 

[botc76]

Didn't think the video was worth posting here too?? I'm really proud of that thing...

You must be registered to see the links

You addressed a lot of what could be criticized after the ending and I'm not sure what I should add.
TBH, I was really disappointed, but didn't feel like adding even more fuel to the fire, when there was already a firestorm racing over you.
Okay, here are some thoughts. I think the main problem wasn't even the non-existing Nikki ending, even though it always seemed as if you pushed them closer and closer together. It also wasn't the Molly ending, Molly is fucking cute and sweet, I would have wanted an ending with her. It's also in my book not the non-existence of ANY specific ending.

The problem is, you set out to do a visual novel and in the end we came quite close to a kinetic novel. All the choices seemed to be pretty meaningless and we got a sorta one good ending and apart from that only bad.
So, not a specific route missing was the problem, that you left NO route at all but Molly's was the problem.
It was also something I couldn't believe. I think I asked you every time after the last few updates, when you were going to fix the Cory relationship (suffice to say I don't think our MC bends himself any more to fit her personality than he does with any other, I mean he can talk a lot of bullshit with Molly, without meaning any of it. If he had the same sort of decision to make between having a serious relationship with Cory or continue lying, he could change), because I couldn't fathom that you were really going to axe all but the Molly route.

People want their choices to mean something. Even if you only have two girls to pursue and nothing else, it's better than being led to believe you can choose and then see you can't.

Don't get me wrong, Sumodeine. I like your game a lot and your writing and your humour and storytelling, but in a way that is of course also a part of why the ending was a disappointment.

I applaud your decision to work on the game again and perhaps offer a few more real options, it's something I would like to see from bigger devs as well. Not like Bioware which not only fucked up Mass Effect Andromeda, but even axxed the already planned story DLC.

It's interesting that we kind of see a similar thing going on with the VN "The Way" here on the board. Like yours, the game started out with several branching options and the dev really kept up with three completely different routes, but he brought two of them to a much too abrupt and unsatisfying ending and reactions from players led him to go back to it and to continue expanding those endings.

I don't think it's anything like winning or losing if you do something like this. Yes, a creator should create his own thing, but in the end I think most of you guys do it to see other people enjoy it, so there's nothing negative about being big enough to say I might not have done the best the story deserved, I will get back to working on it.

 

[noname888]

Is this the final version? If so, why is there no [Completed] tag?

 

[Burt Reynolds Mustache]

Is this the final version? If so, why is there no [Completed] tag?

Because the dev decided to go back and do some work on the game and expand the endings.