They are not bad necessarily. When you break minor vuln before breaking core, you make those girls friends so they arrive earlier to the battle and the event of their friendship gives less EE. When you break core vuln before minor you make them rivals so they arrive to fights later and give more EE for rivalry event. So unless you intentially want to make girls friends (for forsaken bonuses, for example) it's better to make them rivals, thus breaking core vulns first.
That's the thing. You waste a lot of circumstance damage with weak commanders. So you should use a commander without any upgrades and work together with him, also commanders without upgrades can catch multiple girls at once, intead of one by one with upgraded commander.
i see. then for a road map. at which day should i be getting more EE from girls? since while i have 1 girl - all i get is 1 per day. when i get 2nd - i get 2 per day (1 per girl) and same for 3 - till i get strong enough commander to break something. i feel there is a lot of energy lost somewhere.
And at which point commanders are worth deploying?
We had an argument about it several pages back you can read. I personally consider 3EE commander (that is 4 turns single capture) is enough for core T1 break, and sometimes even 2EE is enough and those are worth deploying already. Some want to wait for 5EE (4 turns 2 captures).
I see your problem in using upgraded commanders. Just use normal ones so you can attack girls yourself and apply circumstance damage to all areas instead of 1-2.
We had an argument about it several pages back you can read. I personally consider 3EE commander (that is 4 turns single capture) is enough for core T1 break, and sometimes even 2EE is enough and those are worth deploying already. Some want to wait for 5EE (4 turns 2 captures).
I see your problem in using upgraded commanders. Just use normal ones so you can attack girls yourself and apply circumstance damage to all areas instead of 1-2.
It does, but you can correct that later with further breaks. Breaks go in pairs. So if a girl has 2 minor vulns, she's connected with both other girls by them. And will get friendly with each when you break their corresponding cores. But she also has a core that can mitigate one minor break.
This game leaves me with a couple of questions due to how the menu is set up unclearly.
1. What's the difference between "single play" and "campaign"? The expected is for a campaign to some kind of sequence of single plays together. But instead the relation seems to be "pre-set" and "pre-set plus your own characters in the random mix"
2. Is there someway to play with exactly the characters you select?
3. Is there a way to give pre-made characters a portrait? I can do this once in the game, but can it be done prior to the game so you don't have to do it everytime again?
4. "Customize" is just a different way to generate the 3 characters, right?
5. What does the "import" button on the main screen import exactly?
It does, but you can correct that later with further breaks. Breaks go in pairs. So if a girl has 2 minor vulns, she's connected with both other girls by them. And will get friendly with each when you break their corresponding cores. But she also has a core that can mitigate one minor break.
Hmm strange, I remeber campaigns started without any prebreaks, but that was back in 33 version, maybe smth changed in new release.
Showing their corruption lvls give little info, better show their strenghts and weaknesses if you want some advice. Also, thing little talked about is breaking their vulnerabilities making them more vulnerable to corresponding dmg type. So you may want to break some vulns before others not only for EE, but for making further breaking easier. Like Hate and Inju is very important for raising lvls, so breaking those cores earlier is good for making those girls easier to work with.
Oh when I mean that I more less in a similar vein of using a specialty commander, although they have a lot more nuance and utility than a specialty commander.
Imo, the best way to use forsaken and have a plan for training or using them well is to contextualize what you want them to do and what they can do to make your work easier, which is just a fancy way of saying to give them a sort general purpose or "role" for them to do.
So let's apply this to your earlier problem of raising punisher % for hypnosis quickly.
"What kind of tactics do I know so far for doing this well?"
-We know higher pleasure will give higher % for fantasize so we should have a forsaken that can do that well, picking a good candidate and corrupting best to suit that role, maybe distorting them with Negotiation or Temptation for a Pleasure bonus would be good.
-Another good tactic is an orgy, which we can use a forsaken for that also, either using high damage output, or using an aversion distorted forsaken with her unique defiler to cause a orgy easier (albeit weaker)
So now you have you have potentially two different routes you can train a forsaken, with the main objective of their role to farm fantasize %.
-Find a good candidate
-corrupt them to do the role as best as they can
-train them to the level that we need to do the role properly
Doing so and following either of those tactics will not only do what you're asking for, but you will also have:
-A forsaken that deals extreme pleasure damage
OR
-A forsaken that helps you do orgies easier and more efficiently
Either way you have a forsaken that can help you with not only this problem, but potentially more now that they're all trained up. Combined with my earlier post about using the respective punisher for raising punisher % you can apply a lot of that logic to a forsaken made for that sort of role, with the trade-offs and benefits that come with it
Tl;dr: Try to think of a role for your forsaken to do and make your campaign easier. Once you do, corrupt them for that role and train them to do that role as best as they can. And have a good pool of forsaken that allows you the utility to try something else if a specific tactic or plan you tried isn't working out.
