Yes, in the Ocean Universe, a romance between two tenants is an unforgivable act. We have a repeat of Three's Company with the unfortunate Nika Tripper all over again. If Nika doesn't have these problems with Mila and Robin, it's really unfair to Nami
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- Sep 26, 2023
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Me? Arguments? I just stopped for a second to ask what time it was. If only I knew what I was getting myself into...
You wanna examples?
7 Days To Die - over a decade in Alpha!, you can't be sure that the next update won't change the traits of a certain creature or even the game mechanics. In the previous version, you could dig an underground shelter and hungry zombies wouldn't find you, and in the next update, those bitches will dig up your ass and eat it.
Space engineers - another update and you can't figure out why your ship is now spinning like a top with the engines off.
Movies? Have you ever seen how at the end of some movies, when the credits roll, they put up a montage of the bad takes or the scenes that they cut out of the movie? Well, we're at the stage where the movie is just being shot and these bad takes or scenes that are going to be cut out are being made. It's early access not a finished product.
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Every single book that has been written has had this process. Especially once the publishers say, "hey we can't print your 1500 page book, but we can do 2 700 page books, and we'll print the second once we see there's interest in the first. You'll need to have a cliffhanger there." Or film. Why are there directors cuts? Because the director shot th film they wanted, then the executives said, "no get it under 120min kthnx, oh and lose that scene, you know, that one. It's central to the plot? Not according to our test screening".
The difference with TV is (like an AVN) it's pushed into the public space as episodes. Difference with the tv show to an AVN is that it still has a whole bunch or writing drafts in private. AVN's are the only form where I see creators publishing drafts. The early access mentality on gaming platforms legitimised this idea.
I'm not saying this is good practice, just that it isn't unusual for this kind of media.
THe other issue is every other form of content has executive teams that send the drafts back, while AVN writers are there own IT, HR, finance department etc. They're not just making the story up as they go along, they're making up their whole business model as a draft, stumbling along the way. It's less than ideal, but again, I can understand why it happens, and if it's too hit and miss, I can drop it and find something more consistent to play/read.
- Aug 16, 2022
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Every example I've read just shows me you guys suck at analogies
Not a fair comparison in the bunch.How is a damn movie in which the narrative is based on time travel and changing past events compare to SG or WiAB? (to address the not so clever superhero movies retort) How can you compare a test release, a screening for audiences or investors to a released AVN? There is already a published product here. A complete season 1 for which the developper has been charging money for years. It's not the same thing. A fair comparison would be releasing a movie in the theaters, having audience member buy tickets and watch it, then midway through the movie suddenly Act 1 has changed, one actor was recast and not a single explanation is given as to why the protagonists relationship with other characters completely changed.
Same with a book. Only the final version is published and monetized. Even if some revisions are made in future reprints and editions, they don't fucking turn the entire story or its characters on its head. And when a sequel comes out, 99.99% of the time it doesn't retroactively change the original.
But whatever this is just my opinion. We are allowed to disagree on this
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That's how crowdfunding works. Only you are wrong, you do not buy anything from the developer, but financially help him in development and receive various privileges for this, like early access to beta versions of the game, roles in Discord and other bells and whistles.
Now that the first season is finished, published and sold as a standalone, complete entity, I agree that plot changes in it would be very strange. But it seems like no one is going to do that?
- Dec 24, 2018
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There are multiple versions of monetised films. But I can recognise I'm nitpicking.Every example I've read just shows me you guys suck at analogies
How is a damn movie in which the narrative is based on time travel and changing past events compare to SG or WiAB? (to address the not so clever superhero movies retort) How can you compare a test release, a screening for audiences or investors to a released AVN? There is already a published product here. A complete season 1 for which the developper has been charging money for years. It's not the same thing. A fair comparison would be releasing a movie in the theaters, having audience member buy tickets and watch it, then midway through the movie suddenly Act 1 has changed, one actor was recast and not a single explanation is given as to why the protagonists relationship with other characters completely changed.
Same with a book. Only the final version is published and monetized. Even if some revisions are made in future reprints and editions, they don't fucking turn the entire story or its characters on its head. And when a sequel comes out, 99.99% of the time it doesn't retroactively change the original.
But whatever this is just my opinion. We are allowed to disagree on this
Maybe a better analogy then for you is building a house; you get progress checks, and see where the plasterer cut corners, or someone didn't follow the plan (far too common), or the price of material goes beyond the contract and there needs a variation. There are plenty of products that are monetised in various stages of completion. I don't see why this is a surprise with how long you've been around AVN's. It happens, and it's happened to a lot of games recently because of patreon. Ocean's being overly cautious maybe, but it's understandable even if it's not the desired outcome.
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Fair enough. But let me ask you this. If at any point in S2 or any future seasons, Ocean retcons any aspect from the already finished and published S1, will you agree with me? Or admit that I had a point?
Not looking for a "gotcha" here or to eventually throw an "I told you so" at your face. I just don't trust Ocean to not keep tampering with the established narrative and I'm trying to figure out why most people disagree with my points on how the story is being told.
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Haha, I wouldn't bet a dead mouse on that! Because he practically promised to do it, and on this very forum.
I can't find the post right now, but he let it slip that as the story progresses, some old scenes will appear in a completely different light, or even take on a meaning that is the opposite of what they mean now.
And then, without changing anything in the first season, you can easily add to or change the meaning of certain scenes with flashbacks or new scenes that expand on old ones. In Lost, for example, they did this all the time.
What if the damn raccoon isn't just an Easter egg, but the spirit of the dead Summer?
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I'll admit you have a point now - I'm not disagreeing but saying there are multiple ways to see this situation. I would prefer OCean to spend more time delivering nw content that second guessing the older content at this point, but if that's what's required, I'll just grin and bear it. Far more disturbing to me is the addition of multiple clothing styles to cause a massive spike in required renders for no major reason other than it's possible. That's my pet hate.
As far as the way the story's being told, it's partially because we weight the different aspects differently. I didn't rate the jacuzzi scene as important to character development while other people do. I prefer Nami now, while other people prefer her earlier. So in a sense, the changes have opened up parts of the story to me that I ignored earlier because of my preferences. Given that, there is no one way to understand whether it's be successful or not, noly whether you find it enjoyable to continue reading.
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Haha, I wouldn't bet a dead mouse on that! Because he practically promised to do it, and on this very forum.
I can't find the post right now, but he let it slip that as the story progresses, some old scenes will appear in a completely different light, or even take on a meaning that is the opposite of what they mean now.
And then, without changing anything in the first season, you can easily add to or change the meaning of certain scenes with flashbacks or new scenes that expand on old ones. In Lost, for example, they did this all the time.
What if the damn raccoon isn't just an Easter egg, but the spirit of the dead Summer?
late 2031, if we're lucky.
Ocean wants to make sure he releases S2 as a whole at once.
...
- Nov 22, 2020
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If you're asking about the first chapter of S2, the only thing Ocean wrote was that it would be out later this year. But judging by the latest devlogs, the work is far from finished, so I probably wouldn't put much hope in it. Most likely, it will be early next year, imho.
If you mean the whole second season, I don't think anyone knows, including the dev.
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Every 2 weeks there is a devlog that kind patrons repost here. The most recent one was here. Sometimes there is useful info in the WiaB devlog, which is every two weeks also, but in the alternate weeks. This week is a WiaB devlog, which has a brief mention of SG, but more importantly mentions how Ocean's progress is going, and his sense of direction moving forward. He doesn't give away much, but you get used to reading between the lines.
Link is in the OP here but it's most likely outdated by now. It's still kept current, but Ocean's been keeping the details to himself.
Kata was my pick for Nick's ex wife - she's overly competitive in sport, so it would be easy to see how her personality became Zara's. Previously also, she was part of the Zane clan which meant she was a potential carrier of the heterochromia gene. Now though, the only people carrying that gene are William and Leia.
Edit: to be clear, she's still part of the Zane clan, it's just William and Leia that aren't genetically part of it anymore (Also, it could be that Vanessa suffered physical abuse causing the heterochromia. Hers is very distinctly different to they way it appears in William). The current state of things though? I have no idea who Nick's ex wife was, it was just me trying to fit someone plausible into the gap.
Mila I think is more likely the daughter of one of Leia's showgirls. I have no proof, but at least some of the characters in SG will not be related. If you look at Daphne in WiaB for example, she's a pretty similar model to Miriam and Nora, face and hairstyle, but it's be more likely they're Gina's kids (and possibly William's). Daphne also has plenty of similarities to Nami. Trying to work these out is even harder than convincing the whole thread Ayua is WIlliam and Miru's daughter. If the thread can't get consensus on that, it's going to take a while for us to discover these theories.
Also, if Kata was Mila's mom, the Holgerson's would be unlikely to charge her, as that would be going against the Zane clan, unless Kata disowned the Zane's and hit rock bottom. I'd think that Katie wouldn't let her cousin live a life of poverty.
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For me Ayua is William's daughter, since she calls Kate aunt, the only Zane would be Dylan... I've already formed a theory that Nami is very similar to Daphne and the only explanation for her being an "orphan" is that something happened to Daphne during the gang war, but there's also Monica, but anyway, there are so many theories that it's head spinning.
Edit: I still think that Vanessa is William's daughter, and that Nick's wife was Leia precisely because of her temperament and for me she would be the only one capable of wanting to manipulate her daughters to separate from their father.
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I am pretty certain Ayua is William and Miru's daughter, I don't think there's any hidden twist, there are plenty of plot twists to cover already. As much as I like theories, we're basing them all off the characters we've seen, and there will be more characters. We will see Elena Petrova at some point (in both games) and we will likely see Donna in SG. Most likely way down the track there will be some interaction with Sonya's parents/brother, and Nia's family will appear. We'll likely see NIka confront Mila's abuser. There's all the basketball teams from the other universities, there's Elsa's circle of people, Bella's racing circle. Melanie has yet to be seen in the presnt day. There will be a lot of characters that will be connected by circumstance rather than related.
Vanessa being William's daughter with Vanessa and Nick believing Vanessa is his daughter is super chad-level fuckery. Entirely possible. But given heterochromia isn't always genetic, Ocean can be throwing in an obvious red herring. Vanessa and Zara's mom can be someone entirely different we haven't seen. Could even have been someone at the bookclub. Leia is a likely choice from the people we know, but there's nothing saying that connection is there. But getting back to patreon issues - if Vanessa is Leia's daughter, Nika can't be related to William. Ocean's not dumb. For NIka to be related to William, the the same situation. Given Ayua keeps wanting Nika's dick pics, and is starting to show more sexy poses - if there is any lewd with Ayua, we basically have confirmation of who Nika's dad ISN'T (In which case William can be the father of all Wollust without any problems). Ocean's not going to play with fire when he was cautious to the point of censored dildos from Season 1 to bring the lewd content down to try for 16+.