Sorry that its a bit long but hopefully it helps more than it confuses
Thanks! I feel like this was super helpful!
I'll see what I can do.
Is there a way to see the special abilities of distorted chosen? I couldn't find anything on the Traumatize one you get from negotiation and it took me a while to realize those were special to distorted chosen, and I didn't see anything about it in the guide.
Showing their corruption lvls give little info, better show their strenghts and weaknesses if you want some advice. Also, thing little talked about is breaking their vulnerabilities making them more vulnerable to corresponding dmg type. So you may want to break some vulns before others not only for EE, but for making further breaking easier. Like Hate and Inju is very important for raising lvls, so breaking those cores earlier is good for making those girls easier to work with.
sitting at turn start of turn 13 with 10 EE in hand and ability to make 4/2 commander and 140/200 timers. only break i managed so far is Moppet's hate break which is significant so i am not sure if it affects relations
I really...REALLY like this well put explanation regarding the Forsaken and hope it helps others as I could not of put it better myself. This almost reads like an official and objective document concerning the Forsaken. Well done.
Okay, I messed around by cheating in a forsaken just to test training towards one I'm looking for so I get a better idea on how to approach it. I gave it the aversion distortion, however I don't see it's special ability for being distorted anywhere on it. Not sure what's up with that or how to get that.
Okay, I messed around by cheating in a forsaken just to test training towards one I'm looking for so I get a better idea on how to approach it. I gave it the aversion distortion, however I don't see it's special ability for being distorted anywhere on it. Not sure what's up with that or how to get that.
The game folder has a file named 'training guide.txt', it has the details on a lot of the Forsaken stuff.
training guide.txt said:
==Distortion-Specific Tips
-Temptation Forsaken are unique in that most of their bonuses go away if they're brought to 40% or higher Obedience. It isn't currently possible to lower an existing Forsaken's Obedience, so it's generally wise to avoid raising Temptation Forsaken above this threshold. However, even if they're brought to 40% or higher Obedience, Temptation Forsaken can still learn the Tempt Defiler by being trained with Instill Fixation or Grand Concert.
-Aversion Forsaken will never have their Hostility, Deviancy, or Obedience increased by training actions to which they've consented. This is generally a good thing, because their Hostility and Obedience already start high, and because the benefits of low Deviancy are strong. They also ignore the usual corruption requirements for Punisher Positions.
-Negotiation Forsaken suffer none of the drawbacks of high Obedience, but they benefit more from low Hostility than other types of Forsaken. They use the usual formula for how much Stamina they regenerate per day, except that they use the lower of their Hostility and their Obedience in that formula. Other Forsaken who care about them will not be angry over the harshness of their training, even if their Obedience is brought very high.
-Rampancy Forsaken lose 5% Motivation per day spent idle, but their deployment Motivation cost is decreased by 30%. This will almost always result in a negative Motivation cost, meaning that they actually gain Motivation from being deployed (and thus gain twice as much Motivation from being deployed against a loved one). They can be deployed for any amount of Evil Energy, but any extra Reputation Strength they'd gain from an expensive deployment is cut in half, and any Reputation Strength they'd lose from a cheaper deployment is doubled. A green Reputation Strength display means that you aren't taking very much of a penalty, while a red one means that the penalty has grown large. Rampant Forsaken Punisher effects depend on the Reputation Strength for the current deployment.
Moppet is your best girl in terms of ease of use, but she also has 2 minor vilns, which could be easily broken unintentionally. So I would focus on breaking Despair's core firstt - she has decent Hate vilnerability for that, just be careful not to break it. But even if you do break T1 not a big deal. Usually I go for a girl with 2 cores first, but yours is pretty bad with so much resistance to both Hate and Inju. You can still try her, since you have 2 capture commander already.
General tactics for that is smth like attack Prophet and check if you can up both Inju anh Hate to lvl 1 with an opening capture. If you cant, get Inj and Plea and work on Hate later. When next girl comes, capture her with commander and attack Expo, they both have decent vuln to it and poke Prophet to increase some opening lvls, then catch her again before extermination is complete and start working on Hate and Inju, then Plea and maybe even some Expo if you can squeese it in. While she is surrounded prepare another girl for capture to prolong fight, even one turn surround is enough. Then capture her 3rd time and she should be set for at least one core break, maybe 2.
Contemplative Yearning
Large collection of stable diffusion generated portraits
Full conversion, more complete than regular game
No duplicates, includes civilian images (not forsaken) 48 portrait set Details
I consider the above a MUST HAVE portrait packs due to the amount of quality it adds to the base game.
So uh.. started a new thing and tried following the guide from the start. Holy shit that was WAY more effective than I expected.
Side note, what's the difference between campaign and single play?
